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# YouTube Video
- Title: Pieter Levels: Programming, Viral AI Startups, and Digital Nomad Life | Lex Fridman Podcast #440
- Channel: Lex Fridman
- Published at: 2024-08-20T19:28:23Z
Pieter Levels (aka levelsio on X) is a self-taught developer and entrepreneur who has designed, programmed, launched over 40 startups, many of which are highly successful.
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Transcript:
https://lexfridman.com/pieter-levels-transcript
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EPISODE LINKS:
Pieter's X: https://x.com/levelsio
Pieter's Techno Optimist Shop: https://levelsio.com/
Indie Maker Handbook: https://readmake.com/
Nomad List: https://nomadlist.com
Remote OK: https://remoteok.com
Hoodmaps: https://hoodmaps.com
SPONSORS:
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OUTLINE:
0:00 - Introduction
2:03 - Startup philosophy
9:34 - Low points
13:03 - 12 startups in 12 months
19:55 - Traveling and depression
32:34 - Indie hacking
36:37 - Photo AI
1:12:53 - How to learn AI
1:21:30 - Robots
1:29:47 - Hoodmaps
1:53:52 - Learning new programming languages
2:03:24 - Monetize your website
2:09:59 - Fighting SPAM
2:13:33 - Automation
2:24:58 - When to sell startup
2:27:52 - Coding solo
2:33:54 - Ship fast
2:42:38 - Best IDE for programming
2:52:09 - Andrej Karpathy
3:01:34 - Productivity
3:15:21 - Minimalism
3:24:07 - Emails
3:31:20 - Coffee
3:39:05 - E/acc
3:41:21 - Advice for young people
PODCAST LINKS:
SOCIAL LINKS:
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so I was trying to figure out how to do
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photo realistic AI photos and it was
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stabil diffusion by itself is not doing
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that well like the faces look all
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mangled y um and it doesn't have enough
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resolution or something to to do that
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well so but I started seeing these these
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um base models These Fine tun models and
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people were training on porn and I would
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try them and they would be very
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photorealistic they would have bodies
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that actually made sense like body uh
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Anatomy um but if you look at the
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photorealistic models that people use
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now still there's still core porn there
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like of naked people so I need to prompt
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out the nak and everybody needs to do
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this with AI startups with imaging you
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need to prompt out the naked stuff you
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have to keep reminding the model you
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need to put clothes on yeah don't put
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naked because it's very risky I have
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Google Vision that checks every photo
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before it's shown to the user to like
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check detor oh nfw detector because you
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get the journalists get very
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angry the following is a conversation
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with Peter levels also known on X as
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levels IO he is a self-taught developer
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and entrepreneur who designed programmed
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shipped and ran over 40 startups many of
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which are hugely successful in most
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cases he did it all by himself while
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living the digital Nomad life in over 40
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countries and over 150 cities
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programming on a laptop while chilling
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on a couch using vanilla HTML jQuery PHP
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and SQL light he builds and ships
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quickly and improves on the fly all in
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the open documenting his work both his
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successes and failures with a raw
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honesty of a true Indie hacker Peter is
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an inspiration to a huge number of
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developers and entrepreneurs who love
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creating cool things in the world that
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are hopefully useful for people this was
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an honor and a pleasure for me this is
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Alex Freedman podcast to support it
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please check out our sponsors in the
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description and now dear friends here's
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Peter
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levels you've launched a lot of
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companies and built a lot of products as
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you say most failed but some succeeded
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what's your philosophy behind building
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the startups that you did I think my
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philosophy is very different than most
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people in startups because most people
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in startups they they build a company
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and they raise money right and they hire
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people and then they build a product and
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they find something that makes money and
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I don't really raise money I don't use
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VC funding I do everything myself I'm
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designer I'm the developer I make
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everything I make the logo so for me I'm
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much more Scrappy and and because I
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don't have funding like I need to I need
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to go fast I need to make things fast uh
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to see if an ID works right I have an
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IDE in my mind and I build it build it
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like a mro mini startup um and I launch
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it very quickly like within you know two
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weeks or something of building it and I
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check if there's demand if people
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actually sign up and not just sign up
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but if people actually pay money right
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like they need to take out their credit
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cards pay me money and then I can can
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see if the idea is validated and most
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ideas don't work like as you say most
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feel so there's this rapid iterative
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phase where you just build a prototype
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that works launch it yeah see if people
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like it improving it really really
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quickly to see if people like it a
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little bit more enough to pay and all
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that that that whole rapid process is
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how you think of I think it's it's like
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it's very rapid and it's like um if I
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compare to for example Google you know
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like our big tech companies especially
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Google right now is kind of struggling
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like they made like Transformers they
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made all they invented all the AI stuff
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years ago and they never really shipped
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like they could have shipped jet gbt for
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example I think I heard in 2019 and they
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never shipped it because they were so
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stuck in bureaucracy but they had
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everything they had the data they had
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the tech they had the engineers and they
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could Didn't Do It um and it's because
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these big organizations it's it it can
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make you very slow so being alone by
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myself on my laptop like you know in my
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underwear in a hotel room or something I
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can ship very fast and I don't need to
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like I don't need to ask like legal for
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like oh can you vouch for this you know
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I can just go and ship you always code
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in your underwear the your profile
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picture you're like slouching a couch
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and your underwear chilling a laptop no
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no but it's I do wear like shorts a lot
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and I I usually just wear shorts and no
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T-shirt cuz I'm always too hot like I'm
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always overheating thank you for showing
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up not just in your underwear but
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wearing shorts I know you know I still
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wearing this for you but thank you um
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thank you for dressing up I think it's
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cuz I since I go to the gym I'm always
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too hot what's your favorite EX in the
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gym man over press over press like like
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shoulder press yeah okay but it feels
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good cuz you're doing like you do you
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win cuz when you what is it I do 60
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kilos so it's like 120 lbs or something
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like it's it's it's my only thing I can
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do well you know in the gym and you
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stand like this and you're like I did it
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you know like a winner pose yeah Victory
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pose uh I do bench press squads
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deadlift hence the uh the mug yeah
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talking to my therapist it's a deadlift
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yeah because it acts like therapy for me
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you know yeah yeah it is which is
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controversial to say like if I say this
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on Twitter people get angry physical
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hardship is a kind of therapy yeah I
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just rewatched uh Happy People year in
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the tiger that Warner Herzog film where
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they
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document people that are doing trapping
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they're essentially just working for
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survival in the wilderness year round
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yeah and there's a deep happiness to
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their way of life because they're so
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busy in it in nature yeah 100% like
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there's something about that physical
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physical yeah toil yeah my dad taught me
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that my dad always do does like
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Construction in the house like he's
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always re renovating the house he breaks
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through one room and then he goes to the
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next room and he's just going in a
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circle around the house for like the
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last 40 years so but so he's always
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doing construction the house and it's
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his Hobby and he like he taught me when
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when I'm depressed or something um he
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says like get a big like what do you
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call like a big uh mountain of sand or
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something from construction just get a
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shovel and uh bring it to the other side
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and just you know do like physical labor
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do like hard work and do something like
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get set a goal do something and I I kind
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of did that with startups too yeah
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construction is not about the
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destination man it's about the journey
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yeah yeah sometimes I wonder people who
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are always remodeling their house is it
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really about the remodeling or is it's
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not is it about the project Journey the
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puzzle of it no he doesn't care about
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the results well he shows me he's like
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it's amazing I'm like yeah it's amazing
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but um then he wants to go to the next
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room you know but I think it's very
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metaphorical for work cuz I also I never
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stop work I go to the next website or I
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make a new one right or I make a new
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startup so I'm always like like give you
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something to wake up in the morning and
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like you know have coffee and then uh
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kiss your girlfriend and then you have
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like a goal not today I'm going to fix
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this feature or today I'm going to fix
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this bog or something I'm going to do
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something you have something to wake up
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to you know and I think um maybe
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especially as a man also women but you
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need you need a hard work you know you
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need like an Endeavor I think how much
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of the building that you do is about
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money how much is it about just a deep
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internal happiness it's about fun cuz I
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was cuz I was doing it when I didn't
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make money right that's the point so I
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was always coding I was always I was
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making music I made electronic music
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drama based music like 20 years ago and
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I was always making stuff so I think a
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creative expression is like a meaningful
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work that's so important it's so fun
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it's so fun to have like a daily
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challenge where you try figure stuff out
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but but the interesting thing is you
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built a lot of successful products and
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you never really wanted to take it to
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that level where you scale real big
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andell it to aan something like this
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yeah the problem is I don't dictate that
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right like if more people start using IF
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Millions people s start using it and it
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becomes big um I'm not going to say oh
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stop signing up to my website and pay me
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money but I never raised funding for it
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and I think because I don't like this
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the stressful life that comes with it
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like I have a lot of um founder friends
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and they tell me secretly like with
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hundreds of millions of dollars in
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funding and stuff and they they tell me
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like next time if I'm going to do it I'm
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going to do it like you
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because it's more it's more fun it's
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more Indie it's more chill it's more
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creative they don't like this they don't
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like to be manager right you become like
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a CEO you become a manager and um I
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think a lot of people that start
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startups when they become a CEO they
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don't like that job actually but they
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can't really exit it you know but they
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like to do the ground work the coding so
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I think that keeps you happy like doing
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something creative yeah it's interesting
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how people are pulled towards that to
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scale to go really big and you don't
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have that honest reflection with
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yourself like what actually makes you
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happy because for a lot of great
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Engineers what makes them happy is the
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building the the quote unquote
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individual contributor like where you're
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actually still coding or you're actually
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still building and they let go of that
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and then they become unhappy um but some
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of that is the sacrifice needed to have
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a impact of scale if you truly believe
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in a thing you're doing but like look at
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Elon he's doing things million times
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bigger than me right and
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um would I want to do that I don't know
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you can really choose these things right
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but I really respect that I think elon's
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very different from VC Founders right VC
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start it's like software there's a lot
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of bullshit in this world I think
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there's a lot of like dodgy Finance
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stuff happening there I think um and I
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never have like concrete evidence about
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it but your gut tells you something's
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going on with like companies getting
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sold to friends and VCS and then they do
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reciprocity and this Shady Financial
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dealings with Elon does not he's just
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raising money from investors and he's
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actually building stuff with he needs
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the money to build stuff you know hard
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Hardware stuff um and that I really
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respect you said that there's been a few
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low points in your life you've been
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depressed and the building is one of the
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ways you you get out of that but can you
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talk to that can you take me to that
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place to that time when you were in at a
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low point so I was in Holland and I
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graduated University and I didn't want
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to like get a normal job and I was
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making some money with YouTube because I
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had this music career and I uploaded my
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music to YouTube and YouTube started
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paying me like uh with AdSense like
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$22,000 a month $2,000 up and all my
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friends got like normal jobs and we
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stopped hanging out cuz people would
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like in University hang out you know you
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chill each other's houses uh you go
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party but when people get jobs they only
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party like in the weekend and they don't
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hang anymore in the week because you
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need to be at the office and I was like
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this is not for me I want to do
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something else and I was starting
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getting this like I think it's like
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Saturn return this you know when you're
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turn 27 it's like some concept where
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Saturn returns to the same place in the
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orbit that it was when you're born I'm
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learning some it's some astrology thing
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you know so many truly special artists
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died when they were 27 exactly sum of 27
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man and it was for me like I started
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going crazy because I didn't really see
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like my future in Holland buying a house
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going living in the suburbs and stuff so
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it flew out I went to Asia started
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digital nomading and did that for a year
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and then that made me feel even worse
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you know CU I was like Alone um in hotel
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rooms like looking at the ceiling like
00:10:54 --> 00:10:57
what am I doing with my life like this
00:10:56 --> 00:11:00
is uh like I was working on startups and
00:10:58 --> 00:11:03
stuff and YouTube but it's like what is
00:11:00 --> 00:11:04
the future here you know like uh is this
00:11:03 --> 00:11:06
is this something while my friends in
00:11:05 --> 00:11:09
Holland were doing really well and with
00:11:06 --> 00:11:10
a normal life you know um so it was
00:11:09 --> 00:11:12
getting very depressed and like I'm like
00:11:11 --> 00:11:14
an outcast you know and my money was was
00:11:13 --> 00:11:16
shrinking I wasn't making money anymore
00:11:14 --> 00:11:18
lot making $500 a month or something and
00:11:17 --> 00:11:21
I was you know looking at the ceiling
00:11:19 --> 00:11:22
thinking like now I'm like 27 I'm a
00:11:21 --> 00:11:24
loser and that's the moment when I
00:11:23 --> 00:11:26
started building like startups and it
00:11:25 --> 00:11:28
was because my dad said like if you're
00:11:26 --> 00:11:29
depressed you need to you know get sand
00:11:28 --> 00:11:32
get a shovel start shoveling doing
00:11:30 --> 00:11:34
something you can't just sit still which
00:11:32 --> 00:11:34
is kind of like a interesting way to
00:11:34 --> 00:11:36
deal with depression you know like it's
00:11:35 --> 00:11:39
not like oh let's talk about it it's
00:11:36 --> 00:11:41
more like let's go do something and um
00:11:40 --> 00:11:44
and I started doing a project called 12
00:11:42 --> 00:11:46
startups in 12 months where every month
00:11:44 --> 00:11:48
I would make something like a project
00:11:46 --> 00:11:49
and I would launch it with stripe so
00:11:48 --> 00:11:52
people could pay for it so the basic
00:11:49 --> 00:11:53
format is try to build a thing put it
00:11:52 --> 00:11:55
online and put stripe to where you can
00:11:54 --> 00:11:56
pay money for it yeah add a stripe check
00:11:56 --> 00:11:58
I'm not sponsored by stripe but add a
00:11:57 --> 00:12:00
stripe checkout button is that still
00:11:59 --> 00:12:03
like the the easiest way to just like
00:12:00 --> 00:12:03
pay for stuff stripe 100% like I think
00:12:03 --> 00:12:06
so yeah it's a cool company they just
00:12:04 --> 00:12:07
made it so easy you can just click and
00:12:06 --> 00:12:09
yeah and they're really nice like the
00:12:08 --> 00:12:11
CEO Patrick is really nice behind the
00:12:10 --> 00:12:13
scenes it must be difficult to like
00:12:11 --> 00:12:14
actually make that happen cuz that used
00:12:13 --> 00:12:17
to be a huge problem like just Merchant
00:12:15 --> 00:12:20
just just adding a thing a button where
00:12:18 --> 00:12:22
you can like pay for a thing dude it's
00:12:20 --> 00:12:25
dude I know this because when I was when
00:12:22 --> 00:12:27
I 9 years old I was making websites also
00:12:26 --> 00:12:29
and I tried to open a merchant account
00:12:28 --> 00:12:31
there was like before tribe you would
00:12:29 --> 00:12:33
have like um I think it was called World
00:12:32 --> 00:12:36
pay so I had to like fill out all these
00:12:34 --> 00:12:39
forms and then I had to F them to
00:12:36 --> 00:12:41
America from Holland with my dad's facts
00:12:40 --> 00:12:43
um and my dad had to it wasn't my dad's
00:12:42 --> 00:12:44
name and he to sign for this and he
00:12:43 --> 00:12:45
started reading these terms and
00:12:44 --> 00:12:47
conditions which was like he's liable
00:12:45 --> 00:12:49
for like 100 million in Damages and he's
00:12:48 --> 00:12:50
like I don't want to sign this I'm like
00:12:49 --> 00:12:51
Dad come on I need a merchant account I
00:12:51 --> 00:12:54
need to make money on the internet you
00:12:52 --> 00:12:55
know and he signed it and we sent we fax
00:12:54 --> 00:12:57
it to America and I had a merchant
00:12:55 --> 00:12:57
account but then never nobody paid for
00:12:57 --> 00:12:59
anything so that was the problem you
00:12:58 --> 00:13:02
know yeah but it's much easier now you
00:13:00 --> 00:13:05
can sign up you add some codes and um
00:13:03 --> 00:13:08
yeah so 12 startups in 12 months yeah so
00:13:06 --> 00:13:11
what how do you what startup number one
00:13:09 --> 00:13:13
what what was that what like what what
00:13:11 --> 00:13:14
were you feeling what were you sitting
00:13:13 --> 00:13:17
behind the computer like how much do you
00:13:14 --> 00:13:18
actually know about building stuff at
00:13:17 --> 00:13:19
that point I could I could code a little
00:13:19 --> 00:13:22
bit because I did the YouTube channel
00:13:20 --> 00:13:23
and I made a website for I would make
00:13:22 --> 00:13:25
websit for like the YouTube channel it
00:13:24 --> 00:13:27
was called panda mix show and it was
00:13:26 --> 00:13:29
like these electronic music mixes like
00:13:27 --> 00:13:30
dubstep or dral base or Tech in our
00:13:29 --> 00:13:33
house I saw one of them had like flash
00:13:31 --> 00:13:35
were you using flash yeah my album my CD
00:13:33 --> 00:13:37
album was using flash yeah yeah I sold
00:13:35 --> 00:13:39
my CD yeah kids flash was Flash was
00:13:38 --> 00:13:42
software this is like the the break like
00:13:40 --> 00:13:44
Grandpa you know but flash was cool yeah
00:13:42 --> 00:13:45
and there was what's it called boy I
00:13:44 --> 00:13:46
should remember this action script
00:13:45 --> 00:13:48
there's some kind of programming
00:13:46 --> 00:13:49
language scpt yeah yeah script in flash
00:13:49 --> 00:13:52
back then that was the JavaScript you
00:13:50 --> 00:13:53
know the JavaScript yeah and I I thought
00:13:52 --> 00:13:54
that's going to that's supposed to be
00:13:54 --> 00:13:57
the dynamic thing that takes over the
00:13:55 --> 00:13:59
internet I invested so many hours in
00:13:57 --> 00:14:01
learning Steve Jobs killer Steve Job
00:13:59 --> 00:14:03
said flesh sucks stop using it every was
00:14:01 --> 00:14:05
like okay that guy was right though
00:14:03 --> 00:14:07
right yeah I I don't know yeah well it
00:14:05 --> 00:14:09
was it was a closed platform I think and
00:14:08 --> 00:14:11
Clos but it's ironic cuz Apple you know
00:14:10 --> 00:14:13
they're not very open right but back
00:14:11 --> 00:14:14
then Steve was like this is closed we
00:14:13 --> 00:14:16
should not use it and it's as security
00:14:15 --> 00:14:18
problems I think which sounded like a
00:14:17 --> 00:14:21
copout like I just wanted to say that to
00:14:19 --> 00:14:23
make it look kind of bad um but flash
00:14:21 --> 00:14:25
was cool yeah yeah it was cool for a
00:14:23 --> 00:14:28
time yeah H listen animated gifts were
00:14:26 --> 00:14:30
cool for a time too yeah they came back
00:14:28 --> 00:14:32
in a different way yeah as a meme though
00:14:30 --> 00:14:36
I mean like I I remember when gifts were
00:14:33 --> 00:14:38
actually cool not ironically cool like
00:14:37 --> 00:14:40
there's like on the internet you would
00:14:38 --> 00:14:41
have like a Dancing Rabbit or something
00:14:41 --> 00:14:43
like this and that was really exciting
00:14:42 --> 00:14:45
no you had like the you know Lex
00:14:43 --> 00:14:47
homepage you Le everything was centered
00:14:46 --> 00:14:50
yeah and you had like Peter's homepage
00:14:48 --> 00:14:53
and then the on construction yeah GIF
00:14:50 --> 00:14:56
which was like a guy like with a helmet
00:14:53 --> 00:14:58
and the lights banners uh yeah that's
00:14:57 --> 00:15:00
how before like Google AdSense you would
00:14:58 --> 00:15:02
have like banners for advertising it was
00:15:00 --> 00:15:05
amazing yeah and and a lot of links to
00:15:02 --> 00:15:06
porn I think yeah where the Merion
00:15:06 --> 00:15:08
accounts people would use for people
00:15:07 --> 00:15:11
would make money a lot only money made
00:15:09 --> 00:15:14
on internet was like porn or a lot of it
00:15:12 --> 00:15:15
yeah it was it was a dark place it's
00:15:14 --> 00:15:18
still a dark place yeah and but there's
00:15:16 --> 00:15:21
Beauty in the darkness anyway so you
00:15:18 --> 00:15:22
were uh you did some basic HTML yeah
00:15:21 --> 00:15:24
yeah but I had to learn the actual like
00:15:22 --> 00:15:26
coding so I uh this was good it was a
00:15:25 --> 00:15:29
good good idea to like every monom lunch
00:15:26 --> 00:15:30
a startup so I could uh learn to code
00:15:29 --> 00:15:32
learn basic stuff and but it was still
00:15:31 --> 00:15:34
very Scrappy because I didn't have time
00:15:33 --> 00:15:36
to which was on purpose like didn't have
00:15:34 --> 00:15:37
time to spend a lot of um I had a month
00:15:36 --> 00:15:38
to do something so I couldn't spend more
00:15:37 --> 00:15:40
than a month and I was pretty strict
00:15:39 --> 00:15:43
about that um and I published it as a
00:15:41 --> 00:15:44
blog post so people I think I put it on
00:15:43 --> 00:15:45
Hacker News and people would check like
00:15:45 --> 00:15:47
kind of like oh did you actually you
00:15:46 --> 00:15:49
know I felt like accountability because
00:15:47 --> 00:15:50
I put it public that I actually had to
00:15:49 --> 00:15:53
do it do you remember the first one you
00:15:51 --> 00:15:56
did I think it was playing my inbox cuz
00:15:54 --> 00:15:59
back then my friends we would send we
00:15:56 --> 00:16:00
would send like cool was before Spotify
00:15:59 --> 00:16:03
we would send like uh 2014 we would send
00:16:01 --> 00:16:04
music to each other like YouTube links
00:16:04 --> 00:16:06
uh like this is a cool song this is a
00:16:05 --> 00:16:09
cool song and it was the these giant
00:16:06 --> 00:16:10
email trads on Gmail and they were like
00:16:09 --> 00:16:13
unnavigable so I made an app that would
00:16:11 --> 00:16:16
log into your Gmail get them emails and
00:16:14 --> 00:16:18
find ons of YouTube links and then make
00:16:16 --> 00:16:20
like kind like a gallery of your your
00:16:18 --> 00:16:22
songs like essentially Spotify and my
00:16:20 --> 00:16:24
friends loved it was it scraping it like
00:16:23 --> 00:16:27
what was no it uses like poop like pop
00:16:25 --> 00:16:28
or IMAP you know it would actually check
00:16:27 --> 00:16:30
your email so that like privacy concerns
00:16:29 --> 00:16:31
because it would get all your emails to
00:16:30 --> 00:16:34
find YouTube links but then I would I
00:16:32 --> 00:16:37
wouldn't save anything um but that was
00:16:35 --> 00:16:38
fun it was like and that that first
00:16:37 --> 00:16:41
project already would get like pressed
00:16:39 --> 00:16:43
like it went on think like um some tech
00:16:42 --> 00:16:44
media and stuff and I was like that's
00:16:43 --> 00:16:47
cool like it didn't make money there was
00:16:44 --> 00:16:49
no payment button but it was uh it was
00:16:48 --> 00:16:51
actually people using it I think tens of
00:16:50 --> 00:16:53
thousands of people used it that's a
00:16:51 --> 00:16:54
great idea I wonder why like why why
00:16:54 --> 00:16:58
don't we have that why don't we have
00:16:55 --> 00:17:01
things that access Gmail and extract
00:16:59 --> 00:17:03
some useful aggregate information yeah
00:17:01 --> 00:17:04
you could tell GMA like don't give me
00:17:03 --> 00:17:05
all emails just give me the ones with
00:17:05 --> 00:17:07
YouTube links you know or something like
00:17:06 --> 00:17:09
that yeah I mean there is a whole
00:17:07 --> 00:17:11
ecosystem of like apps you can build on
00:17:09 --> 00:17:15
top of the Google but people don't never
00:17:12 --> 00:17:18
do this I've seen a few like Boomerang
00:17:16 --> 00:17:20
there's a few apps that are like good
00:17:18 --> 00:17:21
but just I wonder what maybe it's not
00:17:20 --> 00:17:22
easy to make money I think it's hard to
00:17:22 --> 00:17:24
get people to pay for these like
00:17:23 --> 00:17:26
extensions and plugins you know cuz it's
00:17:25 --> 00:17:28
not like a real app so it's not like
00:17:27 --> 00:17:30
people don't value it people value oh
00:17:29 --> 00:17:32
this a plugin should be free you know
00:17:30 --> 00:17:32
when I want to use a plugin in Google
00:17:32 --> 00:17:35
Sheets or something I'm not going to pay
00:17:33 --> 00:17:36
for it like it should be free which is
00:17:35 --> 00:17:38
but if you go to a website and you
00:17:37 --> 00:17:39
actually okay I need this product I'm G
00:17:38 --> 00:17:40
to pay for this because it's a real
00:17:40 --> 00:17:44
product so even though it's the same
00:17:41 --> 00:17:45
code in the back it's a plugin you know
00:17:44 --> 00:17:47
yeah I mean you can do it through like
00:17:46 --> 00:17:49
extensions like Chrome extensions
00:17:48 --> 00:17:50
through from the browser side yeah but
00:17:49 --> 00:17:52
who pays for Chrome extensions right
00:17:50 --> 00:17:54
like barely anybody so nobody uh that's
00:17:53 --> 00:17:56
not a good place to make money probably
00:17:54 --> 00:17:56
yeah that sucks like chromic extension
00:17:56 --> 00:17:59
should be a extension for your startup
00:17:57 --> 00:18:01
you know you have a product yeah oh we
00:17:59 --> 00:18:03
also have a Chrome extension you know I
00:18:02 --> 00:18:06
wish the Chrome extension would be the
00:18:04 --> 00:18:07
product I wish Chrome would support that
00:18:06 --> 00:18:10
like where you could pay for it easily
00:18:08 --> 00:18:11
cuz like imagine I can imagine a lot of
00:18:10 --> 00:18:13
products that would just live as
00:18:12 --> 00:18:17
extensions like improvements for social
00:18:14 --> 00:18:18
media like it's like gpts you know gpts
00:18:17 --> 00:18:19
yeah like these CH gpts they they going
00:18:19 --> 00:18:22
to charge money for it now and you get a
00:18:20 --> 00:18:24
ref ref share I think from an open AI I
00:18:22 --> 00:18:25
made a lot of them also why we'll we'll
00:18:24 --> 00:18:28
talk about it so let's rewind back it's
00:18:26 --> 00:18:30
a pretty cool idea to do 12 startup in
00:18:29 --> 00:18:34
12 months what what's it take to build a
00:18:31 --> 00:18:35
thing in in in 30 days like at that time
00:18:34 --> 00:18:37
how hard was
00:18:36 --> 00:18:39
that I think the hard part is like
00:18:38 --> 00:18:40
figuring out what you shouldn't add
00:18:39 --> 00:18:42
right what you shouldn't build because
00:18:41 --> 00:18:45
you don't have time so you need to build
00:18:43 --> 00:18:47
a landing page well you need to make the
00:18:45 --> 00:18:47
you know you need to build the product
00:18:47 --> 00:18:50
actually because it need to be something
00:18:48 --> 00:18:52
they pay for um do you need to build a
00:18:50 --> 00:18:53
login system like maybe no you know like
00:18:52 --> 00:18:56
maybe you can build some Scrappy login
00:18:54 --> 00:18:59
system like for fot you sign up you pay
00:18:56 --> 00:18:59
strap checkout and you get a login link
00:18:59 --> 00:19:01
and when I started it was only a login
00:19:00 --> 00:19:03
link with a hash and that's just a
00:19:01 --> 00:19:04
static link so it's very easy to log in
00:19:03 --> 00:19:06
yeah it's not so safe you know what if
00:19:05 --> 00:19:08
you leak the link and now I have real
00:19:06 --> 00:19:10
Google login but that took like a year
00:19:08 --> 00:19:12
so keeping it very Scrappy is very
00:19:11 --> 00:19:15
important to because you don't have time
00:19:13 --> 00:19:19
you know you need to focus on um what
00:19:15 --> 00:19:21
you can build fast uh so money stripe uh
00:19:19 --> 00:19:23
build a product build a landing page um
00:19:22 --> 00:19:24
you need to think about how are people
00:19:23 --> 00:19:26
going to find this so are you going to
00:19:25 --> 00:19:27
put it on Reddit or something how are
00:19:26 --> 00:19:29
you going to put it on Reddit without
00:19:28 --> 00:19:32
being looked at as a spammer right like
00:19:30 --> 00:19:33
um if you say hey this is my new startup
00:19:32 --> 00:19:36
you should use it no nobody's it gets
00:19:33 --> 00:19:36
deleted you know M um maybe if you find
00:19:36 --> 00:19:39
a problem that a lot of people on Reddit
00:19:37 --> 00:19:40
already have on subreddit you know like
00:19:39 --> 00:19:42
and you solve that problem say sub
00:19:41 --> 00:19:44
people I made this thing that might
00:19:42 --> 00:19:46
solve your problem and maybe it's free
00:19:45 --> 00:19:50
for now you know like uh that could work
00:19:47 --> 00:19:52
you know but you need to be very you
00:19:50 --> 00:19:55
know um narrow it down what you're
00:19:53 --> 00:19:57
building time is limited yeah actually
00:19:55 --> 00:20:00
can we go back to the you laying in a
00:19:58 --> 00:20:04
room feeling like a loser yeah I still
00:20:00 --> 00:20:06
feel like a loser sometimes what's what
00:20:04 --> 00:20:10
can you can you speak to that feeling to
00:20:07 --> 00:20:13
that place of just like feeling like a
00:20:10 --> 00:20:14
loser and cuz I think a lot of people in
00:20:13 --> 00:20:17
this world are laying in a room right
00:20:15 --> 00:20:19
now listening to this and feeling like a
00:20:18 --> 00:20:20
loser okay so I think it's normal if
00:20:19 --> 00:20:23
you're young that you feel like a loser
00:20:20 --> 00:20:24
first of all especially when you're 27
00:20:23 --> 00:20:27
yes yeah especially there's like a peak
00:20:25 --> 00:20:29
yeah yeah think a peak and so I would
00:20:28 --> 00:20:32
not kill yourself it's very important
00:20:29 --> 00:20:33
just get through it you know but uh
00:20:33 --> 00:20:35
because you have nothing you have
00:20:34 --> 00:20:37
probably no money you have no business
00:20:35 --> 00:20:39
you have no job you have you like Jeremy
00:20:38 --> 00:20:41
Peterson said this I saw it somewhere
00:20:40 --> 00:20:41
like the reason people are depressed
00:20:41 --> 00:20:42
because they have nothing they don't
00:20:42 --> 00:20:44
have a girlfriend they don't have a or
00:20:43 --> 00:20:46
boyfriend they don't have a you need
00:20:45 --> 00:20:48
stuff you need like or a family you need
00:20:46 --> 00:20:48
things around you you need to build a
00:20:48 --> 00:20:50
life for yourself if you don't build a
00:20:49 --> 00:20:53
life for yourself you'll be depressed so
00:20:51 --> 00:20:54
if you're alone in Asia in a hostel
00:20:53 --> 00:20:56
looking at the ceiling and you don't
00:20:55 --> 00:20:58
have any money coming in you don't have
00:20:56 --> 00:20:59
a girlfriend you don't of course you're
00:20:58 --> 00:21:00
depressed press is logic but back then
00:21:00 --> 00:21:02
if you're in a moment you think this is
00:21:01 --> 00:21:05
not logic there's something wrong with
00:21:02 --> 00:21:06
me you know yeah um and and also I think
00:21:05 --> 00:21:08
I started going I started getting like
00:21:06 --> 00:21:10
anxiety and I think I started going a
00:21:08 --> 00:21:13
little bit crazy where I think travel
00:21:11 --> 00:21:14
can make you insane and I know this
00:21:13 --> 00:21:16
because I know that there's like digital
00:21:15 --> 00:21:18
Nomad that they kill themselves and I
00:21:16 --> 00:21:18
don't I haven't checked like this the
00:21:18 --> 00:21:22
comparison with like Baseline people
00:21:19 --> 00:21:23
like suicide rate but I have a hunch um
00:21:23 --> 00:21:27
especially in the beginning when it was
00:21:24 --> 00:21:30
a very new thing like 10 years ago that
00:21:27 --> 00:21:32
it can be very ecologically taxing and
00:21:30 --> 00:21:33
you're alone a lot back then when you
00:21:33 --> 00:21:37
travel alone there was no other digital
00:21:34 --> 00:21:38
Nance back then a lot so you're in a
00:21:37 --> 00:21:40
strange culture you look different than
00:21:38 --> 00:21:40
everybody like you're in I was in Asia
00:21:40 --> 00:21:43
like you everybody's really nice in
00:21:41 --> 00:21:45
Thailand but you're not part of the
00:21:44 --> 00:21:48
culture you're traveling around you're
00:21:46 --> 00:21:51
hopping from City to City you don't have
00:21:48 --> 00:21:53
a home anymore MH you feel this rooted
00:21:51 --> 00:21:54
and you're constantly in the outcast in
00:21:54 --> 00:21:57
in that you're different from everybody
00:21:55 --> 00:21:58
else yes exactly but people treat like
00:21:57 --> 00:22:00
Thailand people are so nice but you
00:21:58 --> 00:22:01
still feel like Outcast and and then I
00:22:01 --> 00:22:04
think the the digital n i met then were
00:22:02 --> 00:22:04
all kind of like it was like shady
00:22:04 --> 00:22:07
business you know but they were like
00:22:05 --> 00:22:08
Vigilantes cuz it was a new thing and
00:22:07 --> 00:22:09
like one guy was selling illegal drugs
00:22:09 --> 00:22:12
was American guy was selling illegal
00:22:10 --> 00:22:13
drugs via UPS to Americans you know on
00:22:12 --> 00:22:16
this website they were like a lot of
00:22:13 --> 00:22:17
drop shippers doing Shady stuff um
00:22:17 --> 00:22:19
there's a lot of shady things going on
00:22:18 --> 00:22:20
there and they were they didn't look
00:22:19 --> 00:22:21
like very balanced people they didn't
00:22:21 --> 00:22:24
look like people I wanted to hang with
00:22:22 --> 00:22:25
you know so I also felt Outcast from
00:22:25 --> 00:22:28
other foreigners in Thailand other
00:22:26 --> 00:22:29
digital Nomads and I was like man I made
00:22:28 --> 00:22:30
a big mistake and then I went back to
00:22:30 --> 00:22:33
Holland and then I got even more
00:22:31 --> 00:22:35
depressed you said digital Nomad what is
00:22:33 --> 00:22:37
digital Nomad what is that way of life
00:22:35 --> 00:22:39
what is the philosophy there and the
00:22:37 --> 00:22:40
history of the movement I I struck upon
00:22:39 --> 00:22:41
it on accident because I I was like I'm
00:22:41 --> 00:22:43
going to graduate University and then
00:22:42 --> 00:22:44
I'm going to I need to get out of here
00:22:43 --> 00:22:46
I'll fly to Asia because I've been
00:22:45 --> 00:22:48
before in Asia I studied in Korea in
00:22:47 --> 00:22:50
2009 like study exchange I was like Asia
00:22:48 --> 00:22:51
is easy Thailand's easy I'll just go
00:22:51 --> 00:22:53
there figure things out and it's cheap
00:22:52 --> 00:22:55
it's very cheap changai I would live
00:22:54 --> 00:22:58
like for $150 per month rent for like a
00:22:56 --> 00:22:59
private room pretty good so I struck on
00:22:58 --> 00:23:01
this on next I was like okay there's
00:22:59 --> 00:23:03
other people on laptops working on their
00:23:01 --> 00:23:03
startup or working remotely back then
00:23:03 --> 00:23:08
nobody worked remotely but they worked
00:23:04 --> 00:23:09
on their their businesses right um and
00:23:08 --> 00:23:12
they would you know live in like
00:23:09 --> 00:23:13
Colombia or uh Thailand or Vietnam or
00:23:12 --> 00:23:16
Bali they would live kind of like a more
00:23:14 --> 00:23:18
cheap places and it looked like a very
00:23:17 --> 00:23:20
adventurous life like you travel around
00:23:19 --> 00:23:22
you build your business there's no
00:23:21 --> 00:23:24
pressure from like your Home Society
00:23:22 --> 00:23:25
right like you're American so you're you
00:23:24 --> 00:23:26
get pressure from American soci telling
00:23:26 --> 00:23:28
you kind of what to do like you need to
00:23:27 --> 00:23:31
buy a house or you need to this stuff I
00:23:28 --> 00:23:31
had this in Holland too and you can get
00:23:31 --> 00:23:33
away from this pressure you can find
00:23:32 --> 00:23:35
kind of feel like you're free you're
00:23:33 --> 00:23:37
kind of there's nobody telling you what
00:23:36 --> 00:23:39
to do but that's also why you start
00:23:38 --> 00:23:41
feeling like you go crazy because you
00:23:39 --> 00:23:44
are you are free you're dis attached
00:23:42 --> 00:23:46
from anything and anybody um you're
00:23:45 --> 00:23:47
disattached from your culture you're
00:23:46 --> 00:23:48
disattached from the culture you're
00:23:47 --> 00:23:51
probably in because you're staying very
00:23:48 --> 00:23:54
short I think France kofka said I'm free
00:23:52 --> 00:23:56
therefore for I'm lost man that's so
00:23:54 --> 00:23:58
true yeah that's exactly the point and
00:23:57 --> 00:24:00
yeah freedom is like it's the definition
00:23:59 --> 00:24:02
of no constraints right like anything is
00:24:00 --> 00:24:03
possible you can go anywhere and
00:24:02 --> 00:24:05
everybody's like oh that must be super
00:24:04 --> 00:24:07
nice you know like Freedom you must be
00:24:06 --> 00:24:09
very happy and it's the opposite like I
00:24:08 --> 00:24:11
don't think that makes you happy I think
00:24:09 --> 00:24:12
constraints probably make you happy and
00:24:11 --> 00:24:15
that's a big lesson I learned
00:24:13 --> 00:24:16
then but what what were they making for
00:24:15 --> 00:24:18
money what what so you're saying they
00:24:16 --> 00:24:19
were doing Shady stuff at that time for
00:24:19 --> 00:24:21
me you know because I was more like a
00:24:20 --> 00:24:24
developer I wanted to make startups kind
00:24:22 --> 00:24:27
of and and it was like um it was like
00:24:25 --> 00:24:30
drugs being shipped to America like diet
00:24:27 --> 00:24:31
pills and stuff like non FDA proofed
00:24:30 --> 00:24:33
stuff you know and they would like there
00:24:32 --> 00:24:34
was no like e they were like they would
00:24:33 --> 00:24:35
would save beers they would laugh about
00:24:35 --> 00:24:38
like all the dodgy shit kind of they're
00:24:36 --> 00:24:39
doing you know ah that part of okay kind
00:24:38 --> 00:24:42
of vibe you know like kind of sleazy
00:24:40 --> 00:24:44
Ecom Vibe I'm not saying all Ecom is SLE
00:24:42 --> 00:24:45
you know but right but you know this
00:24:44 --> 00:24:49
Vibe it could be a Vibe and your your
00:24:46 --> 00:24:50
Vibe was more buol shit that's ethical
00:24:49 --> 00:24:52
you know the guys with sports cars in
00:24:51 --> 00:24:55
Dubai these people you know yes Ecom
00:24:53 --> 00:24:57
like oh bro you got a drop ship and
00:24:55 --> 00:24:58
you'll make 100 million a month like
00:24:57 --> 00:25:01
those people was this shit and I I was
00:24:59 --> 00:25:02
like this is not my people yeah I don't
00:25:02 --> 00:25:05
I mean there's nothing wrong with any of
00:25:03 --> 00:25:07
those individual components judg but but
00:25:05 --> 00:25:09
there's a
00:25:07 --> 00:25:10
foundation that's not quite ethical I
00:25:10 --> 00:25:12
what is that I don't know what that is
00:25:11 --> 00:25:13
but yeah I get you no I like I don't
00:25:12 --> 00:25:15
want to judge it was more I know that
00:25:14 --> 00:25:18
for me it wasn't my world it wasn't my
00:25:16 --> 00:25:19
subculture I want to make cool shit you
00:25:18 --> 00:25:22
know but they also think their cool shit
00:25:20 --> 00:25:24
is cool so you know uh but I wanted to
00:25:22 --> 00:25:25
make like real like startups and that
00:25:24 --> 00:25:27
was my thing I would read Hacker News
00:25:26 --> 00:25:29
you know like why combinator and they
00:25:27 --> 00:25:30
were making cool stuff so I wanted to
00:25:29 --> 00:25:33
make cool stuff I mean that's a pretty
00:25:31 --> 00:25:35
cool way of life just if you romanticize
00:25:33 --> 00:25:37
it for a moment it's very romantic man
00:25:35 --> 00:25:38
it's very it's colorful you know like if
00:25:37 --> 00:25:40
I think about the memories I mean what
00:25:39 --> 00:25:44
are some happy memories just like
00:25:41 --> 00:25:46
working working cafes or working
00:25:44 --> 00:25:50
in just the
00:25:46 --> 00:25:51
freedom that that uh envelops you from
00:25:50 --> 00:25:53
with that that way of life cuz anything
00:25:52 --> 00:25:55
is possible you can just get up was
00:25:53 --> 00:25:56
amazing like we would work like you
00:25:55 --> 00:26:00
would I would make friends and we would
00:25:57 --> 00:26:04
work until you know 6:00 a.m. in Bali
00:26:01 --> 00:26:06
for example with like um with Andre my
00:26:05 --> 00:26:08
best friend who who still my best friend
00:26:07 --> 00:26:09
and we and other friends and we would
00:26:08 --> 00:26:11
work until like the morning when the sun
00:26:09 --> 00:26:12
came up because at night the co-working
00:26:11 --> 00:26:16
space was silent you know there was
00:26:13 --> 00:26:18
nobody else and I would wake up like 6
00:26:17 --> 00:26:20
p.m. or 5:00 p.m. I would drive to the
00:26:18 --> 00:26:23
cing space on a motorbike I would buy
00:26:21 --> 00:26:27
like uh 30 hot lattes from a cafe how
00:26:24 --> 00:26:28
many 30 cuz there was like there was
00:26:27 --> 00:26:30
like six people coming or we didn't know
00:26:29 --> 00:26:31
sometimes people would come in and did
00:26:30 --> 00:26:33
you say
00:26:31 --> 00:26:35
3030 yeah nice and we would drink like
00:26:34 --> 00:26:37
four per person or something you know
00:26:36 --> 00:26:38
uhhuh man it's B I don't know if they
00:26:37 --> 00:26:40
were powerful lattes you know but they
00:26:39 --> 00:26:42
were lattes and um we would put in
00:26:41 --> 00:26:44
plastic bag and I would drive there and
00:26:42 --> 00:26:45
all the coffee was like falling you know
00:26:44 --> 00:26:47
everywhere and then we'd go into course
00:26:46 --> 00:26:50
and have these coffees here and we'd
00:26:48 --> 00:26:52
work all night we'd play like techno
00:26:50 --> 00:26:53
music and everybody would just work on
00:26:53 --> 00:26:55
their like this was literally like
00:26:54 --> 00:26:56
business people they would work in their
00:26:55 --> 00:26:58
startup and we would all try and make
00:26:56 --> 00:27:01
something and then the Sun would come up
00:26:59 --> 00:27:04
and the morning people the you know the
00:27:01 --> 00:27:04
the yoga uh yoga girls and yoga guys
00:27:04 --> 00:27:07
would come in you know after the yoga
00:27:05 --> 00:27:08
class at 6 and they say hey good morning
00:27:07 --> 00:27:09
and we're like we look like this you
00:27:09 --> 00:27:12
know and we're like what's up how are
00:27:10 --> 00:27:13
you doing and we didn't know how bad we
00:27:12 --> 00:27:15
looked you know but it was very bad and
00:27:14 --> 00:27:18
uh then we'd go home sleep in like a
00:27:16 --> 00:27:21
hostel or a hotel and do the same thing
00:27:18 --> 00:27:22
and again and again and again and it was
00:27:21 --> 00:27:25
this lockin mode you know like
00:27:23 --> 00:27:29
working um and that was very fun so it's
00:27:26 --> 00:27:32
just a a bunch of you music blasting all
00:27:30 --> 00:27:36
through the night yeah more like like
00:27:33 --> 00:27:39
indust not like see I for
00:27:37 --> 00:27:40
me it's such an interesting thing
00:27:39 --> 00:27:42
because the speed of the beat affects
00:27:40 --> 00:27:44
how I feel about a thing So the faster
00:27:43 --> 00:27:47
it is the more anxiety I feel but that
00:27:44 --> 00:27:48
anxiety is channeled into productivity
00:27:47 --> 00:27:51
but if it's a little too fast I start
00:27:49 --> 00:27:53
the anxiety overpowers don't like drama
00:27:51 --> 00:27:56
base music probably not no it's too fast
00:27:54 --> 00:27:57
I mean for working I have to I have to
00:27:56 --> 00:28:00
play with it it's like you can actually
00:27:58 --> 00:28:02
like I can adjust my level of anxiety
00:28:01 --> 00:28:06
this must be a better word than anxiety
00:28:02 --> 00:28:07
it's like uh productive anxiety that I
00:28:06 --> 00:28:08
like whatever that is it also depends
00:28:08 --> 00:28:10
what kind of work you do right like if
00:28:09 --> 00:28:13
you're writing you probably don't want
00:28:10 --> 00:28:14
drama based music I think for codes like
00:28:13 --> 00:28:17
industrial techno this kind of stuff
00:28:15 --> 00:28:19
kind of fast it works well because you
00:28:17 --> 00:28:22
really get like locked in and combined
00:28:20 --> 00:28:24
with caffeine you know you go you go
00:28:23 --> 00:28:26
deep you know and and I think you
00:28:24 --> 00:28:26
balance on this edge of anxiety because
00:28:26 --> 00:28:28
this caffeine is also hitting your
00:28:27 --> 00:28:30
anxiety and you want to be on the edge
00:28:28 --> 00:28:31
of anxiety with this techno running
00:28:30 --> 00:28:33
sometimes it gets too much like stop the
00:28:32 --> 00:28:36
Techno stop the music it's
00:28:34 --> 00:28:37
like but uh but those are good memories
00:28:36 --> 00:28:39
you know and also like travel memories
00:28:37 --> 00:28:41
like you go from City to City yeah and
00:28:39 --> 00:28:43
it feels like it's kind of like Jet Set
00:28:42 --> 00:28:45
life like it's it's feels very beautiful
00:28:44 --> 00:28:47
like you're you're seeing a lot of cool
00:28:45 --> 00:28:49
cities and what was your favorite place
00:28:47 --> 00:28:54
you remember you visited I think still
00:28:50 --> 00:28:56
like uh Bangkok is the best place and
00:28:55 --> 00:28:58
Bangkok and changai I think Thailand is
00:28:56 --> 00:28:59
very special like I've been to the other
00:28:59 --> 00:29:02
place like I've been to Vietnam and I've
00:29:00 --> 00:29:04
been to South America and stuff I still
00:29:02 --> 00:29:07
think Thailand wins in how nice people
00:29:05 --> 00:29:10
are how easy of a life people have their
00:29:08 --> 00:29:12
everything's cheap yeah good well bangok
00:29:10 --> 00:29:13
is getting expensive now but changai is
00:29:12 --> 00:29:15
still cheap I think when you're starting
00:29:14 --> 00:29:18
out it's a great place man the air
00:29:16 --> 00:29:20
quality sucks it's a big problem so um
00:29:19 --> 00:29:23
and it's quite hot but that's a very
00:29:21 --> 00:29:25
cool place um pros and cons I love
00:29:24 --> 00:29:27
Brazil also my girlfriend is Brazilian
00:29:26 --> 00:29:30
but I do love not just because of that
00:29:27 --> 00:29:32
but I like Brazil brail uh the problem
00:29:30 --> 00:29:33
still is the safety issue you know like
00:29:32 --> 00:29:34
it's it's like in America like it's
00:29:33 --> 00:29:36
localized it's hard for Europeans to
00:29:35 --> 00:29:38
understand like safety's localized to
00:29:36 --> 00:29:39
specific areas so if you go to the right
00:29:38 --> 00:29:41
areas it's amazing Brazil is amazing if
00:29:40 --> 00:29:44
you go to the wrong areas like you maybe
00:29:42 --> 00:29:47
you die MH right yeah yeah I mean that's
00:29:44 --> 00:29:48
true it's not true in Europe feel in
00:29:47 --> 00:29:51
Europe is much more true more average
00:29:49 --> 00:29:53
you're right you're right there it's
00:29:51 --> 00:29:54
more averaged out yeah I like it when
00:29:53 --> 00:29:57
there's strong neighborhoods when you're
00:29:55 --> 00:29:59
like you cross a certain Street and
00:29:57 --> 00:30:01
you're in in a dangerous part of town
00:30:00 --> 00:30:03
man yeah it's I I I like it I like
00:30:02 --> 00:30:05
there's certain cities in the United
00:30:03 --> 00:30:06
States like that yeah I like that and
00:30:05 --> 00:30:10
you're saying Europe is you don't feel
00:30:07 --> 00:30:12
scared well I don't I like danger BJJ no
00:30:11 --> 00:30:15
not even just that I think danger is
00:30:13 --> 00:30:18
interesting so danger reveals something
00:30:15 --> 00:30:19
about yourself about others also I like
00:30:18 --> 00:30:22
the full range of humanity yeah so I
00:30:20 --> 00:30:23
don't like the mellowed out aspects of
00:30:22 --> 00:30:24
humanity I I have friends like theom
00:30:24 --> 00:30:27
friends that are exactly like this like
00:30:25 --> 00:30:29
they go to like the the kind of broken
00:30:28 --> 00:30:31
areas you know like they like this
00:30:30 --> 00:30:33
reality they like this authenticity more
00:30:32 --> 00:30:35
they don't like luxury they don't like
00:30:34 --> 00:30:39
oh yeah I hate luxury yeah it's very
00:30:35 --> 00:30:40
European of you like wait was that
00:30:39 --> 00:30:45
that's a whole another conversation so
00:30:41 --> 00:30:49
you uh you uh quoted Freya Stark quote
00:30:46 --> 00:30:51
to awaken quite alone in a strange town
00:30:49 --> 00:30:53
is one of the most Pleasant Sensations
00:30:51 --> 00:30:56
in the world yeah uh do you remember a
00:30:54 --> 00:30:58
time you awoken in a strange town and
00:30:57 --> 00:31:00
felt like that we're talking about small
00:30:59 --> 00:31:03
towns or Big Towns or man anywhere I
00:31:01 --> 00:31:05
think I wrote it in some blog post and
00:31:04 --> 00:31:08
like it was a common thing when you
00:31:06 --> 00:31:09
would wake up and this was like because
00:31:08 --> 00:31:11
I have this website I started a website
00:31:09 --> 00:31:12
about this D Nom like called Nomad
00:31:11 --> 00:31:15
list.com and there was a community so it
00:31:13 --> 00:31:16
was like 3, and other digital no man
00:31:15 --> 00:31:17
because I was feeling lonely so I built
00:31:16 --> 00:31:19
this website and I stopped feeling
00:31:18 --> 00:31:22
lonely like I started make organizing
00:31:19 --> 00:31:22
meetups and making friends and um and it
00:31:22 --> 00:31:25
was very common that people would say
00:31:23 --> 00:31:28
they would wake up and they would forget
00:31:25 --> 00:31:29
where they are yeah like for the first
00:31:28 --> 00:31:31
half minute and I had to look outside
00:31:29 --> 00:31:32
like where am I which country which
00:31:31 --> 00:31:34
sounds really like privileged but it's
00:31:33 --> 00:31:36
more like funny like you literally don't
00:31:34 --> 00:31:39
know where you are because you're so dis
00:31:36 --> 00:31:41
rooted um but there's something man it's
00:31:40 --> 00:31:43
like Anthony berdan you know there's
00:31:41 --> 00:31:47
something pure about this kind
00:31:44 --> 00:31:49
of vagab Bor travel thing you know like
00:31:48 --> 00:31:51
it's behind me I think I don't like now
00:31:50 --> 00:31:53
I travel with my girlfriend right it's
00:31:51 --> 00:31:55
very different but it is romantic like
00:31:53 --> 00:31:58
memories of this kind of like Vagabond
00:31:56 --> 00:31:59
individualistic solo life but the thing
00:31:58 --> 00:32:00
is didn't make me happy but it was very
00:32:00 --> 00:32:03
cool but it didn't make me happy right
00:32:01 --> 00:32:05
it made me anxious there's something
00:32:03 --> 00:32:06
about it that made you anxious I don't
00:32:05 --> 00:32:08
know I still feel like that it's a cool
00:32:07 --> 00:32:12
feeling it's scary at first but then you
00:32:09 --> 00:32:14
realize where you are and you and I
00:32:12 --> 00:32:16
don't know it's like you'll awaken to
00:32:14 --> 00:32:18
the possibilities of this place when you
00:32:16 --> 00:32:20
feel like that it's like great and it's
00:32:19 --> 00:32:22
even when you're doing some basic travel
00:32:21 --> 00:32:23
I go to San Francisco or something El
00:32:22 --> 00:32:25
yeah you have like the novelty effect
00:32:24 --> 00:32:27
like you're in a new place like here
00:32:26 --> 00:32:29
things are possible you know you you
00:32:27 --> 00:32:31
you're you don't get bored yet
00:32:29 --> 00:32:33
and and that's why people get addicted
00:32:32 --> 00:32:37
to travel you know back to startups you
00:32:34 --> 00:32:39
wrote a book on uh how to do this thing
00:32:37 --> 00:32:41
and gave a great talk on it how to do
00:32:40 --> 00:32:44
startups the book's called make
00:32:42 --> 00:32:45
bootstrappers handbook yeah I was
00:32:44 --> 00:32:47
wondering if you could go through some
00:32:45 --> 00:32:50
of the steps it's idea build launch grow
00:32:48 --> 00:32:53
monetize automate and exit there's a lot
00:32:50 --> 00:32:55
of fascinating ideas in each one so idea
00:32:54 --> 00:32:58
stage yeah how do you find a good idea
00:32:56 --> 00:32:59
so I think you need to be able to spot
00:32:58 --> 00:33:01
problems so for example you can go in
00:32:59 --> 00:33:01
your daily life like when you wake up
00:33:01 --> 00:33:05
and you're like what is stuff that I'm
00:33:02 --> 00:33:07
really annoyed with that's like um in my
00:33:06 --> 00:33:10
daily life that doesn't function well
00:33:08 --> 00:33:12
and that's a problem that you can see
00:33:10 --> 00:33:14
okay maybe that's something I can add
00:33:12 --> 00:33:15
right code about you know code for and
00:33:14 --> 00:33:17
it will make my life easier so I would
00:33:16 --> 00:33:19
say make like a list of all these
00:33:18 --> 00:33:22
problems you have and like idea to solve
00:33:19 --> 00:33:23
it and see which one is like viable you
00:33:22 --> 00:33:25
can actually do something and then start
00:33:24 --> 00:33:28
building it so that's that's a really
00:33:26 --> 00:33:30
good place to start
00:33:28 --> 00:33:32
become open to all the problems in your
00:33:31 --> 00:33:34
life like actually start noticing them I
00:33:33 --> 00:33:37
think that's actually not a trivial
00:33:34 --> 00:33:38
thing to do to realize that some aspects
00:33:37 --> 00:33:40
of your life could be done way way
00:33:38 --> 00:33:44
better yeah cuz we kind of very quickly
00:33:41 --> 00:33:48
get accustomed to discomforts exactly uh
00:33:45 --> 00:33:50
like for example like door knobs yeah
00:33:48 --> 00:33:53
like design of certain things like new
00:33:51 --> 00:33:57
cream and door off well that when I know
00:33:54 --> 00:33:59
how much uh incredible design work has
00:33:57 --> 00:34:01
gone into it's really interesting doors
00:34:00 --> 00:34:04
and door knobs just the Design of
00:34:02 --> 00:34:06
Everyday Things forks and spoons it's
00:34:04 --> 00:34:07
going to be hard to come up with a fork
00:34:06 --> 00:34:09
that's better than the current Fork
00:34:08 --> 00:34:11
designs yeah and the other aspect of it
00:34:10 --> 00:34:13
is you're saying like in order to come
00:34:11 --> 00:34:15
up with interesting ideas you got to try
00:34:13 --> 00:34:17
to live a more interesting life yeah but
00:34:16 --> 00:34:18
that's where travel comes in yeah
00:34:18 --> 00:34:20
because when I started traveling I
00:34:19 --> 00:34:22
started seeing stuff in other countries
00:34:21 --> 00:34:24
that you didn't have in Europe for
00:34:22 --> 00:34:27
example or America even like if you go
00:34:24 --> 00:34:29
to Asia uh like dude especially 10 years
00:34:28 --> 00:34:31
ago nobody knew about this like weads
00:34:30 --> 00:34:34
all these apps that they already had
00:34:31 --> 00:34:34
before we had them these everything apps
00:34:34 --> 00:34:37
right like now elon's trying to make X
00:34:35 --> 00:34:39
this everything app like WeChat the same
00:34:37 --> 00:34:41
thing like in Indonesia or tand do you
00:34:39 --> 00:34:42
have one app that you can order food
00:34:42 --> 00:34:46
with you can order groceries you can
00:34:43 --> 00:34:48
order massage uh you can order car
00:34:46 --> 00:34:51
mechanic um anything you can think of is
00:34:49 --> 00:34:53
in the app and that stuff for example
00:34:51 --> 00:34:54
you you know that's called like
00:34:53 --> 00:34:56
Arbitrage you can go to back to your
00:34:54 --> 00:34:59
country and build that same app for your
00:34:56 --> 00:35:01
country for example so you start seeing
00:35:00 --> 00:35:03
um problems you start seeing solutions
00:35:02 --> 00:35:04
that other countries already other
00:35:03 --> 00:35:06
people already did in the rest of the
00:35:04 --> 00:35:09
world and also traveling in general just
00:35:06 --> 00:35:12
gives you more problems cuz travel is
00:35:10 --> 00:35:14
uncomfortable you know um airports are
00:35:12 --> 00:35:16
horrible airplanes are not comfortable
00:35:15 --> 00:35:18
either there's a lot of problems you
00:35:17 --> 00:35:20
start seeing just getting out of your
00:35:18 --> 00:35:22
house you know but also you can I mean
00:35:20 --> 00:35:23
in the digital world you can just go
00:35:22 --> 00:35:27
into different communities and see what
00:35:24 --> 00:35:29
can be improved by the in that yeah yeah
00:35:28 --> 00:35:32
but what specifically is your process of
00:35:30 --> 00:35:34
generating ideas do you like do idea
00:35:32 --> 00:35:34
dumps like do you have a document where
00:35:34 --> 00:35:36
you just keep writing yeah I used to
00:35:35 --> 00:35:37
have like a because when I was when I
00:35:36 --> 00:35:39
wasn't making money I was trying to like
00:35:38 --> 00:35:41
make this list of ideas to see like so I
00:35:40 --> 00:35:42
need to build I was thinking
00:35:42 --> 00:35:44
statistically already like I need to
00:35:43 --> 00:35:46
build all these things and one of these
00:35:44 --> 00:35:48
will work out probably you know so I
00:35:46 --> 00:35:50
need to have a lot of things to try um
00:35:49 --> 00:35:52
and I did that right now I think like
00:35:51 --> 00:35:55
because I already have money I can do
00:35:52 --> 00:35:57
more things uh based on technology so
00:35:55 --> 00:36:00
for example AI when I found out about
00:35:57 --> 00:36:01
when stable diffusion came or C gbt and
00:36:00 --> 00:36:02
stuff all this thing all these things
00:36:02 --> 00:36:05
were
00:36:03 --> 00:36:06
like I didn't start working with them
00:36:05 --> 00:36:08
because I had a problem I had no
00:36:06 --> 00:36:11
problems but I was very curious about
00:36:09 --> 00:36:14
technology and I was like playing with
00:36:12 --> 00:36:15
it and figuring out like first just
00:36:14 --> 00:36:17
playing with it and then and then you
00:36:16 --> 00:36:20
find something like okay this generates
00:36:18 --> 00:36:21
St Fusion generates houses very
00:36:20 --> 00:36:23
beautiful and Interiors you know so it's
00:36:21 --> 00:36:23
less about problem solving it's more
00:36:23 --> 00:36:26
about the possibilities of new things
00:36:24 --> 00:36:27
you can create yeah but that's very
00:36:26 --> 00:36:29
risky because that's the G is like a
00:36:28 --> 00:36:31
solution trying to find a problem yeah
00:36:30 --> 00:36:33
and usually it doesn't work and that's
00:36:31 --> 00:36:35
very common with with startup FS I think
00:36:33 --> 00:36:37
they they have Tech but actually people
00:36:35 --> 00:36:39
don't need to Tech right can you
00:36:38 --> 00:36:41
actually explain it'd be cool to talk
00:36:40 --> 00:36:45
about some of the stuff you created can
00:36:41 --> 00:36:47
you explain um this photo.com yeah yeah
00:36:46 --> 00:36:48
so it's like fire your photographer the
00:36:48 --> 00:36:50
idea is like you don't need a
00:36:49 --> 00:36:53
photographer anymore you can train
00:36:50 --> 00:36:54
yourself as AI model and you can take as
00:36:53 --> 00:36:58
many photos you want anywhere in any
00:36:55 --> 00:37:02
clothes uh with facial expressions like
00:36:58 --> 00:37:04
happy or sad or poses uh all this stuff
00:37:02 --> 00:37:08
so how does how does it work so this is
00:37:04 --> 00:37:09
uh you send me a link to a gallery of
00:37:08 --> 00:37:11
ones done on me which is so on the left
00:37:10 --> 00:37:13
you have the prompts the Box yeah so you
00:37:12 --> 00:37:15
can write like so model is your model
00:37:13 --> 00:37:17
this Lex Freedman so you can write like
00:37:15 --> 00:37:19
model as a blah blah blah whatever you
00:37:18 --> 00:37:22
want y then press the button and it will
00:37:19 --> 00:37:22
take photos take will take like photos
00:37:22 --> 00:37:25
what are you using for the hosting for
00:37:23 --> 00:37:27
the compute replicates okay replicate
00:37:25 --> 00:37:29
decom they're very very goods okay it's
00:37:28 --> 00:37:31
cool like this interface wise it's cool
00:37:30 --> 00:37:33
that you're showing how long it's going
00:37:31 --> 00:37:35
to take this is amazing so it's taking a
00:37:34 --> 00:37:38
I'm presuming you just loaded in a few
00:37:36 --> 00:37:39
pictures from the internet yeah so I
00:37:38 --> 00:37:41
went to Google images St in Lex Freedman
00:37:39 --> 00:37:43
I added like 10 or 20 images you can
00:37:42 --> 00:37:48
open them in the gallery and you can use
00:37:44 --> 00:37:50
your cursors to yeah so some don't look
00:37:48 --> 00:37:53
like you so the hit or miss rate is like
00:37:50 --> 00:37:54
I don't know say like 50/50 or something
00:37:53 --> 00:37:55
but when I was watching your Tweet like
00:37:55 --> 00:37:58
it's been getting better and better and
00:37:56 --> 00:37:59
better it was very bad in beginning it
00:37:58 --> 00:38:01
was so bad but still people sign up to
00:37:59 --> 00:38:04
it you know
00:38:01 --> 00:38:05
uh there's there's two luxes is great
00:38:05 --> 00:38:08
it's getting more and more sexual it's
00:38:06 --> 00:38:09
making me very uncomfortable man but
00:38:08 --> 00:38:11
that's the problem with these models cuz
00:38:10 --> 00:38:13
no we need to talk about this cuz the
00:38:11 --> 00:38:14
models the fusion yeah so the
00:38:13 --> 00:38:17
photorealistic models that are like fine
00:38:15 --> 00:38:18
tuned they were all trained on porn in
00:38:17 --> 00:38:20
the beginning and there was a guy called
00:38:19 --> 00:38:22
Hassan so I was trying to figure out how
00:38:21 --> 00:38:24
to do photo realistic AI photos and it
00:38:23 --> 00:38:26
was stable diffusion by itself is not
00:38:24 --> 00:38:27
doing that well like the faces look all
00:38:26 --> 00:38:29
mangled yep
00:38:28 --> 00:38:32
um and it doesn't have enough resolution
00:38:29 --> 00:38:33
or something to to do that well so but I
00:38:32 --> 00:38:35
started seeing these these um base
00:38:34 --> 00:38:37
models these fine tune models and people
00:38:35 --> 00:38:39
would train on porn and I would try them
00:38:37 --> 00:38:40
and they would be very photo realistic
00:38:39 --> 00:38:45
they would have bodies that actually
00:38:41 --> 00:38:47
made sense like body uh Anatomy um but
00:38:45 --> 00:38:48
if you look at the photorealistic models
00:38:47 --> 00:38:51
that people use now still there's still
00:38:49 --> 00:38:53
core of porn there like of naked people
00:38:51 --> 00:38:53
so I need to prompt out the nak and
00:38:53 --> 00:38:55
everybody needs to do this with AI
00:38:54 --> 00:38:58
startups with imaging you need to prompt
00:38:56 --> 00:39:00
out the naked stuff you need to put a
00:38:58 --> 00:39:01
you know naked um you have to keep
00:39:00 --> 00:39:03
reminding the model you need to put
00:39:02 --> 00:39:05
clothes on yeah don't put naked because
00:39:03 --> 00:39:06
it's very risky I have Google Vision
00:39:05 --> 00:39:09
that checks every photo before it's
00:39:06 --> 00:39:11
shown to the user to like check foror oh
00:39:10 --> 00:39:14
nfw detector because you get the
00:39:12 --> 00:39:15
journalists get very angry if they you
00:39:14 --> 00:39:16
know you if you sex there was a
00:39:15 --> 00:39:17
journalist I think that would got angry
00:39:16 --> 00:39:19
that used this and was like oh it it
00:39:18 --> 00:39:22
made me it showed like a nipple because
00:39:19 --> 00:39:23
Google Vision didn't detect it so
00:39:22 --> 00:39:24
there's like these kind of problems you
00:39:24 --> 00:39:28
need to deal with you know that's what
00:39:25 --> 00:39:29
I'm talking about this is with cats
00:39:28 --> 00:39:34
but look at the cat face it's also kind
00:39:30 --> 00:39:36
of mangled you know I'm I'm uh I'm a
00:39:35 --> 00:39:39
little bit disturbed you can zoom in on
00:39:36 --> 00:39:41
the cat if you want like like yeah this
00:39:39 --> 00:39:44
is a very sad cat it doesn't have a nose
00:39:42 --> 00:39:45
it doesn't have a nose but this man but
00:39:45 --> 00:39:48
this is the problem with AI startups
00:39:46 --> 00:39:49
because they all act like it's perfect
00:39:48 --> 00:39:51
like this is groundbreaking and but it's
00:39:49 --> 00:39:53
not perfect it's like really bad you
00:39:51 --> 00:39:55
know half the time so if I wanted to
00:39:54 --> 00:39:57
sort of update model as yeah so you
00:39:56 --> 00:39:59
remove this stuff and you write
00:39:57 --> 00:40:04
like whatever you want like in Thailand
00:39:59 --> 00:40:07
or something or in Tokyo uh in Tokyo
00:40:05 --> 00:40:09
yeah and then you can say like at night
00:40:08 --> 00:40:12
with neon lights like you can add more
00:40:10 --> 00:40:14
detail to make I'll go in Austin do you
00:40:12 --> 00:40:16
think you'll know in Texas in Austin
00:40:14 --> 00:40:19
Texas cowboy hats in Texas yeah as a as
00:40:17 --> 00:40:19
a
00:40:20 --> 00:40:25
cowboy as a cowboy it's going to go so
00:40:23 --> 00:40:26
uh towards the porn Direction it's it's
00:40:25 --> 00:40:28
man I hope not this is the end of my
00:40:26 --> 00:40:30
career
00:40:28 --> 00:40:31
or the beginning it depends we can send
00:40:30 --> 00:40:32
you a push notification when your photos
00:40:32 --> 00:40:36
are done all right
00:40:33 --> 00:40:38
cool yeah let's see oh wow so this whole
00:40:36 --> 00:40:41
interface you've built this is really
00:40:38 --> 00:40:43
well done J cury so I still use J cury
00:40:42 --> 00:40:46
the only one still after this day you're
00:40:44 --> 00:40:49
not the only one the entire of the web
00:40:46 --> 00:40:51
is PHP thep and jur yeah and SQL lights
00:40:50 --> 00:40:53
you're just like one of the top
00:40:52 --> 00:40:56
performers from a programming
00:40:53 --> 00:40:57
perspective that are still like openly
00:40:56 --> 00:41:00
talking about it but every everyone's
00:40:58 --> 00:41:02
using PHP like if you look most of the
00:41:00 --> 00:41:04
web is still probably PHP 70% it's
00:41:03 --> 00:41:06
because of Wordpress right cuz the blogs
00:41:04 --> 00:41:08
are that's true yeah um true I'm seeing
00:41:06 --> 00:41:10
a Revival now people are getting sick of
00:41:09 --> 00:41:13
Frameworks um like all the JavaScript
00:41:11 --> 00:41:14
Frameworks are so like what do you
00:41:13 --> 00:41:16
called like wieldy like they're so it
00:41:14 --> 00:41:18
takes so much work to just maintain this
00:41:16 --> 00:41:21
code and then it updates to a new
00:41:19 --> 00:41:24
version you to change everything BEP
00:41:21 --> 00:41:25
just stays the same and works yeah and
00:41:24 --> 00:41:27
can you actually just speak to that
00:41:26 --> 00:41:31
stack you you build all your websites
00:41:28 --> 00:41:35
apps startups projects all of that with
00:41:31 --> 00:41:40
mostly vanilla HTML yeah uh JavaScript
00:41:35 --> 00:41:42
with J jQuery PHP and cool white so that
00:41:41 --> 00:41:44
that's a really simple stack and you get
00:41:43 --> 00:41:46
stuff done really fast that can you just
00:41:45 --> 00:41:48
speak to the philosophy behind that I
00:41:47 --> 00:41:50
think it's accidental because that's the
00:41:48 --> 00:41:53
thing I I knew like I knew PHP I knew
00:41:51 --> 00:41:57
HML um CSS you know because you make
00:41:53 --> 00:41:58
websites and when my startup started
00:41:57 --> 00:42:00
taken off I didn't have time to I
00:41:59 --> 00:42:02
remember putting on my to-do list like
00:42:00 --> 00:42:04
learn node.js cuz I it's important to
00:42:03 --> 00:42:06
switch you know cuz this obviously is
00:42:04 --> 00:42:07
much better language than PHP and I
00:42:06 --> 00:42:10
never learned it I never did it uh
00:42:08 --> 00:42:12
because the time I I these things were
00:42:11 --> 00:42:14
growing like this and I was launching
00:42:12 --> 00:42:16
more project and I never had time it's
00:42:14 --> 00:42:19
like one day you know I'll I'll start
00:42:17 --> 00:42:21
coding properly and I never got to it I
00:42:20 --> 00:42:23
I sometimes wonder if I need to learn
00:42:21 --> 00:42:26
that stuff it's still to-do atem for me
00:42:23 --> 00:42:31
to really learn node.js or or flask or
00:42:27 --> 00:42:34
these kind of react yeah react and it's
00:42:31 --> 00:42:37
there it feels like a responsible
00:42:34 --> 00:42:39
software engineer should know how to use
00:42:37 --> 00:42:43
these but you can get stuff
00:42:40 --> 00:42:45
done so fast with vanilla versions of
00:42:43 --> 00:42:46
stuff yeah it's like software developers
00:42:45 --> 00:42:48
if you want to get a job and there's
00:42:46 --> 00:42:49
like you know people making stuff like
00:42:49 --> 00:42:52
startups and if you want to be
00:42:50 --> 00:42:54
entrepreneur probably you maybe
00:42:52 --> 00:42:56
shouldn't I wonder if there's like I
00:42:55 --> 00:42:59
really want to measure performance and
00:42:57 --> 00:43:01
speed I think there's a deep wisdom in
00:43:00 --> 00:43:04
that yeah I do think that Frameworks and
00:43:02 --> 00:43:06
just constantly wanting to learn the new
00:43:04 --> 00:43:08
thing this complicated way of software
00:43:07 --> 00:43:09
engineering gets in the way I'm not sure
00:43:09 --> 00:43:11
what to say about that because
00:43:10 --> 00:43:14
definitely like you shouldn't build
00:43:11 --> 00:43:17
everything from just vanilla JavaScript
00:43:14 --> 00:43:19
or vanilla C for example C++ When You're
00:43:17 --> 00:43:21
Building Systems engineering is like
00:43:20 --> 00:43:24
there's a lot of benefits for a pointer
00:43:22 --> 00:43:26
safety all that kind of stuff so I I
00:43:24 --> 00:43:29
don't know but it just feels like you
00:43:27 --> 00:43:32
can get so much more stuff done if you
00:43:30 --> 00:43:34
don't care about how you do it man this
00:43:33 --> 00:43:37
is my most controversial take I think
00:43:35 --> 00:43:40
and maybe I'm wrong but I feel like
00:43:38 --> 00:43:41
there's Frameworks now that raise money
00:43:40 --> 00:43:43
they raise a lot of money like they
00:43:41 --> 00:43:45
raise 50 million 100 million 300 million
00:43:43 --> 00:43:47
dollars and the idea is that you need to
00:43:46 --> 00:43:49
make the developers the new developers
00:43:47 --> 00:43:52
like when you're 18 or 20 years old
00:43:49 --> 00:43:55
right um get them to use this framework
00:43:53 --> 00:43:58
and then add a platform to it like where
00:43:55 --> 00:43:59
the framework can it's open source but
00:43:58 --> 00:44:03
you probably should use the platform
00:44:00 --> 00:44:05
which is paid to use it and the the cost
00:44:04 --> 00:44:08
of the platforms to host it are a
00:44:06 --> 00:44:10
thousand times higher than just hosting
00:44:08 --> 00:44:13
it on a simple AWS server or VPS on
00:44:11 --> 00:44:14
digital ocean right um so there's
00:44:13 --> 00:44:16
obviously like a monetary incentive here
00:44:15 --> 00:44:17
like we want to get a lot of developers
00:44:17 --> 00:44:19
to use this technology and then we need
00:44:18 --> 00:44:20
to charge them money because they're
00:44:19 --> 00:44:24
going to use it in startups and then the
00:44:21 --> 00:44:28
starts can pay for the bills um but what
00:44:24 --> 00:44:29
that it kind of destroys the
00:44:28 --> 00:44:31
the information out there about learning
00:44:30 --> 00:44:34
to code because they you know they pay
00:44:32 --> 00:44:37
YouTubers they pay influencers developer
00:44:35 --> 00:44:39
influen is a big thing to like um and
00:44:37 --> 00:44:40
same thing what happens with like uh
00:44:39 --> 00:44:42
nutrition in Fitness or something same
00:44:40 --> 00:44:44
thing happens in developing they pay
00:44:42 --> 00:44:46
this influen to promote the stuff use it
00:44:44 --> 00:44:46
make stuff with it make demo product
00:44:46 --> 00:44:49
with it and then a lot of people like
00:44:47 --> 00:44:51
wow uh use this and I started noticing
00:44:50 --> 00:44:53
this because when I was ship my stuff
00:44:51 --> 00:44:55
people would ask me what are you using I
00:44:53 --> 00:44:56
I would say I just PHP JQ why does it
00:44:55 --> 00:44:58
matter and people would start kind of
00:44:57 --> 00:45:00
attacking me like why are you not using
00:44:58 --> 00:45:01
this new technology this new framework
00:45:00 --> 00:45:03
this new thing and I say I don't know
00:45:02 --> 00:45:05
cuz this PHP thing works and I don't
00:45:04 --> 00:45:08
really I'm optimizing for anything just
00:45:06 --> 00:45:10
doing it just works and I never
00:45:08 --> 00:45:11
understood like why uh like I understand
00:45:10 --> 00:45:13
there's new technologies that are better
00:45:12 --> 00:45:16
and it should be Improvement but I'm
00:45:14 --> 00:45:18
very suspicious of money just like
00:45:16 --> 00:45:21
lobbying there's money in this developer
00:45:19 --> 00:45:24
framework scene there's hundreds of
00:45:21 --> 00:45:25
millions that goes to ads or influenc or
00:45:24 --> 00:45:27
whatever it can't all go to developers
00:45:26 --> 00:45:28
you don't need Developers for framework
00:45:28 --> 00:45:31
and it's open
00:45:29 --> 00:45:33
source to make a lot of more money on
00:45:31 --> 00:45:34
these startups so that's a really good
00:45:33 --> 00:45:36
perspective but in addition to that is
00:45:35 --> 00:45:38
like when you say
00:45:36 --> 00:45:41
better it's
00:45:39 --> 00:45:43
like can we get some data on the better
00:45:42 --> 00:45:46
because like I want to know from the
00:45:44 --> 00:45:48
individual developer perspective and
00:45:46 --> 00:45:49
then from a team of five team of 10 team
00:45:48 --> 00:45:52
of 20 developers
00:45:50 --> 00:45:56
yeah uh measure how productive they are
00:45:53 --> 00:45:57
in uh shipping features how many bugs
00:45:56 --> 00:46:00
they create
00:45:57 --> 00:46:01
how many security holes uhp was not good
00:46:01 --> 00:46:05
of security for a while but now it's
00:46:02 --> 00:46:09
good in theory in theory is it though
00:46:06 --> 00:46:12
now no no now as as you're saying it I
00:46:09 --> 00:46:14
want to know if that's true because PHP
00:46:12 --> 00:46:17
was just the majority of websites on the
00:46:15 --> 00:46:19
internet could be true is it just over
00:46:17 --> 00:46:21
represented same with WordPress yes
00:46:19 --> 00:46:23
there's a reputation that WordPress has
00:46:21 --> 00:46:25
a gigantic number of security holes I
00:46:24 --> 00:46:27
don't know if that's true I I know it
00:46:25 --> 00:46:29
gets attacked a lot because it's so
00:46:28 --> 00:46:32
popular it definitely does have security
00:46:30 --> 00:46:34
holes but maybe a lot of other systems
00:46:32 --> 00:46:35
have security holes as well anyway like
00:46:34 --> 00:46:36
I just sort of questioning the
00:46:35 --> 00:46:39
conventional wisdom that keeps wanting
00:46:37 --> 00:46:41
to push software Engineers towards
00:46:39 --> 00:46:44
Frameworks towards
00:46:41 --> 00:46:46
complex like uh super complicated sort
00:46:45 --> 00:46:49
of software engineering approaches that
00:46:46 --> 00:46:50
stretch out the the time it takes to
00:46:49 --> 00:46:53
actually build a thing 100% And it's the
00:46:51 --> 00:46:54
same thing with big corporations 80% of
00:46:53 --> 00:46:58
the people don't do anything it's like
00:46:55 --> 00:47:01
it's not efficient and and if you if
00:46:58 --> 00:47:02
your your your benchmark is like uh
00:47:01 --> 00:47:05
people building stuff that actually gets
00:47:03 --> 00:47:06
done and like for society right like if
00:47:05 --> 00:47:08
we want to save time we should probably
00:47:06 --> 00:47:11
use technology that's
00:47:09 --> 00:47:14
um that's simple that's pragmatic that's
00:47:11 --> 00:47:15
like that works uh that's not overly
00:47:14 --> 00:47:18
complicated doesn't make your life like
00:47:16 --> 00:47:20
a living hell you know and use a
00:47:18 --> 00:47:22
framework when it obviously solves a
00:47:21 --> 00:47:24
problem a direct problem that you of
00:47:22 --> 00:47:25
course you yeah of course I'm not saying
00:47:24 --> 00:47:27
you should code without a framework you
00:47:25 --> 00:47:29
should use whatever you want
00:47:27 --> 00:47:31
but yeah I think it's suspicious you
00:47:30 --> 00:47:34
know and um and I think when I talk
00:47:32 --> 00:47:35
about on Twitter like there's a lot this
00:47:34 --> 00:47:37
this Army comes out you know this this
00:47:35 --> 00:47:39
these framework armies yeah man
00:47:37 --> 00:47:40
something my gut tells me you I want to
00:47:40 --> 00:47:43
ask the framework Army what have they
00:47:41 --> 00:47:44
built this week it's the Elon question
00:47:44 --> 00:47:46
what did you do this week yeah did you
00:47:45 --> 00:47:49
make money with it you know did you
00:47:46 --> 00:47:53
charge users is it a real business and
00:47:49 --> 00:47:54
um yeah uh so going back to the Cowboy
00:47:54 --> 00:47:57
first of all some don't look like you
00:47:55 --> 00:47:58
right but some do every aspect of this
00:47:57 --> 00:47:59
is pretty incredible I'm also just
00:47:59 --> 00:48:02
looking at the interface it's really
00:48:00 --> 00:48:04
well done so this is all just jQuery and
00:48:02 --> 00:48:05
yeah this is really well done so like
00:48:04 --> 00:48:09
tell take me through the Journey of
00:48:06 --> 00:48:11
photo AI like you don't know much most
00:48:10 --> 00:48:14
of the world doesn't know much about uh
00:48:12 --> 00:48:16
stable diffusion or any of this any of
00:48:14 --> 00:48:17
the generative AI stuff and so you're
00:48:16 --> 00:48:20
thinking okay how can I build cool stuff
00:48:18 --> 00:48:22
with this what was the origin story of
00:48:20 --> 00:48:23
photo AI I think uh it started cuz
00:48:22 --> 00:48:25
stable diffusion came out so stable
00:48:24 --> 00:48:28
diffusion is like this the first like
00:48:25 --> 00:48:29
generative image mod model AI model and
00:48:28 --> 00:48:30
um I started playing with it like you
00:48:30 --> 00:48:33
could install it on your Mac like
00:48:31 --> 00:48:35
somebody forked it and made it work for
00:48:33 --> 00:48:37
MacBooks so I downloaded it and uh
00:48:35 --> 00:48:40
cloned the repo and started using it to
00:48:37 --> 00:48:43
generate images um and it was like
00:48:41 --> 00:48:44
amazing like it would I found it on
00:48:43 --> 00:48:46
Twitter because you see things happen on
00:48:45 --> 00:48:49
Twitter and I I would post what I was
00:48:47 --> 00:48:51
making on Twitter as well and you could
00:48:49 --> 00:48:52
make any image you could write a prompt
00:48:51 --> 00:48:54
to essentially write a prompt and then
00:48:53 --> 00:48:57
it generates a photo of that or image of
00:48:55 --> 00:48:59
that um in any style like they would use
00:48:57 --> 00:49:02
like artist names to make like a Picasso
00:48:59 --> 00:49:05
kind of style and stuff um and I was
00:49:03 --> 00:49:07
trying to see like what is it good at is
00:49:06 --> 00:49:09
it good at people no it's really bad at
00:49:07 --> 00:49:10
people but it was good at houses so
00:49:10 --> 00:49:14
architecture for example I would
00:49:11 --> 00:49:16
generate like architecture houses um so
00:49:14 --> 00:49:19
I made a website called this house does
00:49:17 --> 00:49:22
exist. org and it generated like they
00:49:20 --> 00:49:24
called like house porn and that one like
00:49:23 --> 00:49:26
house porn it's like a subreddit so and
00:49:24 --> 00:49:26
this was stable diffusion like the first
00:49:26 --> 00:49:30
version so looks really you can click
00:49:27 --> 00:49:33
for another photo so it generates like
00:49:30 --> 00:49:34
all these kind of non-existing houses it
00:49:34 --> 00:49:38
is house point but it looked kind of
00:49:35 --> 00:49:39
good you know like especially back then
00:49:38 --> 00:49:44
now things look much
00:49:40 --> 00:49:48
better um this really really well
00:49:45 --> 00:49:51
done wow and it also generates like a
00:49:49 --> 00:49:53
description and you can up vote is it
00:49:51 --> 00:49:55
nice up vote it man there's so much to
00:49:53 --> 00:49:57
talk to you about like the choices here
00:49:56 --> 00:49:59
is this is very Scrappy in the bottom
00:49:58 --> 00:50:01
there's like a ranking of the most up
00:49:59 --> 00:50:02
voted houses so these are the top voted
00:50:02 --> 00:50:04
if you go to old time you see quite
00:50:03 --> 00:50:06
beautiful
00:50:04 --> 00:50:09
ones yeah so this one is my favorite the
00:50:07 --> 00:50:12
number one it's like kind of like a um
00:50:10 --> 00:50:14
how is this not more popular it was
00:50:12 --> 00:50:16
really popular for like a while but then
00:50:14 --> 00:50:19
people got so bored of it I think cuz I
00:50:17 --> 00:50:20
was getting bored of it too like just
00:50:19 --> 00:50:22
continuous house porn like everything
00:50:21 --> 00:50:25
starts looking the same but then I
00:50:23 --> 00:50:28
thought it was really good at interior
00:50:25 --> 00:50:31
so I pivoted to interior ai.com
00:50:28 --> 00:50:32
where um I tried to like upload first
00:50:31 --> 00:50:34
generate interior designs and then I
00:50:33 --> 00:50:36
tried to do like there was a new
00:50:34 --> 00:50:38
technology called image to image where
00:50:36 --> 00:50:41
you can input an image like a photo and
00:50:39 --> 00:50:43
it would kind of modify the thing mhm so
00:50:42 --> 00:50:46
you see it looks almost the same as
00:50:43 --> 00:50:48
photo it's the same code essentially um
00:50:46 --> 00:50:49
nice so I would I would upload a photo
00:50:48 --> 00:50:52
of my interior where I lived and I would
00:50:50 --> 00:50:56
ask like change this into like a I don't
00:50:53 --> 00:50:58
know like maximalist design you know and
00:50:57 --> 00:51:00
it worked and it worked really well so I
00:50:59 --> 00:51:02
was like okay this is a startup because
00:51:01 --> 00:51:04
obviously interior design Ai and
00:51:02 --> 00:51:06
nobody's doing that yet so I launched
00:51:05 --> 00:51:09
this and it was successful and made like
00:51:06 --> 00:51:11
in within a week made 10K 20K a month
00:51:09 --> 00:51:13
and now still makes like 40K 50k a month
00:51:12 --> 00:51:15
uh and it's been like two years so then
00:51:14 --> 00:51:16
I was like how can I improve this
00:51:16 --> 00:51:18
interior design I need to start learning
00:51:17 --> 00:51:20
fine-tuning and fine tuning is where you
00:51:19 --> 00:51:23
have this existing AI model and you fine
00:51:21 --> 00:51:25
tune it on the specific goal you wanted
00:51:23 --> 00:51:28
to do so I would find really beautiful
00:51:25 --> 00:51:29
interor design make a gallery and um
00:51:29 --> 00:51:32
train a new model that was very good at
00:51:30 --> 00:51:34
interior design and it worked and I used
00:51:32 --> 00:51:35
that as well and then for fun I uploaded
00:51:35 --> 00:51:39
photos of
00:51:36 --> 00:51:41
myself and here's where it happened uh
00:51:39 --> 00:51:43
and to train myself like and this would
00:51:41 --> 00:51:45
never work obviously and it worked and
00:51:43 --> 00:51:47
actually it started understanding me as
00:51:45 --> 00:51:49
a concept so my face worked and and you
00:51:48 --> 00:51:52
could do like different styles like me
00:51:50 --> 00:51:54
as a like very cheesy medieval warrior
00:51:53 --> 00:51:58
all this stuff so I was like this is
00:51:54 --> 00:52:01
another a startup so now I Avatar ai. me
00:51:58 --> 00:52:04
I couldn't get the do and this was uh
00:52:02 --> 00:52:06
this was yeah Avatar ai. me well now it
00:52:04 --> 00:52:07
forwards to phot because I pivoted got
00:52:06 --> 00:52:10
it but this was more like
00:52:08 --> 00:52:13
cheesy thing so this is very interesting
00:52:11 --> 00:52:16
because this went so viral it made like
00:52:13 --> 00:52:18
I think like 150k in a week or something
00:52:16 --> 00:52:20
it's the most money I ever made and um
00:52:19 --> 00:52:22
and then big this is very interesting
00:52:21 --> 00:52:26
the big VC companies like lenza which
00:52:23 --> 00:52:27
are much better at iOS and stuff than me
00:52:26 --> 00:52:29
I didn't have IOS app they quickly build
00:52:28 --> 00:52:31
the IOS app that does the same and they
00:52:29 --> 00:52:32
found technology and it's all open
00:52:31 --> 00:52:35
technology so it's good and I think they
00:52:33 --> 00:52:38
made like $30 million with it yeah they
00:52:36 --> 00:52:40
they became like the top grossing app
00:52:38 --> 00:52:42
after that um and it was how how do you
00:52:40 --> 00:52:43
feel about that I think it's amazing
00:52:42 --> 00:52:45
honestly and it's not like you didn't
00:52:44 --> 00:52:48
have like a feeling like ah fuck no I
00:52:46 --> 00:52:50
was a little bit like sad cuz all my
00:52:49 --> 00:52:52
products would work out and I never had
00:52:50 --> 00:52:53
like real Fierce competition and now I
00:52:52 --> 00:52:57
have like Fierce competition from like a
00:52:54 --> 00:52:59
a very skilled High sent like iOS
00:52:57 --> 00:53:00
Developer Studio or something that and
00:52:59 --> 00:53:02
and they already had an app they had an
00:53:01 --> 00:53:04
app in the app store for like um I think
00:53:03 --> 00:53:05
retouching your face or something so
00:53:04 --> 00:53:07
they were very smart they add these
00:53:05 --> 00:53:08
avatars to there it's a feature they had
00:53:07 --> 00:53:10
the users they do a push notification to
00:53:09 --> 00:53:12
everybody who have these avatars Yeah
00:53:10 --> 00:53:14
man they made C I think they made they
00:53:12 --> 00:53:17
made so much money and um I think they
00:53:15 --> 00:53:19
did a really great job and uh I also
00:53:17 --> 00:53:21
made a lot of money with it but that was
00:53:20 --> 00:53:22
I I I quickly realized it wasn't my
00:53:22 --> 00:53:26
thing because it was so cheesy it was
00:53:23 --> 00:53:28
like kit you know it's kind of like um
00:53:26 --> 00:53:29
me as a Barbie or me as a you know it
00:53:28 --> 00:53:31
was too cheesy I wanted to go for like
00:53:30 --> 00:53:32
what's a real problem we can solve
00:53:31 --> 00:53:33
because this is going to be a hype this
00:53:33 --> 00:53:38
is going to be and it was a hype this
00:53:34 --> 00:53:39
Avatar um it's like let's do real
00:53:38 --> 00:53:42
photography like how can you make people
00:53:40 --> 00:53:43
look really photorealistic and it was
00:53:42 --> 00:53:44
difficult and that's why these offs word
00:53:43 --> 00:53:46
because they were all like in a Cheesy
00:53:44 --> 00:53:49
you know Picasso style and art is easy
00:53:46 --> 00:53:51
because you interpret the the all the
00:53:50 --> 00:53:53
problems that AI has with your face are
00:53:52 --> 00:53:55
like artistic you know if you call it
00:53:53 --> 00:53:56
Picasso but if you make a real photo all
00:53:55 --> 00:53:58
the problems with your face like it just
00:53:57 --> 00:54:01
you look wrong you know mhm so I started
00:53:59 --> 00:54:04
making photo AI which was like a pivot
00:54:01 --> 00:54:07
of it where it was like a photo studio
00:54:04 --> 00:54:09
um where you could take photos without
00:54:08 --> 00:54:11
actually needing a photographer needing
00:54:10 --> 00:54:13
a studio you don't just you know you
00:54:11 --> 00:54:14
just type it and I've been working on it
00:54:13 --> 00:54:16
for like the last yeah it's really
00:54:15 --> 00:54:19
incredible that journey is really
00:54:17 --> 00:54:21
incredible let's go to the beginning of
00:54:19 --> 00:54:24
photo AI though cuz I remember seeing a
00:54:21 --> 00:54:26
lot of re really hilarious photos I
00:54:25 --> 00:54:29
think you were using yourself as a case
00:54:26 --> 00:54:31
study right yeah yeah so what uh there's
00:54:29 --> 00:54:32
a tweet here
00:54:31 --> 00:54:35
sold
00:54:33 --> 00:54:37
$100,000 in AI generated avatars yeah
00:54:36 --> 00:54:40
it's a lot like it's a lot for anybody
00:54:38 --> 00:54:43
it's a lot for me like uh making 10K a
00:54:41 --> 00:54:47
day on this you know that's
00:54:43 --> 00:54:49
amazing that's amazing and then the
00:54:47 --> 00:54:51
nested tweet like that's a launch tweet
00:54:49 --> 00:54:56
and then the before there is like the me
00:54:51 --> 00:55:00
hacking on it oh I see so that
00:54:57 --> 00:55:03
okay so October 26 2022 I trained an ml
00:55:01 --> 00:55:05
model on my
00:55:03 --> 00:55:07
face sure because my eyes are quite far
00:55:06 --> 00:55:09
apart I learned when I did YouTube I
00:55:08 --> 00:55:11
would put like a photo of like my DJ
00:55:09 --> 00:55:13
photo you know my mixure and people
00:55:12 --> 00:55:15
would say I look like a hammerhead shark
00:55:14 --> 00:55:17
was like the top comment so then I
00:55:15 --> 00:55:20
realized my eyes are far apart uh yeah
00:55:18 --> 00:55:22
the internet helps you realiz who how
00:55:20 --> 00:55:24
you look you know boy do I love the
00:55:22 --> 00:55:27
internet first first
00:55:25 --> 00:55:29
trap what what is is this wait it's
00:55:28 --> 00:55:31
water from the waterfall but the
00:55:29 --> 00:55:31
waterfall is in the back you know so
00:55:31 --> 00:55:35
what's going
00:55:32 --> 00:55:38
on so this is how much of this is real
00:55:35 --> 00:55:40
it's all AI it's all AI yeah that's
00:55:39 --> 00:55:42
pretty good though for the early days
00:55:40 --> 00:55:43
exactly so but this was hit or miss so
00:55:42 --> 00:55:46
you had to do love curation cuz 99% of
00:55:44 --> 00:55:47
it was really bad MH so these are the
00:55:46 --> 00:55:51
photos I uploaded how many photos did
00:55:48 --> 00:55:53
you use only these I will try more up to
00:55:52 --> 00:55:58
date picks later these are the these are
00:55:53 --> 00:55:59
the only photos you uploaded yeah wow
00:55:58 --> 00:56:03
wow wow okay so like you were learning
00:56:00 --> 00:56:03
all this super quickly what uh what are
00:56:03 --> 00:56:05
some like interesting details you
00:56:04 --> 00:56:07
remember from that time for like what
00:56:05 --> 00:56:08
you have to figure out to make it work
00:56:07 --> 00:56:11
and for people just listening he
00:56:09 --> 00:56:13
uploaded just uh just a handful of
00:56:11 --> 00:56:15
photos that don't really have a good
00:56:13 --> 00:56:17
capture of the face and he's able to or
00:56:16 --> 00:56:19
I think it's cropped it's like a cropped
00:56:17 --> 00:56:20
by the by the the layout but they're
00:56:19 --> 00:56:24
they're Square photos so they're 512 by
00:56:21 --> 00:56:26
512 mhm because that's stable fusion um
00:56:24 --> 00:56:30
but nevertheless not great captures the
00:56:26 --> 00:56:32
face like it's not it's not like a uh
00:56:31 --> 00:56:35
collection of several hundred photos
00:56:32 --> 00:56:35
that it's like exactly like I I would
00:56:35 --> 00:56:38
imagine that too when I started I was
00:56:36 --> 00:56:39
like a this must be like some 3D scan
00:56:38 --> 00:56:41
technology right yeah so I think the
00:56:40 --> 00:56:44
cool thing with AI it trains the concept
00:56:42 --> 00:56:46
of you so it's literally like learning
00:56:44 --> 00:56:48
just like any AI model leurs it learns
00:56:46 --> 00:56:51
how you look so I I did this and then I
00:56:48 --> 00:56:52
was getting so I was getting DMs like
00:56:52 --> 00:56:55
telegram messages like how can I do the
00:56:53 --> 00:56:56
same thing I want these photos my
00:56:55 --> 00:56:58
girlfriend wants these photo so I was
00:56:57 --> 00:57:01
like okay this is obviously a business
00:56:59 --> 00:57:04
but I didn't have time to code it uh
00:57:01 --> 00:57:07
make a whole like app about it so I made
00:57:04 --> 00:57:10
a HTML page um registered a domain name
00:57:08 --> 00:57:11
and this was not even it was a stripe
00:57:10 --> 00:57:14
payment link which means you have uh
00:57:12 --> 00:57:16
literally link to stripe to pay but
00:57:14 --> 00:57:17
there's no code in the back so all you
00:57:16 --> 00:57:21
know is you have customers that paid
00:57:18 --> 00:57:22
money then I added like a some uh a typ
00:57:21 --> 00:57:24
form link so Ty form is a site where you
00:57:23 --> 00:57:27
can have create like your own um input
00:57:25 --> 00:57:29
form like Google forms so they would get
00:57:28 --> 00:57:31
a email with a link to the type form or
00:57:30 --> 00:57:34
actually just a link after the checkout
00:57:32 --> 00:57:36
and they could upload their photos so
00:57:34 --> 00:57:38
enter their email upload the photos and
00:57:36 --> 00:57:40
um and I launched it and I was like here
00:57:38 --> 00:57:42
first sale so this October
00:57:41 --> 00:57:45
2022 and I think within like the first
00:57:43 --> 00:57:47
24 hours was like I'm not sure it was
00:57:46 --> 00:57:50
like a thousand customers or something
00:57:48 --> 00:57:51
um but the problem was I didn't have
00:57:50 --> 00:57:53
code to automate this so I had to do
00:57:51 --> 00:57:55
manually so the first few hundred I just
00:57:54 --> 00:57:58
literally took their photos uh train
00:57:56 --> 00:57:59
them and then I would generate the
00:57:58 --> 00:58:00
photos with the prompts and I had this
00:57:59 --> 00:58:02
text file with the promps and I would do
00:58:01 --> 00:58:05
everything manually and this quickly
00:58:03 --> 00:58:07
became way too much so but that's
00:58:05 --> 00:58:10
another constraint like I was forced to
00:58:07 --> 00:58:11
code something up uh that would do that
00:58:10 --> 00:58:13
and that was essentially making it into
00:58:11 --> 00:58:14
a real website right so first it was the
00:58:13 --> 00:58:17
type form and they uploaded through the
00:58:14 --> 00:58:17
typ form strip check out form yeah and
00:58:17 --> 00:58:19
then you were like that image is
00:58:18 --> 00:58:21
downloaded did you write a script to
00:58:20 --> 00:58:24
export down download the images myself
00:58:22 --> 00:58:27
it's a zip file unzip file you unzipped
00:58:25 --> 00:58:29
it un yes and then I no I'm because you
00:58:27 --> 00:58:30
know do things don't skill Paul graah
00:58:29 --> 00:58:32
says right so uh and then I would train
00:58:31 --> 00:58:34
it and then I would email them the
00:58:33 --> 00:58:37
photos I think from my personal email
00:58:35 --> 00:58:37
say here's your here's your avatars you
00:58:37 --> 00:58:39
know and they liked it they were like
00:58:38 --> 00:58:41
wow it's
00:58:39 --> 00:58:42
amazing you emailed them with your
00:58:41 --> 00:58:45
personal email it didn't have an email
00:58:43 --> 00:58:48
address on this domain and this is like
00:58:46 --> 00:58:51
a 100 people yeah and then you know who
00:58:48 --> 00:58:52
signed up uh like man I cannot say but
00:58:51 --> 00:58:54
really famous people like really really
00:58:53 --> 00:58:56
like billionaires famous Tech
00:58:54 --> 00:58:57
billionaires did it and I was like wow
00:58:56 --> 00:59:00
this is crazy and I sent I was like so
00:58:58 --> 00:59:02
scared to message them so I said thanks
00:59:00 --> 00:59:04
so much for using my sites you know he's
00:59:02 --> 00:59:05
like yeah amazing app gra work so it's
00:59:05 --> 00:59:08
like this is different than normal
00:59:06 --> 00:59:11
reaction you know it's Bill Gates isn't
00:59:09 --> 00:59:14
it can say
00:59:11 --> 00:59:15
anything just like shirtless P gdpr you
00:59:14 --> 00:59:18
know like privacy European regulation
00:59:16 --> 00:59:21
canot share anything but I was very I
00:59:18 --> 00:59:22
was like Wow and uh but this shows like
00:59:22 --> 00:59:24
so you make something and then if it
00:59:23 --> 00:59:26
takes off very fast you're like it's
00:59:25 --> 00:59:29
validated you know you're like
00:59:26 --> 00:59:29
here's something that people really want
00:59:29 --> 00:59:32
but then also I thought this is hype
00:59:30 --> 00:59:34
this is going to die down very fast and
00:59:32 --> 00:59:36
I did because it's too cheesy but you
00:59:34 --> 00:59:37
have to automate the whole thing how'
00:59:36 --> 00:59:39
you automate it so like what's the AI
00:59:38 --> 00:59:42
component like how hard was that to
00:59:40 --> 00:59:44
figure out okay so that's actually in
00:59:43 --> 00:59:45
many ways the easiest thing because
00:59:44 --> 00:59:47
there is all these platforms already
00:59:45 --> 00:59:50
back then there was platforms for uh
00:59:47 --> 00:59:52
fine-tune St diffusion um like now I use
00:59:51 --> 00:59:55
replicate back then I use different
00:59:52 --> 00:59:56
platforms um which was funny because
00:59:55 --> 00:59:58
that platform when this thing took off I
00:59:56 --> 01:00:00
would tweet cuz I tweet always like how
00:59:58 --> 01:00:02
much money these websites make and then
01:00:01 --> 01:00:05
so the the you called vendor right the
01:00:03 --> 01:00:06
the G the platform that did the gpus
01:00:05 --> 01:00:09
they increased their price for training
01:00:06 --> 01:00:10
from $3 to $20 after they saw that I was
01:00:09 --> 01:00:12
making so much money so immediately my
01:00:11 --> 01:00:12
profit is gone because I was selling
01:00:12 --> 01:00:15
them for
01:00:13 --> 01:00:17
$30 and I was in a slack with them like
01:00:15 --> 01:00:18
saying what is this like can you just
01:00:18 --> 01:00:21
put it back to $3 they say yeah maybe in
01:00:19 --> 01:00:21
the future we're looking at it right now
01:00:21 --> 01:00:23
I'm like what are you talking about like
01:00:22 --> 01:00:24
you just took all my money you know and
01:00:23 --> 01:00:27
they're smart well they're not that
01:00:25 --> 01:00:30
smart because like you also have a large
01:00:28 --> 01:00:31
uh platform and a lot of people respect
01:00:31 --> 01:00:34
you so you can literally come out and
01:00:32 --> 01:00:35
say that they're not I think it's like
01:00:34 --> 01:00:37
kind of dirty to cancel a company or
01:00:35 --> 01:00:38
something I I prefer just bringing my
01:00:37 --> 01:00:41
business elsewhere but there was no
01:00:39 --> 01:00:45
elsewhere back then right so I started
01:00:42 --> 01:00:46
talking to other um AI model ml
01:00:45 --> 01:00:48
platforms so replicade was one those
01:00:46 --> 01:00:50
platforms and I started dming the CEO
01:00:48 --> 01:00:52
say can you please create like it's
01:00:51 --> 01:00:54
called dream Boo this fine tuning of you
01:00:52 --> 01:00:56
yourself can you add this to your site
01:00:54 --> 01:00:58
CU I need this cuz I'm being price gods
01:00:57 --> 01:01:00
and he said no because it takes too long
01:00:59 --> 01:01:01
to run it takes half an hour to run and
01:01:00 --> 01:01:02
we don't have the gpus for it I said
01:01:02 --> 01:01:05
please please please and then after a
01:01:03 --> 01:01:08
week they said we're doing it we're
01:01:05 --> 01:01:09
launching this and then this company
01:01:08 --> 01:01:11
became it was like not very famous
01:01:10 --> 01:01:13
company it became very famous with this
01:01:11 --> 01:01:15
stuff because suddenly everybody was
01:01:13 --> 01:01:16
like oh we can build similar apps like
01:01:16 --> 01:01:18
Avatar apps and everybody started
01:01:17 --> 01:01:20
building Avatar apps and everybody
01:01:18 --> 01:01:22
started using replicate for it um and it
01:01:20 --> 01:01:24
was from these early DMS with like the
01:01:22 --> 01:01:26
CEO like Ben Fish very nice guy and he
01:01:25 --> 01:01:28
was like
01:01:26 --> 01:01:30
they never price go me they never treat
01:01:28 --> 01:01:32
me bad they always been very nice it's
01:01:30 --> 01:01:34
it's a very cool company so you can run
01:01:32 --> 01:01:37
any ml model any AI model llms you can
01:01:35 --> 01:01:39
run on here and you can scale yes they
01:01:38 --> 01:01:41
scale yeah yeah and I mean you can do
01:01:39 --> 01:01:42
now you can click on the model and just
01:01:41 --> 01:01:45
run it already it's like super easy you
01:01:43 --> 01:01:47
log in with GitHub um that's great and
01:01:46 --> 01:01:49
by running it on the website then you
01:01:47 --> 01:01:50
can automate with the API you can make a
01:01:49 --> 01:01:52
website that runs the model generate
01:01:50 --> 01:01:54
images generate text generate vide
01:01:52 --> 01:01:56
generate music generate spech find two
01:01:55 --> 01:02:00
models do anything yeah it's very cool
01:01:57 --> 01:02:01
company nice and you're like growing
01:02:00 --> 01:02:03
with them essentially they grew because
01:02:01 --> 01:02:05
of you because it's like a big use case
01:02:03 --> 01:02:06
yeah like the the website even looks
01:02:06 --> 01:02:09
weird now it it started as like a
01:02:07 --> 01:02:10
machine learning platform that was like
01:02:09 --> 01:02:13
I didn't even understand what it did it
01:02:11 --> 01:02:14
was just too to ml you know like you
01:02:14 --> 01:02:16
would understand because you're in the
01:02:15 --> 01:02:19
ml world I wouldn't understand now it's
01:02:16 --> 01:02:20
newb friendly yeah exactly and I didn't
01:02:19 --> 01:02:22
know how it worked and um but I knew
01:02:21 --> 01:02:24
that they could probably do this and
01:02:23 --> 01:02:26
they did it they built the models and
01:02:24 --> 01:02:29
now I use them for everything and we
01:02:26 --> 01:02:31
trained like I think now like 36,000
01:02:30 --> 01:02:34
models 36,000 people already but is
01:02:32 --> 01:02:35
there some tricks to fine tuning to like
01:02:34 --> 01:02:37
the collection of photos that are
01:02:35 --> 01:02:39
provided like how do you like yes man
01:02:38 --> 01:02:42
it's so many Hecks the hack it's like
01:02:40 --> 01:02:44
100 Hecks to make it work what what's
01:02:43 --> 01:02:47
what are some my secrets now well not
01:02:45 --> 01:02:48
not the secrets but the more like
01:02:47 --> 01:02:50
insights maybe about the human face and
01:02:49 --> 01:02:52
the human body like what what kind of
01:02:50 --> 01:02:54
stuff get messed up a
01:02:52 --> 01:02:57
lot I think people well man it's thing
01:02:55 --> 01:02:59
people don't know know how they look so
01:02:57 --> 01:02:59
um yeah they generate photos of
01:02:59 --> 01:03:03
themselves and then they say ah it
01:03:00 --> 01:03:04
doesn't look like me yeah but it then
01:03:04 --> 01:03:06
you know you can check the training
01:03:05 --> 01:03:08
phones it does look like you but you
01:03:06 --> 01:03:10
don't know how you look so there's a
01:03:09 --> 01:03:13
face dysmorphia of yourself that you you
01:03:11 --> 01:03:14
have no idea how you look yeah that's
01:03:13 --> 01:03:16
hilarious I mean I've got to one one of
01:03:14 --> 01:03:18
the least Pleasant activities in my
01:03:16 --> 01:03:20
existence is having to listen to my
01:03:18 --> 01:03:21
voice and look at my face so I get to
01:03:21 --> 01:03:26
like
01:03:22 --> 01:03:28
really really have to sort of uh coming
01:03:26 --> 01:03:30
to terms with the reality of how I look
01:03:28 --> 01:03:32
and how I sound and everybody and but
01:03:30 --> 01:03:35
people often don't right like you have a
01:03:33 --> 01:03:38
distorted view perspective I know that
01:03:36 --> 01:03:40
like I would if I would make a selfie
01:03:38 --> 01:03:41
how I think I look that I that's nice
01:03:40 --> 01:03:42
other people think that's not nice but
01:03:42 --> 01:03:44
then they make a photo of me I'm like
01:03:43 --> 01:03:45
that's super ugly but then they're like
01:03:44 --> 01:03:48
no that's how you look and you look nice
01:03:46 --> 01:03:51
you know so how other people see you is
01:03:49 --> 01:03:53
nice so you need to ask other people to
01:03:52 --> 01:03:54
choose your photos yeah you shouldn't
01:03:54 --> 01:03:56
choose them yourself because you don't
01:03:55 --> 01:03:57
know how you look
01:03:56 --> 01:03:58
yeah you don't know what makes you
01:03:57 --> 01:04:00
interesting what makes you attractive
01:03:59 --> 01:04:03
all this kind of stuff and a lot of us
01:04:00 --> 01:04:05
this is dark aspect of psychology we
01:04:03 --> 01:04:08
focus on some small flaws yeah this why
01:04:06 --> 01:04:09
I hate plastic surgery for example
01:04:08 --> 01:04:10
people try to remove the flaws when the
01:04:10 --> 01:04:12
flaws are the thing that makes you
01:04:11 --> 01:04:14
interesting and attractive I learned
01:04:12 --> 01:04:16
from the hammerhead shark eyes this the
01:04:15 --> 01:04:19
stuff about you that looks ugly to you
01:04:17 --> 01:04:20
and it's probably that What Makes You
01:04:19 --> 01:04:23
original makes you nice and people like
01:04:20 --> 01:04:24
it about you and it's not like oh my God
01:04:23 --> 01:04:26
and people notice it people notice your
01:04:24 --> 01:04:28
Hammer had eyes you know but it's like
01:04:27 --> 01:04:30
that's me that's my face so I'm I love I
01:04:29 --> 01:04:32
love myself and that's confidence and
01:04:30 --> 01:04:34
confidence is attractive yes right
01:04:32 --> 01:04:35
confidence is attractive but yes
01:04:34 --> 01:04:37
understanding what makes you beautiful
01:04:36 --> 01:04:39
it's the breaking of symmetry makes you
01:04:37 --> 01:04:41
beautiful it's the breaking of the the
01:04:40 --> 01:04:44
average face makes you beautiful all
01:04:42 --> 01:04:45
that yeah and obviously different for
01:04:44 --> 01:04:47
men and women at different ages all this
01:04:46 --> 01:04:50
kind of stuff but be Underneath It All
01:04:48 --> 01:04:51
the personality all of that when when
01:04:50 --> 01:04:54
the
01:04:51 --> 01:04:55
face comes alive that also is the thing
01:04:55 --> 01:04:58
that makes you Beau beautiful but anyway
01:04:56 --> 01:05:00
you have to figure all that out with AI
01:04:58 --> 01:05:02
yeah one thing that worked was like um
01:05:01 --> 01:05:05
people would upload full body photos of
01:05:03 --> 01:05:06
themselves so I would crop the face
01:05:05 --> 01:05:07
right because and then the model knew
01:05:06 --> 01:05:09
better that we're training mostly the
01:05:08 --> 01:05:11
face here but then I started losing uh
01:05:10 --> 01:05:12
resemblance of the body because some
01:05:11 --> 01:05:13
people are skinny some people are
01:05:13 --> 01:05:16
muscular whatever so you want to have
01:05:14 --> 01:05:18
that too uh so now I mix full body
01:05:17 --> 01:05:21
photos in the training with face photos
01:05:18 --> 01:05:22
face crops uh and it's all automatic
01:05:21 --> 01:05:26
like um and I know that other people
01:05:23 --> 01:05:27
they they use again AI mod to detect
01:05:26 --> 01:05:29
like what are the best photos in this
01:05:28 --> 01:05:31
training set and then train on those but
01:05:30 --> 01:05:34
it's all it's all about training data
01:05:31 --> 01:05:35
and that's with everything in AI like
01:05:34 --> 01:05:38
how good your training data is is in
01:05:36 --> 01:05:39
many ways more important than how many
01:05:38 --> 01:05:42
steps you train for like how many months
01:05:40 --> 01:05:44
or whatever with these gpus like um the
01:05:43 --> 01:05:46
golds do you have any guidelines for
01:05:44 --> 01:05:48
people of like how to get good data how
01:05:46 --> 01:05:50
to give good data to find tune on like
01:05:48 --> 01:05:52
the photos should be diverse so for
01:05:51 --> 01:05:55
example if I only upload photos with a
01:05:53 --> 01:05:58
brown shirt or green shirt the mulle
01:05:56 --> 01:06:00
think that I'm training the green shirt
01:05:58 --> 01:06:02
so the things that are the same every
01:06:00 --> 01:06:04
photo are the concepts that are trained
01:06:03 --> 01:06:07
what you want is your face to be the
01:06:05 --> 01:06:09
concept that's strains um and everything
01:06:08 --> 01:06:12
else to be diverse like different so
01:06:10 --> 01:06:14
diverse lighting as well diverse yeah
01:06:12 --> 01:06:15
Outside Inside uh but there's no like
01:06:14 --> 01:06:17
this is the problem there's no like
01:06:16 --> 01:06:19
manual for this and nobody knew we were
01:06:18 --> 01:06:21
all just especially two years ago we're
01:06:19 --> 01:06:24
all hacking trying to test anything
01:06:22 --> 01:06:26
anything you can think of and uh it's
01:06:25 --> 01:06:28
frustrating it's one of the most
01:06:26 --> 01:06:31
frustrating and also fun and challenging
01:06:28 --> 01:06:33
things to do because with AI CU it's a
01:06:31 --> 01:06:35
black box and like carpati I think says
01:06:34 --> 01:06:38
this like uh we don't really know how
01:06:36 --> 01:06:40
this thing works but it does something
01:06:39 --> 01:06:43
but nobody really knows why right like
01:06:41 --> 01:06:45
we cannot look into the the model of an
01:06:43 --> 01:06:46
llm like what is actually in there we
01:06:45 --> 01:06:51
just know it's like a 3D Matrix of
01:06:47 --> 01:06:53
numbers right um so it's very
01:06:52 --> 01:06:55
frustrating CU some things you that
01:06:53 --> 01:06:56
would be you think they're obvious that
01:06:55 --> 01:06:58
they will improve things will make them
01:06:57 --> 01:07:01
worse and there's so many parameters you
01:06:58 --> 01:07:03
can tweak so you're testing everything
01:07:01 --> 01:07:05
to you know improve things I mean
01:07:04 --> 01:07:08
there's a whole field now of mechanistic
01:07:06 --> 01:07:10
interpretability that like studies that
01:07:08 --> 01:07:12
tries to figure out tries to break thing
01:07:10 --> 01:07:14
apart and understand how it works but
01:07:12 --> 01:07:17
you know there's also the data side and
01:07:15 --> 01:07:19
the the actual like consumer facing
01:07:18 --> 01:07:20
product side of figuring out how do you
01:07:19 --> 01:07:22
get it to generate a thing that's
01:07:21 --> 01:07:25
beautiful or interesting or naturalistic
01:07:23 --> 01:07:26
all that kind of stuff and you're like
01:07:25 --> 01:07:28
at the Forefront of figuring that out
01:07:26 --> 01:07:31
about the human face and humans really
01:07:28 --> 01:07:32
care about the human face yeah very vain
01:07:32 --> 01:07:34
yeah like me you know like I want to
01:07:33 --> 01:07:37
look good in your podcast for example
01:07:34 --> 01:07:39
yeah for sure and one of the things I
01:07:37 --> 01:07:43
actually would love to uh like
01:07:40 --> 01:07:45
rigorously use Photo AI because for the
01:07:43 --> 01:07:46
thumbnails I take portraits of people I
01:07:45 --> 01:07:48
didn't I don't know shit about
01:07:47 --> 01:07:52
photography uh I basically used your
01:07:49 --> 01:07:55
approach for photography I like Google
01:07:52 --> 01:07:58
how do you take photographs yeah
01:07:55 --> 01:07:59
camera lighting and also it's tough
01:07:58 --> 01:08:01
because maybe you could speak to this
01:08:00 --> 01:08:04
also but like with
01:08:02 --> 01:08:07
photography no offense to any they're
01:08:05 --> 01:08:10
true artists great photographers but
01:08:07 --> 01:08:12
like people like take themselves way too
01:08:10 --> 01:08:14
seriously think you need a whole lot of
01:08:12 --> 01:08:17
equipment you definitely don't want one
01:08:15 --> 01:08:21
light you need like five lights I know
01:08:18 --> 01:08:23
like and you have to have like the
01:08:21 --> 01:08:29
lenses and I talked to to a guy an
01:08:24 --> 01:08:32
expert of uh shaping the sound in a room
01:08:30 --> 01:08:34
okay and cuz I was thinking I'm going to
01:08:32 --> 01:08:37
do a podcast Studio whatever I should
01:08:35 --> 01:08:40
probably like treat the do a sound
01:08:38 --> 01:08:42
treatment on the room and like when he
01:08:41 --> 01:08:44
showed up and analyzed the room he
01:08:43 --> 01:08:46
thought everything I was doing was
01:08:44 --> 01:08:48
horrible and then that's when I realized
01:08:47 --> 01:08:51
like you know what I don't need experts
01:08:49 --> 01:08:53
in my life he kick him out of the house
01:08:52 --> 01:08:54
no I didn't kick him I me I said Thank
01:08:53 --> 01:08:58
you thank you very much thank you great
01:08:55 --> 01:09:01
tips all I just I just felt like there
01:08:59 --> 01:09:03
is you know focus on whatever the
01:09:01 --> 01:09:05
problems are use your own judgment use
01:09:03 --> 01:09:07
your own instincts don't listen to other
01:09:05 --> 01:09:08
people and only consult other people
01:09:07 --> 01:09:11
when there's a specific problem and you
01:09:09 --> 01:09:13
consult them not to offload the problem
01:09:11 --> 01:09:15
onto them but to gain wisdom from their
01:09:13 --> 01:09:16
perspective even if their perspective is
01:09:16 --> 01:09:19
ultimately one you don't agree with
01:09:17 --> 01:09:21
you're going to gain wisdom from that
01:09:19 --> 01:09:25
and just I ultimately come up with like
01:09:21 --> 01:09:27
a PHP solution PHP and jQuery solution
01:09:26 --> 01:09:31
the PHP Studio like have a little
01:09:27 --> 01:09:33
suitcase I use like uh just the the
01:09:31 --> 01:09:36
basic sort of uh consumer type of stuff
01:09:34 --> 01:09:38
one light it's great yeah and look at
01:09:37 --> 01:09:39
you you're like one of the top podcasts
01:09:38 --> 01:09:41
in the world and you get millions of
01:09:40 --> 01:09:43
views and it works and the people that
01:09:42 --> 01:09:45
spend so much money on optimizing for
01:09:44 --> 01:09:47
the best sound for the best studio they
01:09:45 --> 01:09:49
get like 300 views you know so what is
01:09:48 --> 01:09:52
this about this is about that either you
01:09:50 --> 01:09:52
do it really well or also that a lot of
01:09:52 --> 01:09:55
these things don't matter like what
01:09:53 --> 01:09:56
matters is probably the content the
01:09:55 --> 01:09:58
podcast like you get interesting guest
01:09:57 --> 01:10:00
focus on the stuff that matters yeah and
01:09:59 --> 01:10:03
I think that's very common they called
01:10:00 --> 01:10:05
gear acquisition syndrome like gas like
01:10:03 --> 01:10:06
people in any industry do this they just
01:10:05 --> 01:10:07
buy all the stuff there was a meme
01:10:07 --> 01:10:09
recently like you buy what's the name
01:10:08 --> 01:10:11
for the guy that buys all the stuff
01:10:10 --> 01:10:14
before he even started doing the hobby
01:10:11 --> 01:10:14
right um marketing you know marketing
01:10:14 --> 01:10:18
does that to people they want to buy
01:10:15 --> 01:10:20
this stuff yeah but like
01:10:18 --> 01:10:22
man you you can make a you can make a
01:10:20 --> 01:10:24
Hollywood movie on an iPhone you know if
01:10:22 --> 01:10:26
the content is good enough it's it and
01:10:25 --> 01:10:28
it will probably be original because you
01:10:27 --> 01:10:31
would be using an iPhone for it you know
01:10:29 --> 01:10:33
so that said I so the reason I brought
01:10:31 --> 01:10:35
that up with
01:10:33 --> 01:10:37
photography there is wisdom from people
01:10:36 --> 01:10:41
and one of one of the things I realized
01:10:38 --> 01:10:43
you probably also realized this but how
01:10:42 --> 01:10:47
much power light
01:10:43 --> 01:10:49
has to uh to convey emotion you just
01:10:47 --> 01:10:50
take one light and move it around say
01:10:49 --> 01:10:52
you're sitting in the darkness mooving
01:10:50 --> 01:10:54
around your face the different positions
01:10:53 --> 01:10:56
are having a second light potentially
01:10:55 --> 01:10:58
you can play with how a person feels
01:10:57 --> 01:11:00
just from a generic face it's
01:10:59 --> 01:11:02
interesting like you can make people
01:11:00 --> 01:11:03
attractive you can make them ugly you
01:11:02 --> 01:11:07
can make them scary you can make them
01:11:04 --> 01:11:09
lonely all of this and so you kind of
01:11:07 --> 01:11:11
real start to realize this and uh I
01:11:10 --> 01:11:16
would definitely love AI help in uh
01:11:12 --> 01:11:17
creating great portraits of people guest
01:11:16 --> 01:11:20
photos yeah guest photos for example
01:11:18 --> 01:11:21
that's a small use case but for me
01:11:20 --> 01:11:24
that's
01:11:22 --> 01:11:26
a I suppose it's an important use case
01:11:24 --> 01:11:29
because like I want people to look good
01:11:26 --> 01:11:31
but I also want to capture who they are
01:11:30 --> 01:11:34
maybe my conception of who they are what
01:11:32 --> 01:11:36
makes them beautiful what makes their
01:11:34 --> 01:11:37
appearance powerful in some ways
01:11:36 --> 01:11:39
sometimes it's the eyes often times it's
01:11:38 --> 01:11:41
the eyes but there's certain features of
01:11:40 --> 01:11:44
the face can sometimes be really
01:11:41 --> 01:11:45
powerful and I can't it's it's also kind
01:11:44 --> 01:11:49
of awkward for me to take yeah yeah yeah
01:11:46 --> 01:11:52
photographs so I'm not collecting enough
01:11:49 --> 01:11:54
yeah photographs for myself to do it um
01:11:52 --> 01:11:56
with just those photographs if I can
01:11:54 --> 01:11:59
load that off fun to Ai and then start
01:11:56 --> 01:11:59
to play with like lighting you should do
01:11:59 --> 01:12:01
this and you should probably do it
01:12:00 --> 01:12:03
yourself like you can get use photo but
01:12:02 --> 01:12:05
it's even more fun if you do it yourself
01:12:03 --> 01:12:06
so you train the models you can learn
01:12:06 --> 01:12:09
about like control net control net is
01:12:07 --> 01:12:09
where for example your photos and your
01:12:09 --> 01:12:13
podcast are usually like from the angle
01:12:10 --> 01:12:14
right so you can create a control net
01:12:13 --> 01:12:16
face posst that's always like this so
01:12:15 --> 01:12:18
every model every photo you generate
01:12:17 --> 01:12:21
uses this control net uh pose for
01:12:19 --> 01:12:22
example I think it would be very fun for
01:12:21 --> 01:12:24
you to try out that stuff do you play
01:12:23 --> 01:12:26
with lighting at all do you play with
01:12:24 --> 01:12:27
lighting with with man actually this
01:12:26 --> 01:12:30
like this week or recently there's a new
01:12:28 --> 01:12:33
model came out that can adjust the light
01:12:30 --> 01:12:35
of any photo but also AI image uh with
01:12:33 --> 01:12:39
stable diffusion uh I think it's called
01:12:36 --> 01:12:43
relight and it's amazing like you can
01:12:40 --> 01:12:46
you can upload kind of like a a light
01:12:43 --> 01:12:48
map so for example red purple blue and
01:12:46 --> 01:12:50
it uses that light map to change the
01:12:48 --> 01:12:52
light on the photo to you you input it's
01:12:50 --> 01:12:54
amazing so there's for sure a lot of
01:12:52 --> 01:12:56
stuff you can do uh what's your advice
01:12:54 --> 01:12:58
for people people in general on how to
01:12:56 --> 01:13:00
learn all the state-of-the-art AI tools
01:12:59 --> 01:13:03
available like you mentioned new models
01:13:01 --> 01:13:06
coming out all the time yeah like what
01:13:03 --> 01:13:08
how do you pay attention how do you stay
01:13:07 --> 01:13:11
on top of everything I think you need to
01:13:08 --> 01:13:13
join Twitter X you know X is amazing now
01:13:11 --> 01:13:16
and the whole AI industry is on X and
01:13:14 --> 01:13:18
they're all like anime avatars so it's
01:13:17 --> 01:13:20
funny because uh my friends asked me
01:13:19 --> 01:13:22
this like what who should I follow to
01:13:20 --> 01:13:24
stay stay up to date and I say go to x
01:13:22 --> 01:13:27
and follow all the AI anime model that
01:13:25 --> 01:13:29
this person is following or follows and
01:13:28 --> 01:13:30
I sent them some URL and they all start
01:13:29 --> 01:13:33
laughing like what is this but they're
01:13:31 --> 01:13:35
real like people hacking around in AI
01:13:33 --> 01:13:36
they get hired by big companies and
01:13:35 --> 01:13:39
they're on X and most of them are
01:13:37 --> 01:13:43
Anonymous this is very funny they're
01:13:39 --> 01:13:44
they use anime avars um I don't um but
01:13:43 --> 01:13:46
those people hack around and they they
01:13:45 --> 01:13:49
publish what they're discovering um they
01:13:47 --> 01:13:51
talk about papers for example uh so yeah
01:13:50 --> 01:13:54
definitely X it's great I almost
01:13:52 --> 01:13:56
exclusively all the people I follow are
01:13:54 --> 01:13:59
AI people people yeah it's a good time
01:13:56 --> 01:14:02
now it well but also just brings
01:14:00 --> 01:14:06
happiness to my to my soul cuz there's
01:14:03 --> 01:14:08
so much turmoil on Twitter yeah like
01:14:06 --> 01:14:10
politics and stuff there's battles going
01:14:08 --> 01:14:12
on it's like a war zone and it's nice to
01:14:10 --> 01:14:14
just go into this happy place to where
01:14:13 --> 01:14:17
people are building stuff yeah 100% I
01:14:15 --> 01:14:18
like Twitter that for that most like
01:14:17 --> 01:14:21
building stuff like yeah seeing other
01:14:19 --> 01:14:23
cuz it inspires you to build and it's
01:14:22 --> 01:14:25
it's just fun to see other people share
01:14:23 --> 01:14:25
what they're discovering and then
01:14:25 --> 01:14:28
you're like okay I'm going to make
01:14:26 --> 01:14:31
something too it's just super fun and so
01:14:29 --> 01:14:33
if you want to start go on X and then I
01:14:31 --> 01:14:34
would go to replicate and start trying
01:14:33 --> 01:14:36
to play with models and when you have
01:14:35 --> 01:14:38
something that kind of you you manually
01:14:37 --> 01:14:40
enter stuff you set the parameters
01:14:39 --> 01:14:43
something that works you you can make an
01:14:41 --> 01:14:45
app out of it or website can you speak a
01:14:43 --> 01:14:46
little bit more to the process of it
01:14:45 --> 01:14:48
becoming better and better and better
01:14:47 --> 01:14:50
photo yeah so I had this photo and a lot
01:14:49 --> 01:14:52
of people using it there was like a
01:14:50 --> 01:14:56
million or more photos a month being
01:14:52 --> 01:14:58
generated and I discovered I was testing
01:14:56 --> 01:14:59
parameters like increase the step count
01:14:58 --> 01:15:01
of generating a photo or changing the
01:15:00 --> 01:15:04
sampler like a scheduler like you have
01:15:02 --> 01:15:05
DPM two caras all these things I don't
01:15:04 --> 01:15:06
know anything about but I know that you
01:15:06 --> 01:15:09
can choose them when you generate image
01:15:07 --> 01:15:10
and they have different resulting images
01:15:09 --> 01:15:12
but I didn't know which one was were
01:15:11 --> 01:15:14
better so I would do it myself test it
01:15:13 --> 01:15:16
but then I was like why don't I test on
01:15:14 --> 01:15:18
these users because I have a million
01:15:16 --> 01:15:21
photos generated anyway so un like 10%
01:15:18 --> 01:15:23
of the users I would um randomly test
01:15:21 --> 01:15:24
parameters and then I would see if they
01:15:23 --> 01:15:26
would because you can favor it photo or
01:15:25 --> 01:15:29
you can download it I would measure if
01:15:27 --> 01:15:32
they favored or like the photo and then
01:15:30 --> 01:15:34
I would AB test and you test for
01:15:32 --> 01:15:36
significance and stuff uh which
01:15:34 --> 01:15:38
parameters were were better and which
01:15:37 --> 01:15:40
were worse so you're starting to figure
01:15:39 --> 01:15:41
out which Which models are actually
01:15:40 --> 01:15:42
working well and then if it's
01:15:41 --> 01:15:44
significant enough data you switch to
01:15:42 --> 01:15:45
that for the whole you know all the
01:15:44 --> 01:15:47
users and so that was that was like the
01:15:46 --> 01:15:49
Breakthrough to make it better just use
01:15:47 --> 01:15:50
the users to improve it themselves and I
01:15:50 --> 01:15:53
tell them when they sign up we do
01:15:51 --> 01:15:54
sampling we do testing on your photos
01:15:53 --> 01:15:56
with random parameters and that work
01:15:55 --> 01:15:57
really well I don't do a lot of testing
01:15:56 --> 01:15:58
anymore because it's like I kind of
01:15:57 --> 01:16:01
reached like a diminishing point where
01:15:58 --> 01:16:02
it's like it's kind of good um but
01:16:01 --> 01:16:03
that's there was a breakthrough yeah so
01:16:03 --> 01:16:06
it's really about the parameters and
01:16:04 --> 01:16:09
models that CH and letting the
01:16:06 --> 01:16:12
users help do the search in the space of
01:16:10 --> 01:16:15
models and parameters for you yeah but
01:16:13 --> 01:16:18
actually so like stable diff Fusion I
01:16:15 --> 01:16:20
used 1.5 two 2.0 came out as stab Fusion
01:16:18 --> 01:16:22
XL came out all these new versions and
01:16:20 --> 01:16:24
they were all worse and so the core
01:16:22 --> 01:16:25
scene of people are still using 1.5
01:16:24 --> 01:16:27
because it's like it's also not like
01:16:26 --> 01:16:30
what do you call neutered like they they
01:16:28 --> 01:16:33
neutered like to make it super like with
01:16:30 --> 01:16:35
safety features and stuff so most of the
01:16:33 --> 01:16:37
people are still on stable diffusion 1.5
01:16:36 --> 01:16:42
and meanwhile stable diffusion the
01:16:38 --> 01:16:44
company went like the CEO left um a lot
01:16:42 --> 01:16:47
of drama happened because they couldn't
01:16:44 --> 01:16:48
make money and yeah so they gave us it's
01:16:47 --> 01:16:51
very interesting they gave us this this
01:16:49 --> 01:16:52
open source model that everybody uses
01:16:51 --> 01:16:54
they raised like hundreds of millions of
01:16:53 --> 01:16:56
dollars it all they didn't make any
01:16:55 --> 01:16:58
money with it or not a lot they did an
01:16:57 --> 01:17:01
amazing job and now everybody use this
01:16:58 --> 01:17:03
open source model for free and they did
01:17:01 --> 01:17:05
you know it's amazing like it's a it's
01:17:03 --> 01:17:06
amazing you're not even using the latest
01:17:05 --> 01:17:07
one you're say no and the strange thing
01:17:07 --> 01:17:09
is that this company raised hundreds of
01:17:08 --> 01:17:10
millions but the people that are
01:17:09 --> 01:17:13
benefiting from it are really small like
01:17:11 --> 01:17:14
people like me who make these small apps
01:17:13 --> 01:17:16
that are using the model and and now
01:17:15 --> 01:17:17
they're starting to charge money for the
01:17:16 --> 01:17:20
new models but the new models are not so
01:17:17 --> 01:17:22
good for people do not sell open source
01:17:20 --> 01:17:26
right yeah it's interesting because open
01:17:23 --> 01:17:27
source is so impact in the AI space but
01:17:26 --> 01:17:29
you wonder like what is the business
01:17:27 --> 01:17:31
model behind that but it's enabling this
01:17:29 --> 01:17:33
whole ecosystem of companies that yeah
01:17:32 --> 01:17:34
they're using open source models it's
01:17:33 --> 01:17:36
kind of like those Frameworks but then
01:17:35 --> 01:17:39
they didn't you know bribe enough
01:17:37 --> 01:17:41
influencers to use it um and they didn't
01:17:40 --> 01:17:43
charge money for the platform you know
01:17:41 --> 01:17:45
okay so back to your book and the
01:17:43 --> 01:17:49
ideas we didn't even get to the first
01:17:46 --> 01:17:51
step uh generating ideas so you had the
01:17:50 --> 01:17:54
notebook and you're filling it up how do
01:17:52 --> 01:17:56
you know when an idea is a good one like
01:17:55 --> 01:17:59
what you you have this just flood of
01:17:57 --> 01:18:01
ideas how do you pick the one that you
01:17:59 --> 01:18:02
actually try to build man mostly you
01:18:02 --> 01:18:05
don't know like mostly I choose the ones
01:18:03 --> 01:18:06
that are most viable for me to build
01:18:05 --> 01:18:08
like I cannot build a space company now
01:18:07 --> 01:18:10
right would be quite challenging but I
01:18:09 --> 01:18:12
can build something actually write down
01:18:10 --> 01:18:14
like space company no I I think asteroid
01:18:12 --> 01:18:15
mining would be very cool because like
01:18:14 --> 01:18:17
you you go to an asteroid you take some
01:18:16 --> 01:18:20
stuff from there you bring it back you
01:18:18 --> 01:18:22
sell it you know it's but then you need
01:18:21 --> 01:18:24
to do and you can hire someone to launch
01:18:22 --> 01:18:25
the thing so all you need is like the
01:18:24 --> 01:18:28
robot that goes to the asteroid you know
01:18:26 --> 01:18:29
and Robotics interesting like I want to
01:18:28 --> 01:18:31
also learn robotics so maybe that could
01:18:30 --> 01:18:35
be I think both the asteroid Mining and
01:18:32 --> 01:18:35
the robotics is yeah
01:18:37 --> 01:18:43
together I feel like no exactly this is
01:18:40 --> 01:18:44
it this is says we do this not because
01:18:43 --> 01:18:46
it's easy but because we thought it
01:18:45 --> 01:18:50
would be easy exactly that's me with
01:18:47 --> 01:18:51
that's me with Aster mining exactly
01:18:50 --> 01:18:55
that's why I should do this it's not
01:18:52 --> 01:18:57
Nomad list.com it's it's
01:18:55 --> 01:18:59
you have to like build stuff you have to
01:18:57 --> 01:19:01
gravity is really hard to overcome yeah
01:19:00 --> 01:19:02
but it seems man I sound like idiots
01:19:01 --> 01:19:03
probably now but it sounds quite
01:19:03 --> 01:19:05
approachable like relatively
01:19:04 --> 01:19:07
approachable you don't have to build a
01:19:05 --> 01:19:10
rocket you oh you use something like
01:19:07 --> 01:19:12
SpaceX SpaceX to send your your you know
01:19:10 --> 01:19:13
this dog robot or whatever so is there
01:19:12 --> 01:19:15
actually exist a notebook where you
01:19:14 --> 01:19:17
wrote Don estro might no I used back
01:19:15 --> 01:19:19
then I used Trello Trello yeah but now I
01:19:17 --> 01:19:21
don't really I use telegram I write down
01:19:20 --> 01:19:23
like saved messages and I have like idea
01:19:22 --> 01:19:25
I write down you type to yourself on you
01:19:23 --> 01:19:26
know like cuz you use WhatsApp right I
01:19:25 --> 01:19:29
think so you have like message to
01:19:27 --> 01:19:31
yourself thing also yeah so yourself on
01:19:29 --> 01:19:32
telegram yeah you use like a notepad not
01:19:31 --> 01:19:35
forget stuff and then I pinets you know
01:19:33 --> 01:19:37
I love how like you're not using super
01:19:35 --> 01:19:38
complicated systems or whatever you know
01:19:37 --> 01:19:41
people use obsidian now there's a lot of
01:19:39 --> 01:19:44
these um yeah a notion where you have
01:19:42 --> 01:19:47
systems for not taking you're not you're
01:19:45 --> 01:19:49
notepad you're notepad.exe guy if you're
01:19:48 --> 01:19:52
a Windows user man I saw some YouTubers
01:19:50 --> 01:19:54
doing this like there's a lot of these
01:19:52 --> 01:19:56
productivity gurus also and they do this
01:19:54 --> 01:19:58
whole like iPad with a pencil and then I
01:19:57 --> 01:19:59
also had an iPad and I also got the
01:19:58 --> 01:20:02
pencil and I got this app where you can
01:19:59 --> 01:20:04
like draw on paper like um draw like a
01:20:03 --> 01:20:06
calendar you know like like people
01:20:05 --> 01:20:08
students use this and you do coloring
01:20:06 --> 01:20:09
and stuff and I'm like dude I did this
01:20:08 --> 01:20:10
for a week and I'm like what am I doing
01:20:10 --> 01:20:13
with my life like I can just write it as
01:20:11 --> 01:20:15
a message to myself and it's good enough
01:20:13 --> 01:20:17
you know speaking of ideas you shared a
01:20:15 --> 01:20:19
tweet explaining why the first idea
01:20:18 --> 01:20:22
sometimes might be a brilliant idea the
01:20:20 --> 01:20:24
reason for this you think is the first
01:20:22 --> 01:20:26
idea submerges from your subconscious
01:20:25 --> 01:20:27
was actually boiling your brain for
01:20:26 --> 01:20:30
weeks months sometimes years in the
01:20:27 --> 01:20:31
background the eight hours of thinking
01:20:30 --> 01:20:33
can never compete with a Perpetual
01:20:32 --> 01:20:35
subconscious background job so this is
01:20:34 --> 01:20:37
the idea that if you think about an idea
01:20:35 --> 01:20:38
for 8 hours versus like the first idea
01:20:37 --> 01:20:40
that pops into your mind yeah and
01:20:39 --> 01:20:42
sometimes there is
01:20:40 --> 01:20:44
subconscious like stuff that you've been
01:20:43 --> 01:20:47
thinking about for many years that's
01:20:45 --> 01:20:49
really emerges I wrote it wrong because
01:20:47 --> 01:20:50
I don't know I'm not native English but
01:20:49 --> 01:20:53
it emerges from your subconscious right
01:20:51 --> 01:20:55
it comes from the like a water here your
01:20:53 --> 01:20:57
subconscious in here it's boiling and
01:20:55 --> 01:20:59
then when it's ready it's like ding it's
01:20:58 --> 01:21:01
like microwave comes out and there you
01:21:00 --> 01:21:04
have your idea you think you have ideas
01:21:02 --> 01:21:06
like that yeah all the time 100% it's
01:21:04 --> 01:21:08
just stuff that's been like there yes
01:21:06 --> 01:21:10
yeah and I also it comes up and I bring
01:21:08 --> 01:21:12
it I send it back you know like send it
01:21:10 --> 01:21:14
back to the kitchen boil more yeah and
01:21:13 --> 01:21:16
it's like a soup that of ideas that's
01:21:15 --> 01:21:18
cooking it's 100% this is how my brain
01:21:17 --> 01:21:20
works and I think most people but it's
01:21:19 --> 01:21:22
also about the the timing sometimes you
01:21:20 --> 01:21:22
have to send it back not just because
01:21:22 --> 01:21:25
you're not ready but the world is not
01:21:23 --> 01:21:28
ready yeah so many times like starter
01:21:26 --> 01:21:31
fins are too early with their idea yeah
01:21:29 --> 01:21:33
100% robotics is an interesting one for
01:21:31 --> 01:21:35
that because like there's been a lot of
01:21:33 --> 01:21:36
Robotics companies that failed yeah
01:21:35 --> 01:21:37
because it's been very difficult to
01:21:37 --> 01:21:39
build a robotics company make money
01:21:38 --> 01:21:41
because there the manufacturing like the
01:21:40 --> 01:21:45
cost of everything the intelligence of
01:21:41 --> 01:21:46
the robot is enough is not sufficient to
01:21:45 --> 01:21:49
create a compelling enough product from
01:21:47 --> 01:21:51
which to make money so all so there's
01:21:49 --> 01:21:52
this long line of Robotics companies
01:21:51 --> 01:21:55
that' tried they had Big Dreams and they
01:21:53 --> 01:21:56
failed yeah like Boston Dynamics I still
01:21:55 --> 01:21:57
don't know what they're doing but they
01:21:56 --> 01:22:00
always upload YouTube videos and it's
01:21:58 --> 01:22:01
amazing but I feel like a lot of these
01:22:00 --> 01:22:02
companies don't have a it's like a
01:22:02 --> 01:22:05
solution looking for a problem for now
01:22:03 --> 01:22:08
you know military obviously is usess but
01:22:05 --> 01:22:09
like and do I do I need like a robotic
01:22:08 --> 01:22:11
dog now for my house I don't know like
01:22:10 --> 01:22:13
it's fun but it doesn't really solve
01:22:11 --> 01:22:15
anything yet I feel the same kind of
01:22:14 --> 01:22:17
with VR like it's really cool like apple
01:22:16 --> 01:22:20
Vision Pro is very cool doesn't really
01:22:17 --> 01:22:21
solve something for me yet and that's
01:22:20 --> 01:22:23
kind of the the tech looking for a
01:22:21 --> 01:22:24
solution right but one day will when the
01:22:24 --> 01:22:29
person on computer when the Mac came
01:22:25 --> 01:22:29
along there was a big switch that
01:22:29 --> 01:22:32
happened it somehow captivated
01:22:30 --> 01:22:35
everybody's imagination you could like
01:22:33 --> 01:22:38
the application the killer apps became
01:22:36 --> 01:22:39
apparent you can type in a computer but
01:22:38 --> 01:22:40
did they became apparent like
01:22:39 --> 01:22:42
immediately back then they also had like
01:22:40 --> 01:22:45
this thing like we don't need these
01:22:42 --> 01:22:47
computers uh they're like a hype and um
01:22:46 --> 01:22:51
and it also went like in kind of like
01:22:48 --> 01:22:52
you know W yeah yeah but the hype is the
01:22:51 --> 01:22:54
thing that allowed the thing to
01:22:52 --> 01:22:56
proliferate sufficiently to where people
01:22:55 --> 01:22:58
Minds would start opening up to it a
01:22:56 --> 01:22:59
little bit the possibility of right now
01:22:58 --> 01:23:03
for example with the robotics there's
01:23:00 --> 01:23:05
very few robots in the homes of people
01:23:03 --> 01:23:07
exactly yeah the the robots that are
01:23:05 --> 01:23:10
there are roombas so the vacuum cleaners
01:23:07 --> 01:23:12
or they're Amazon Alexa yeah or
01:23:11 --> 01:23:14
dishwasher I mean it's essentially a
01:23:12 --> 01:23:15
robot yes but the the intelligence is
01:23:15 --> 01:23:18
very limited I guess there one way we
01:23:16 --> 01:23:20
can summarize all of them except Alexa
01:23:19 --> 01:23:24
which is pretty intelligent
01:23:21 --> 01:23:26
but uh is is limited with the kind of
01:23:24 --> 01:23:29
ways it interacts with you it's you know
01:23:26 --> 01:23:30
that that's just one example yeah I
01:23:30 --> 01:23:33
sometimes think about that is like if
01:23:31 --> 01:23:37
some people in this world were kind of
01:23:34 --> 01:23:40
born in their whole existence is
01:23:37 --> 01:23:42
like they were meant to build the thing
01:23:41 --> 01:23:46
yeah you know like I sometimes wonder
01:23:43 --> 01:23:47
like what my what I was meant to do you
01:23:46 --> 01:23:48
have these plans for your life you have
01:23:47 --> 01:23:49
these
01:23:48 --> 01:23:54
dreams I think you're meant to build
01:23:50 --> 01:23:57
robots Okay me personally maybe maybe
01:23:55 --> 01:24:00
um that that that's a sense I've I've
01:23:58 --> 01:24:02
had but it could be other things it
01:24:00 --> 01:24:05
could hilariously enough be the thing I
01:24:02 --> 01:24:07
was meant to be is to talk to people
01:24:05 --> 01:24:08
yeah which is weird because I always was
01:24:07 --> 01:24:11
anxious about talking to people it's
01:24:09 --> 01:24:15
like a really yeah I'm scared of this I
01:24:12 --> 01:24:16
scared yeah exactly I'm scared of you
01:24:15 --> 01:24:18
it's just anxiety throughout social
01:24:17 --> 01:24:21
interaction in general I'm an introvert
01:24:18 --> 01:24:22
that hides from the world so yeah it's
01:24:21 --> 01:24:24
really strange yeah but that's that's
01:24:23 --> 01:24:28
also kind of Li like life brings you to
01:24:25 --> 01:24:30
it's very hard to um super intently kind
01:24:29 --> 01:24:32
of choose what you're going to do with
01:24:30 --> 01:24:33
your life it's it it's more like surfing
01:24:32 --> 01:24:35
you're surfing the waves you go in the
01:24:34 --> 01:24:39
in the ocean you see where you end up
01:24:36 --> 01:24:42
you know yeah yeah and there's Universe
01:24:40 --> 01:24:44
has a kind of sense of humor yeah I
01:24:43 --> 01:24:46
guess you have to just yeah allow
01:24:44 --> 01:24:48
yourself to be carried away by the wayes
01:24:46 --> 01:24:50
yeah exactly yeah yeah have you felt
01:24:49 --> 01:24:52
that way in your life yeah all the time
01:24:50 --> 01:24:53
like yeah that's like I think that's the
01:24:52 --> 01:24:55
best way to live your life so whatever
01:24:54 --> 01:24:57
to happen like do you know what you're
01:24:56 --> 01:24:59
doing in the next few years is it
01:24:57 --> 01:25:01
possible that it'll be completely like
01:24:59 --> 01:25:02
changed possibly I I think relationships
01:25:02 --> 01:25:04
like you want to hold relationships
01:25:03 --> 01:25:05
right you want to hold your girlfriend
01:25:04 --> 01:25:08
you want to become wife and all the
01:25:05 --> 01:25:10
stuff but uh you should I think you
01:25:09 --> 01:25:11
should stay open to where like like for
01:25:11 --> 01:25:13
example where you want to live like I
01:25:12 --> 01:25:15
don't know we don't know where we want
01:25:13 --> 01:25:17
to live for example um that's something
01:25:16 --> 01:25:19
that will figure itself out it will
01:25:17 --> 01:25:20
crystallize where you know you will get
01:25:19 --> 01:25:22
you will get sent by the waves to
01:25:21 --> 01:25:24
somewhere where you want to live for
01:25:22 --> 01:25:24
example what you're going to do I think
01:25:24 --> 01:25:27
that's a really good way to live your
01:25:25 --> 01:25:28
life it's I I think most stress comes
01:25:27 --> 01:25:31
from trying to control like hold things
01:25:29 --> 01:25:34
like um it's kind of Buddhist you know
01:25:32 --> 01:25:36
you need to like lose control let it
01:25:34 --> 01:25:37
lose and then things will happen like
01:25:36 --> 01:25:39
when you do mushrooms when you do drugs
01:25:38 --> 01:25:42
like psychedelic drugs the people that
01:25:40 --> 01:25:44
starts that are like control freaks get
01:25:42 --> 01:25:45
bad trips right because you need to let
01:25:44 --> 01:25:48
go like I'm pretty control freak
01:25:46 --> 01:25:51
actually and um when I did mushrooms
01:25:48 --> 01:25:51
when I was 17 I I it was very good and
01:25:51 --> 01:25:53
at the end it wasn't so good cuz I tried
01:25:52 --> 01:25:55
to control was like ah now it's going
01:25:53 --> 01:25:57
too much you now I need to let's stop
01:25:56 --> 01:26:01
bro you can't stop it you need to go
01:25:57 --> 01:26:01
through with it you know and so I think
01:26:01 --> 01:26:04
it's a good manhor for life I think
01:26:02 --> 01:26:07
that's you know very tranquil way to
01:26:04 --> 01:26:07
lead your life yeah actually when I um
01:26:07 --> 01:26:12
took
01:26:08 --> 01:26:14
kaasa that lesson is deeply within me
01:26:12 --> 01:26:15
already that you can't control anything
01:26:14 --> 01:26:19
yes I think I probably learned that the
01:26:16 --> 01:26:21
most in Jiu-Jitsu so just let go and
01:26:19 --> 01:26:22
relax yeah and that's why I had just an
01:26:21 --> 01:26:24
incredible experience there's like
01:26:22 --> 01:26:26
literally no negative aspect to my iasa
01:26:25 --> 01:26:28
experience or any psychedelics I've ever
01:26:27 --> 01:26:31
had some of that could be with my
01:26:29 --> 01:26:33
biology or my genetics whatever but some
01:26:31 --> 01:26:35
of it was just not trying to control and
01:26:33 --> 01:26:36
just surf the way for sure I think most
01:26:35 --> 01:26:40
stress in life comes from trying to
01:26:37 --> 01:26:42
control so once you have the idea yeah
01:26:40 --> 01:26:43
step two build how do you think about
01:26:43 --> 01:26:46
building The Thing Once you have the
01:26:44 --> 01:26:48
idea I think you should build with the
01:26:46 --> 01:26:51
technology that you know so for example
01:26:49 --> 01:26:53
um Nomad list which is like this website
01:26:51 --> 01:26:55
I made to figure out the best cities to
01:26:53 --> 01:26:58
live and work as digital Nomad uh it
01:26:56 --> 01:27:00
wasn't a website it launched as a Google
01:26:58 --> 01:27:02
spreadsheet so it was a public Google
01:27:00 --> 01:27:03
spreadsheet anybody could edit and I was
01:27:02 --> 01:27:05
like I'm collecting like cities where we
01:27:04 --> 01:27:08
we can live as eom with the internet
01:27:06 --> 01:27:11
speed the cost of living um you know
01:27:09 --> 01:27:12
other stuff and I would I tweeted it and
01:27:11 --> 01:27:13
I would and back then I didn't have a
01:27:12 --> 01:27:14
lot of followers I had like a few
01:27:13 --> 01:27:16
thousand followers or something and it
01:27:15 --> 01:27:18
went like viral for my skill viral back
01:27:17 --> 01:27:20
then you know which was like five
01:27:18 --> 01:27:21
retweets and um and a lot of people
01:27:21 --> 01:27:23
started editing it and there was like
01:27:22 --> 01:27:25
hundreds of cities in this list like
01:27:23 --> 01:27:27
from of the world with all the data was
01:27:25 --> 01:27:30
very crowdsourced and then I made that
01:27:28 --> 01:27:33
into a website so figuring out like what
01:27:31 --> 01:27:34
technology you can use that you already
01:27:33 --> 01:27:37
know so if you cannot code you can use a
01:27:34 --> 01:27:39
spreadsheet if you cannot um use a
01:27:37 --> 01:27:41
spreadsheet like whatever you can always
01:27:39 --> 01:27:42
use a for example a website generator
01:27:41 --> 01:27:44
like weeks or something or Squarespace
01:27:43 --> 01:27:47
right like you don't need to code to
01:27:45 --> 01:27:49
build a startup all you need is a idea
01:27:47 --> 01:27:51
for a product um build something like a
01:27:50 --> 01:27:54
landing page or something um put a
01:27:52 --> 01:27:56
stripe button on there and then make it
01:27:55 --> 01:27:58
um and if you can code use the language
01:27:57 --> 01:28:00
that you already you know and start
01:27:58 --> 01:28:01
coding with that and see how far you can
01:28:00 --> 01:28:04
get you can always rewrite the code
01:28:02 --> 01:28:05
later like the tax stack is not actually
01:28:05 --> 01:28:07
it's not the most important of a
01:28:06 --> 01:28:08
business when you're starting out a
01:28:07 --> 01:28:09
business the important thing is that you
01:28:08 --> 01:28:10
validate that there's a market that
01:28:09 --> 01:28:13
there's a product that people want to
01:28:10 --> 01:28:16
pay for um so use whatever you can use
01:28:14 --> 01:28:18
and if you canot code use you know
01:28:17 --> 01:28:20
spreadsheets landing page generators
01:28:19 --> 01:28:22
whatever yeah and the crowdsourcing
01:28:21 --> 01:28:25
element is
01:28:22 --> 01:28:26
fascinating uh it's cool it's cool when
01:28:25 --> 01:28:29
a lot of people start using it you get
01:28:26 --> 01:28:32
to learn so fast yeah uh like i' I've
01:28:30 --> 01:28:34
actually did the spread sheeet thing you
01:28:33 --> 01:28:38
share a spreadsheet
01:28:34 --> 01:28:39
publicly and I made it editable yeah
01:28:38 --> 01:28:41
interesting things start happening yeah
01:28:40 --> 01:28:43
I did it for like a a workout thing cuz
01:28:42 --> 01:28:44
I was doing a large amount of push-ups
01:28:43 --> 01:28:47
and pull-ups every day yeah I remember
01:28:45 --> 01:28:50
this man yeah and like and and IDE
01:28:48 --> 01:28:51
Google Sheets is pretty Limited in that
01:28:50 --> 01:28:54
everything's allowed so people could
01:28:52 --> 01:28:57
just write anything in any and they can
01:28:54 --> 01:28:58
create new uh sheets new tabs and he
01:28:58 --> 01:29:02
just
01:28:59 --> 01:29:04
exploded and uh one of the things that I
01:29:02 --> 01:29:08
really enjoyed is there's very few
01:29:04 --> 01:29:10
trolls um because actually other people
01:29:09 --> 01:29:14
would delete the trolls there would be
01:29:10 --> 01:29:15
like this weird war of like of they they
01:29:14 --> 01:29:17
want like to protect the thing it's an
01:29:16 --> 01:29:19
immune system that's inherent to the
01:29:17 --> 01:29:20
thing it becomes a society you know in a
01:29:19 --> 01:29:21
spreadsheet and then there's the out
01:29:20 --> 01:29:23
Outcast who go to the bottom of the
01:29:22 --> 01:29:25
spreadsheet and they would try to had
01:29:24 --> 01:29:27
messages and they like I don't want to
01:29:26 --> 01:29:29
be with the cool kids up at the top of
01:29:27 --> 01:29:32
the spreadsheet so I'm going the bottom
01:29:29 --> 01:29:34
yes it's fast I mean but that kind of
01:29:32 --> 01:29:37
crowdsourcing element is really powerful
01:29:34 --> 01:29:40
and if you can create a product that use
01:29:37 --> 01:29:41
that as a to his benefit that's that's
01:29:40 --> 01:29:43
really nice like any kind of voting
01:29:42 --> 01:29:45
system any kind of rating system for A
01:29:44 --> 01:29:48
and B testing is really really really
01:29:45 --> 01:29:49
fascinating so anyway so NAD list is
01:29:48 --> 01:29:52
great I would I would love for you to
01:29:50 --> 01:29:54
talk about that but one sort of way to
01:29:52 --> 01:29:58
talk about it is
01:29:54 --> 01:29:59
uh through you building uh Hood Maps
01:29:58 --> 01:30:03
yeah so you've you did an awesome thing
01:30:00 --> 01:30:06
which is document yourself building the
01:30:04 --> 01:30:08
thing and doing so in just a handful of
01:30:06 --> 01:30:09
days like three four five days so people
01:30:08 --> 01:30:12
should je definitely check out the video
01:30:10 --> 01:30:14
in the in the blog post um can you can
01:30:13 --> 01:30:17
you explain what Hood Maps is and what
01:30:14 --> 01:30:17
this whole like this process was so I
01:30:17 --> 01:30:20
was traveling and I was still trying to
01:30:18 --> 01:30:21
find like problems right and I would go
01:30:21 --> 01:30:23
I would I would discover that like
01:30:22 --> 01:30:24
everybody's experience of a city is
01:30:23 --> 01:30:27
different because they stay in different
01:30:24 --> 01:30:28
areas yeah so I'm from Amsterdam and
01:30:27 --> 01:30:30
when I grew up uh in Amsterdam or didn't
01:30:29 --> 01:30:33
grew up but I lived there University I
01:30:31 --> 01:30:35
knew that Center is like in Europe the
01:30:33 --> 01:30:37
centers are always tourist areas so
01:30:35 --> 01:30:39
they're super busy they're not very
01:30:38 --> 01:30:41
authentic the cult they're not really
01:30:39 --> 01:30:42
Dutch culture it's Amsterdam tourist
01:30:41 --> 01:30:44
culture you know so when people would
01:30:43 --> 01:30:47
travel to amam would say don't go to the
01:30:45 --> 01:30:50
center go to you know Southeast um of
01:30:48 --> 01:30:52
the center the yordan or the pipe or
01:30:50 --> 01:30:53
something more hipster areas like a
01:30:52 --> 01:30:55
little more authentic culture of
01:30:54 --> 01:30:57
Amsterdam that's where I would live you
01:30:55 --> 01:30:59
know and where I would go um and I
01:30:58 --> 01:31:01
thought this could be like a app where
01:30:59 --> 01:31:03
you can have like a Google Maps and you
01:31:01 --> 01:31:04
put colors over it you have like areas
01:31:03 --> 01:31:06
that are like color coded like red is
01:31:05 --> 01:31:09
tourist green is Rich you know green
01:31:07 --> 01:31:10
money yellow is hipster you can figure
01:31:10 --> 01:31:12
out where you need to go in a city when
01:31:11 --> 01:31:14
you travel because I was traveling a lot
01:31:12 --> 01:31:16
I wanted to go to the cool spots so just
01:31:14 --> 01:31:18
use color color yeah yeah and I would
01:31:16 --> 01:31:19
use a canvas so I thought okay what do I
01:31:18 --> 01:31:22
need I need to did you know that you
01:31:20 --> 01:31:24
would be using a canvas no I didn't know
01:31:22 --> 01:31:25
it was possible cuz I didn't no some
01:31:24 --> 01:31:26
this is the cool this is the cool thing
01:31:25 --> 01:31:28
people should really check out this how
01:31:27 --> 01:31:32
it started because like you honestly
01:31:29 --> 01:31:34
capture so beautifully the The Humbling
01:31:33 --> 01:31:36
aspects of the embarrassing aspects of
01:31:35 --> 01:31:39
like not knowing what to do it's like
01:31:36 --> 01:31:41
how do I how do I do this and you like
01:31:39 --> 01:31:43
document yourself yeah you're right dude
01:31:42 --> 01:31:46
I feel embarrassed about
01:31:43 --> 01:31:48
myself oh really yeah it's called being
01:31:46 --> 01:31:51
alive nice um so you're like you don't
01:31:49 --> 01:31:54
know anything about so canvas is a way
01:31:51 --> 01:31:57
is HTM yes HTML
01:31:55 --> 01:31:59
five thing that allows you to draw
01:31:57 --> 01:32:00
shapes draw images just draw pixels
01:31:59 --> 01:32:02
essentially so yeah and that's there was
01:32:01 --> 01:32:03
special back then because before you
01:32:03 --> 01:32:06
could only have like elements right so
01:32:04 --> 01:32:08
you want to draw a pixel use a convos
01:32:07 --> 01:32:10
and I knew I needed to draw pixels
01:32:08 --> 01:32:11
because I need to draw these colors and
01:32:10 --> 01:32:14
I thought like okay I'll get like a
01:32:12 --> 01:32:17
Google Maps iframe embed and then I'll
01:32:15 --> 01:32:19
put a div on top of it with the colors
01:32:18 --> 01:32:23
and I'll do like opacity 50 you know so
01:32:19 --> 01:32:24
it kind of shows um so I did that with
01:32:23 --> 01:32:27
convos and then I started drawing um and
01:32:25 --> 01:32:28
then I felt like obviously other people
01:32:27 --> 01:32:31
need to edit this cuz I cannot draw all
01:32:29 --> 01:32:33
these things myself so I crowdsourced it
01:32:31 --> 01:32:35
again and I uh you would draw on the map
01:32:33 --> 01:32:35
and then it would send the pixel data to
01:32:35 --> 01:32:38
the server it would put it in the
01:32:36 --> 01:32:40
database and then I would have a robot
01:32:38 --> 01:32:41
running like a Cron job MH which every
01:32:40 --> 01:32:43
week would calculate or every day would
01:32:42 --> 01:32:47
calculate like okay so mm Center there's
01:32:44 --> 01:32:48
like six people say it's tourist this
01:32:47 --> 01:32:51
part of the center but two people say
01:32:49 --> 01:32:53
it's like hipster okay so the tourist
01:32:52 --> 01:32:56
part wins right it's just an array so so
01:32:53 --> 01:32:58
find the most common value in a little
01:32:56 --> 01:33:00
pixel area on a map so so that so most
01:32:59 --> 01:33:02
people say it's tourist it's tourist and
01:33:00 --> 01:33:04
it becomes redh and I would do that for
01:33:03 --> 01:33:08
you know older GPS Corners in the world
01:33:05 --> 01:33:09
can we just clarify do you have to be as
01:33:08 --> 01:33:11
a human that's contributing to this do
01:33:10 --> 01:33:13
you have to be in that location to make
01:33:11 --> 01:33:15
the label or no people just type in
01:33:13 --> 01:33:16
cities and go like go berserk and start
01:33:15 --> 01:33:17
drawing everywhere would they draw
01:33:17 --> 01:33:19
shapes or would they draw pixels man
01:33:18 --> 01:33:21
they drew that crazy stuff like
01:33:19 --> 01:33:23
offensive symbols I cannot mention they
01:33:21 --> 01:33:25
would draw penises I mean that's
01:33:24 --> 01:33:27
that's obviously a guy I would do the
01:33:26 --> 01:33:29
same thing draw penises that's the first
01:33:27 --> 01:33:30
thing when I show up to Mars and there's
01:33:29 --> 01:33:32
no cameras I'm drawing penis on the same
01:33:31 --> 01:33:34
man I do it in the snow you know but the
01:33:33 --> 01:33:36
penises did not become a problem because
01:33:35 --> 01:33:38
I knew that not everybody would draw a
01:33:36 --> 01:33:40
penis and not in the same place so most
01:33:38 --> 01:33:42
people would use it fairly so just if I
01:33:41 --> 01:33:44
had enough crowdsource data so you have
01:33:43 --> 01:33:46
all these pixels on top of each it's
01:33:44 --> 01:33:48
like a layer of pixels and you choose
01:33:46 --> 01:33:51
the most common pixel so yeah it's just
01:33:49 --> 01:33:54
like a bow but in visual format and it
01:33:51 --> 01:33:56
worked and uh we didn't we had enough
01:33:54 --> 01:33:58
data and and and it was like cities that
01:33:56 --> 01:34:00
did really well like Los Angeles a lot
01:33:59 --> 01:34:03
of people started using it uh like most
01:34:01 --> 01:34:06
datas in Los Angeles because uh Los
01:34:03 --> 01:34:08
Angeles is has defined neighborhoods
01:34:06 --> 01:34:10
yeah and not just in terms of the the
01:34:08 --> 01:34:13
official labels but like what they're
01:34:11 --> 01:34:16
known for yeah what are the do you did
01:34:14 --> 01:34:19
you provide the categories that they
01:34:16 --> 01:34:20
were allowed to use as labels the colors
01:34:19 --> 01:34:22
yeah as colors so it used like I think
01:34:21 --> 01:34:24
you can see there there's like hipster
01:34:22 --> 01:34:25
tourist rich
01:34:24 --> 01:34:26
business so there's always a business
01:34:26 --> 01:34:29
area right and then there's a
01:34:27 --> 01:34:30
residential residential is gray so I
01:34:29 --> 01:34:31
thought those were the most common
01:34:30 --> 01:34:33
things in the city kind of and a little
01:34:32 --> 01:34:36
bit Mimi like it's almost fun to label
01:34:34 --> 01:34:37
it as yeah I mean obviously it's
01:34:36 --> 01:34:38
simplified and but you need to simplify
01:34:38 --> 01:34:40
this stuff you know you don't want to
01:34:39 --> 01:34:42
have too many categories and it's
01:34:40 --> 01:34:43
essentially just like like using a you
01:34:42 --> 01:34:44
know paintbrush where you you select the
01:34:44 --> 01:34:46
color in the bottom you select the
01:34:45 --> 01:34:49
category and you start drawing there's
01:34:47 --> 01:34:51
no instruction there's no manual um and
01:34:50 --> 01:34:54
then I also added tagging so people
01:34:51 --> 01:34:56
could like write something on a specific
01:34:54 --> 01:35:00
location so don't go here or like here's
01:34:57 --> 01:35:02
like um nice cafes and stuff and man the
01:35:01 --> 01:35:04
memes that came from that and I also
01:35:02 --> 01:35:06
added up voting so that the tags could
01:35:05 --> 01:35:08
be upvoted so the memes that came from
01:35:06 --> 01:35:09
that is like amazing like people in Los
01:35:08 --> 01:35:12
Angeles would write crazy stuff it would
01:35:10 --> 01:35:15
go viral in all these cities you can
01:35:12 --> 01:35:17
allow allow your location and it will
01:35:15 --> 01:35:19
probably send you to Austin okay so
01:35:18 --> 01:35:25
we're
01:35:20 --> 01:35:25
looking uh oh boy uh drunk hipster
01:35:27 --> 01:35:33
uh air bro and Bros air bro BR hipster
01:35:31 --> 01:35:36
girls who do cocaine I saw a guy in a
01:35:34 --> 01:35:40
fish costume get beaten up here yep that
01:35:37 --> 01:35:40
seems also ACC overpriced and
01:35:42 --> 01:35:48
underwhelming uh let me see let me make
01:35:44 --> 01:35:47
sure this is accurate uh let's
01:35:49 --> 01:35:54
see 36th for people who know Austin know
01:35:52 --> 01:35:55
that that's
01:35:54 --> 01:35:58
important to label six street is uh
01:35:56 --> 01:36:02
famous in Austin dirty six drunk Fat
01:35:58 --> 01:36:04
Boys accurate drunk Fat Bros continued
01:36:02 --> 01:36:08
on six very well West Sixth drunk douche
01:36:05 --> 01:36:09
Bros go from frat to douche douche I
01:36:08 --> 01:36:13
mean it's very accurate so
01:36:10 --> 01:36:15
far uh they only let hot people live
01:36:13 --> 01:36:18
here
01:36:15 --> 01:36:20
that's I think that might be accurate uh
01:36:18 --> 01:36:21
it's like the
01:36:20 --> 01:36:25
district exercise freaks on the river
01:36:22 --> 01:36:26
yeah that's true dog Runners accurate
01:36:25 --> 01:36:29
saw a guy in the fish costume get beat
01:36:27 --> 01:36:31
up here I want to know the story like so
01:36:30 --> 01:36:33
that's that's all user contributed yeah
01:36:32 --> 01:36:34
and that's like stuff I couldn't come up
01:36:33 --> 01:36:35
with it because I don't know Austin I
01:36:35 --> 01:36:38
don't know the memes here in the
01:36:36 --> 01:36:40
subcultures and then me as a USIC can
01:36:38 --> 01:36:42
upload or downlo this so this is
01:36:41 --> 01:36:45
completely Crown cuz of RIT you know up
01:36:43 --> 01:36:48
down vote took it from there hey that's
01:36:45 --> 01:36:49
really really really powerful single
01:36:48 --> 01:36:51
people dogs accurate at which point did
01:36:50 --> 01:36:53
it go from colors to the actually
01:36:52 --> 01:36:58
showing the text I think I added the
01:36:54 --> 01:36:59
text like a week a week after and uh so
01:36:58 --> 01:37:01
here's like the pixels so that's really
01:37:00 --> 01:37:03
cool the pixels how do you go from that
01:37:01 --> 01:37:04
that's a huge amount of data so there's
01:37:03 --> 01:37:08
yeah uh we're now looking at an image
01:37:05 --> 01:37:10
where it's just a sea of pixels that
01:37:08 --> 01:37:11
call of different colors in in a city so
01:37:10 --> 01:37:13
how do you combine that to be a thing
01:37:12 --> 01:37:15
that actually makes some sense I think
01:37:14 --> 01:37:18
here the problem was that you have this
01:37:15 --> 01:37:20
data but it's like it's not locked to
01:37:18 --> 01:37:22
one location yeah so I had to normalize
01:37:21 --> 01:37:25
it so when you click when you draw on a
01:37:22 --> 01:37:25
map it will show you the specific pixel
01:37:25 --> 01:37:28
location and you can convert the pixel
01:37:26 --> 01:37:29
location to a GPS coordinate right like
01:37:28 --> 01:37:31
latitude longitudes but the number will
01:37:30 --> 01:37:32
have a lot of commas or a lot of
01:37:31 --> 01:37:33
decimals right because it's very
01:37:32 --> 01:37:35
specific like it's like this specific
01:37:34 --> 01:37:37
part of the table so what you want to do
01:37:35 --> 01:37:38
is you want to take that pixel and you
01:37:37 --> 01:37:41
want to normalize it by removing like
01:37:39 --> 01:37:42
decimals um which I discovered so that
01:37:42 --> 01:37:44
you you're talking about this
01:37:43 --> 01:37:46
neighborhood this or this street right
01:37:45 --> 01:37:48
so that's what I did I just took the
01:37:46 --> 01:37:50
decimals off and then I saved it like
01:37:48 --> 01:37:53
this and then it starts um going to like
01:37:51 --> 01:37:56
a grid and then you have like a grid of
01:37:53 --> 01:37:57
data you get like a pixel map kind of
01:37:56 --> 01:38:00
and then you said it looks kind of ugly
01:37:58 --> 01:38:02
so then you smooth it yeah I started
01:38:00 --> 01:38:03
adding blurring and stuff I think now
01:38:02 --> 01:38:05
it's it's not smooth again because I
01:38:04 --> 01:38:07
liked it better people like the pixel
01:38:06 --> 01:38:09
look kind of yeah a lot of people use it
01:38:08 --> 01:38:13
and it keeps going viral and every time
01:38:09 --> 01:38:14
my my maps Bill uh like map box I had to
01:38:13 --> 01:38:17
stop using first used Google Maps it
01:38:15 --> 01:38:20
went viral and Google Maps it was out of
01:38:17 --> 01:38:23
credits so I and I had to so funny
01:38:21 --> 01:38:26
during when I launched it went viral um
01:38:24 --> 01:38:27
Google Maps the map didn't load anymore
01:38:26 --> 01:38:30
it says over the limit you need to
01:38:27 --> 01:38:32
contact Enterprise sales and I'm like I
01:38:30 --> 01:38:33
but I need now like a map so and I don't
01:38:32 --> 01:38:35
want to contact Enterprise sales I don't
01:38:34 --> 01:38:38
want to go on a call schedule with some
01:38:36 --> 01:38:40
calendar so I switched to mapbox and
01:38:38 --> 01:38:43
then had mapbox for years and then it
01:38:40 --> 01:38:45
went viral and I had a bill of $20,000
01:38:43 --> 01:38:47
was like last year um so they helped me
01:38:46 --> 01:38:50
with the bill they said you know you can
01:38:47 --> 01:38:51
pay less and then I now switch to like a
01:38:50 --> 01:38:54
open source kind of um map platform so
01:38:52 --> 01:38:56
it's very expensive project and it never
01:38:54 --> 01:38:57
made any dollar money but it's very fun
01:38:57 --> 01:39:02
but it's very expensive what do you
01:38:58 --> 01:39:03
learn from that so like from that
01:39:02 --> 01:39:06
experience cuz when you leverage
01:39:04 --> 01:39:09
somebody else's through the API yeah I
01:39:07 --> 01:39:12
mean I don't think a map hosting service
01:39:09 --> 01:39:14
should cost this much you know but uh I
01:39:12 --> 01:39:15
could host it myself but that would be I
01:39:14 --> 01:39:18
don't know how to do that you know but I
01:39:16 --> 01:39:20
could do that yes it's super complicated
01:39:19 --> 01:39:21
I think that the thing is more about
01:39:20 --> 01:39:23
like you can't make money with this
01:39:21 --> 01:39:24
project I tried to do many things to
01:39:23 --> 01:39:26
make money with it and it's it's uh it
01:39:25 --> 01:39:28
hasn't worked you talked about like
01:39:27 --> 01:39:31
possibly doing advertisements on it or
01:39:29 --> 01:39:33
some somehow or people sponsoring it
01:39:32 --> 01:39:36
yeah well it's really surprising to me
01:39:33 --> 01:39:37
that people don't want to advertise on
01:39:36 --> 01:39:39
it I think map apps are very hard to
01:39:38 --> 01:39:40
like monetize like Google Maps also
01:39:40 --> 01:39:42
doesn't really make money like sometimes
01:39:41 --> 01:39:44
you see these ads but I don't think
01:39:43 --> 01:39:46
there's a lot of money there um you
01:39:45 --> 01:39:48
could put like a banner ad but it's kind
01:39:46 --> 01:39:49
of ugly and the project is kind of like
01:39:48 --> 01:39:52
it's kind of cool so it's it's kind of
01:39:50 --> 01:39:53
fun to like subsidize it it's kind of a
01:39:53 --> 01:39:56
little bit part of nomad list like I put
01:39:54 --> 01:39:58
it on Nomad list in the cities as well
01:39:56 --> 01:40:00
um but I also realized like you don't
01:39:58 --> 01:40:02
need to monetize everything like some
01:40:00 --> 01:40:06
projects are just cool and you know it's
01:40:03 --> 01:40:08
like it's cool to have Hood Maps exist I
01:40:06 --> 01:40:09
I I want this to exist right yeah
01:40:08 --> 01:40:10
there's a bunch of stuff you've created
01:40:10 --> 01:40:13
that I'm just glad exists in this world
01:40:11 --> 01:40:15
that's true and it's a whole another
01:40:13 --> 01:40:17
puzzle and I'm surprised to figure out
01:40:16 --> 01:40:19
how to make money off of it I'm
01:40:17 --> 01:40:21
surprised Maps don't make money but
01:40:19 --> 01:40:23
you're right it's it's hard it's hard to
01:40:21 --> 01:40:24
make money cuz there's there's a lot of
01:40:23 --> 01:40:26
compute required to actually bring it to
01:40:25 --> 01:40:29
life also where do you put the ad right
01:40:27 --> 01:40:30
like if you have a website you can put
01:40:29 --> 01:40:32
like a ad box or you can do like a
01:40:30 --> 01:40:33
product placement or something but
01:40:32 --> 01:40:36
you're talking about a map app that
01:40:34 --> 01:40:37
where 90% of the interface is a map so
01:40:36 --> 01:40:38
what are you going to do you're going to
01:40:37 --> 01:40:41
like like it's hard to figure out where
01:40:39 --> 01:40:43
is this yeah and people don't want to
01:40:41 --> 01:40:45
pay for it no exactly because if you
01:40:43 --> 01:40:46
make people pay for it you lose 99% of
01:40:46 --> 01:40:49
the user base and you lose the
01:40:47 --> 01:40:51
crowdsource data so it's not fun anymore
01:40:49 --> 01:40:54
it stops being accurate right so you
01:40:52 --> 01:40:57
kind of they pay for it by crowdsourcing
01:40:54 --> 01:40:57
the data but then yeah it's fine you
01:40:57 --> 01:41:02
know it doesn't make money but it's it's
01:40:58 --> 01:41:04
cool but that said NAD list makes money
01:41:02 --> 01:41:07
yeah so what was the story behind Nomad
01:41:04 --> 01:41:08
list so Nomad list started because uh I
01:41:07 --> 01:41:12
was in Chang maai in Thailand which is
01:41:09 --> 01:41:15
now like the second City here and I was
01:41:12 --> 01:41:16
you know working on my laptop um I met
01:41:16 --> 01:41:19
like other NS there and I was like okay
01:41:17 --> 01:41:20
this seems like a cool thing to do like
01:41:19 --> 01:41:23
work on your laptop in a different
01:41:20 --> 01:41:23
country kind of travel around uh but
01:41:23 --> 01:41:26
back then the internet everywhere was
01:41:24 --> 01:41:28
very slow so the internet was fast in
01:41:26 --> 01:41:30
for example Holland or United States but
01:41:29 --> 01:41:33
in a lot of parts in in you know South
01:41:30 --> 01:41:34
America or Asia was very slow like 0.5
01:41:33 --> 01:41:37
megabits so you you couldn't watch a
01:41:35 --> 01:41:40
Youtube video um Thailand weirdly had
01:41:37 --> 01:41:42
like quite fast internet but I wanted to
01:41:40 --> 01:41:45
find like other cities where I could go
01:41:43 --> 01:41:47
to like work on my laptop whatever and
01:41:45 --> 01:41:49
travel and but we needed like fast
01:41:47 --> 01:41:51
internet so I was like let's you know
01:41:50 --> 01:41:53
crowdsource this information uh with a
01:41:52 --> 01:41:54
spreadsheet and I also also needed to
01:41:53 --> 01:41:56
know the cost of living cuz I didn't
01:41:54 --> 01:41:57
have a lot of money I had $500 a month
01:41:56 --> 01:41:59
so I had to find a place where like the
01:41:57 --> 01:41:59
rent was like you know $200 per month or
01:41:59 --> 01:42:02
something where I had you know some
01:42:00 --> 01:42:05
money uh that I could actually rent
01:42:02 --> 01:42:07
something and um and there was NAD list
01:42:06 --> 01:42:10
and it still runs now I think it's now
01:42:08 --> 01:42:12
almost 10 years so just to describe how
01:42:10 --> 01:42:14
it works like I'm looking at Chang ma
01:42:12 --> 01:42:15
here there's a total score it's rank
01:42:15 --> 01:42:20
number two yeah that's like a number
01:42:16 --> 01:42:22
score 4.82 uh like by members but it's
01:42:21 --> 01:42:26
uh it's looking at the internet in this
01:42:23 --> 01:42:30
case it's fast yeah fun temperature
01:42:26 --> 01:42:34
humidity air quality safety food safety
01:42:31 --> 01:42:37
uh crime racism or lack of crime lack of
01:42:35 --> 01:42:39
racism educational level power grid
01:42:37 --> 01:42:40
vulnerability to climate change income
01:42:39 --> 01:42:42
level it's a little much you know
01:42:41 --> 01:42:45
English speak it's awesome it's awesome
01:42:43 --> 01:42:46
walkability keep adding stuff cuz for
01:42:45 --> 01:42:48
certain groups of people certain things
01:42:46 --> 01:42:50
really matter and this is really cool
01:42:49 --> 01:42:54
happiness I'd love to ask about that not
01:42:51 --> 01:42:57
life free Wii by
01:42:54 --> 01:42:59
AC uh female friendly freedom of speech
01:42:58 --> 01:43:01
AP and not so good in tit you know
01:43:00 --> 01:43:04
values derived from National statistics
01:43:02 --> 01:43:05
my yeah I like how that one has I need
01:43:04 --> 01:43:06
to do that because the the data sets are
01:43:06 --> 01:43:08
usually National they're not on City
01:43:07 --> 01:43:09
level right so I don't know about the
01:43:08 --> 01:43:11
freedom of speech between Bangkok or
01:43:10 --> 01:43:14
changai I know in Thailand I mean this
01:43:12 --> 01:43:16
is really fascinating so this is for
01:43:14 --> 01:43:17
City yeah it's basically raiding all the
01:43:16 --> 01:43:20
different things that matter to you in
01:43:18 --> 01:43:23
Internet and this is all crowdsourced
01:43:21 --> 01:43:27
well so it started crowdsourced but then
01:43:23 --> 01:43:29
um I realized that you can download more
01:43:28 --> 01:43:31
accurate data sets from like public
01:43:30 --> 01:43:34
Source like World Bank they have a lot
01:43:32 --> 01:43:36
of public data sets United Nations and
01:43:34 --> 01:43:38
you can download a lot of data there
01:43:36 --> 01:43:39
which you can you know freely use like I
01:43:38 --> 01:43:41
I started getting FR cross data where
01:43:40 --> 01:43:45
for example people from India they
01:43:42 --> 01:43:47
really love India and they would submit
01:43:45 --> 01:43:48
the best scores for everything in India
01:43:47 --> 01:43:50
and not just like one person but like a
01:43:49 --> 01:43:53
lot of people they would love to pump
01:43:50 --> 01:43:55
India and I'm like I love India too you
01:43:53 --> 01:43:57
know but uh that's not valid data so you
01:43:56 --> 01:43:59
started getting discrepancy in the data
01:43:57 --> 01:44:01
between people where people wear from
01:43:59 --> 01:44:04
and stuff so I I started switching to
01:44:01 --> 01:44:04
data sets and um and now it's mostly
01:44:04 --> 01:44:07
data sets but one thing that's still
01:44:05 --> 01:44:09
crowdsource is so people add where they
01:44:07 --> 01:44:11
are they add their travels to their
01:44:09 --> 01:44:14
profile and I use that data to see which
01:44:12 --> 01:44:16
plac are upcoming and which places are
01:44:14 --> 01:44:18
popular now so about half the ranking
01:44:16 --> 01:44:19
you see here is based on actual digital
01:44:18 --> 01:44:21
NAD who are there you can click on a
01:44:20 --> 01:44:22
city you can click on people and you can
01:44:22 --> 01:44:25
see the people the users that are
01:44:23 --> 01:44:27
actually there and it's like 30,000 or
01:44:25 --> 01:44:29
40,000 members so these people are in
01:44:28 --> 01:44:32
Austin now and 1,800 remote work is in
01:44:30 --> 01:44:34
Austin now now of which eight plus
01:44:32 --> 01:44:37
members checked in U members who will be
01:44:35 --> 01:44:39
here soon and go yeah so we have meetups
01:44:37 --> 01:44:41
so people organize their own meetups and
01:44:39 --> 01:44:43
we have about I think like 30 30 per
01:44:42 --> 01:44:45
month so it's like one Meetup a day and
01:44:44 --> 01:44:48
I don't do anything they organize
01:44:46 --> 01:44:51
themselves so I just it's a whole Black
01:44:49 --> 01:44:53
Box it just runs and I don't do a lot on
01:44:51 --> 01:44:54
it it pulls data from everywhere and it
01:44:53 --> 01:44:57
just
01:44:55 --> 01:44:59
works cons of Austin is too expensive
01:44:58 --> 01:45:00
very sweaty and humid now difficult to
01:44:59 --> 01:45:01
make friends difficult to make friends
01:45:00 --> 01:45:03
interesting right I didn't know that
01:45:02 --> 01:45:08
difficult to make friends Austin but
01:45:04 --> 01:45:09
this all crowd but mostly it's Pros uh
01:45:08 --> 01:45:11
safe fast internet I don't understand
01:45:10 --> 01:45:15
why it says not safe for women to check
01:45:12 --> 01:45:16
the data set it feels safe the problem
01:45:15 --> 01:45:18
with a lot of places like United States
01:45:16 --> 01:45:19
is that it depends per area right so if
01:45:18 --> 01:45:22
you get like City level data or Nation
01:45:20 --> 01:45:25
level data it's like Brazil's worst
01:45:23 --> 01:45:29
because the the range in like safe and
01:45:26 --> 01:45:30
wealthy and and not safe is like huge so
01:45:29 --> 01:45:32
you can't say many things about Brazil
01:45:31 --> 01:45:35
so once they actually show up to the
01:45:32 --> 01:45:36
city how do you figure out what uh what
01:45:35 --> 01:45:38
area like where to get fast internet for
01:45:37 --> 01:45:40
example like for me is all it's
01:45:39 --> 01:45:44
consistently a struggle to figure out
01:45:41 --> 01:45:46
like hotels with fast Wi-Fi for example
01:45:44 --> 01:45:48
like a place okay okay I show up to a
01:45:46 --> 01:45:49
city there's a lot of fascinating
01:45:48 --> 01:45:51
puzzles and I haven't figured out a way
01:45:50 --> 01:45:54
to actually solve this puzzle when I
01:45:52 --> 01:45:57
show up to City figuring out where I can
01:45:55 --> 01:46:00
get fast internet
01:45:57 --> 01:46:02
connection and uh for podcasting
01:46:00 --> 01:46:05
purposes where I can find a place with a
01:46:03 --> 01:46:08
table that's quiet right that's not easy
01:46:06 --> 01:46:10
construction sounds all kinds of sounds
01:46:08 --> 01:46:12
you have to learn about all the sources
01:46:10 --> 01:46:15
of sounds in the world and also like the
01:46:12 --> 01:46:17
the quality of the room because the more
01:46:16 --> 01:46:21
um the the emptier of the room and like
01:46:18 --> 01:46:21
if it's just walls without any curtains
01:46:21 --> 01:46:23
or any of this kind of stuff then
01:46:22 --> 01:46:26
there's
01:46:23 --> 01:46:27
uh echo in the room anyway but you you
01:46:26 --> 01:46:29
figure out that a lot of hotels don't
01:46:27 --> 01:46:30
have tables they don't have like normal
01:46:29 --> 01:46:33
this weird desk right yeah they have
01:46:31 --> 01:46:36
it's not a center table yep and if you
01:46:34 --> 01:46:38
want to get a nicer hotel where it's
01:46:37 --> 01:46:40
more spacious and so on they usually
01:46:39 --> 01:46:43
have these like Boutique like fancy
01:46:41 --> 01:46:45
looking like modernist annoy tables that
01:46:44 --> 01:46:47
don't it's too Desy it's too design
01:46:46 --> 01:46:50
they're not really real tables why don't
01:46:47 --> 01:46:52
you get Ikea buy Ikea yeah before you
01:46:51 --> 01:46:54
arrive you order an Ikea like n this
01:46:53 --> 01:46:56
they get desks I feel like you should be
01:46:54 --> 01:46:57
able to show up to a place and have have
01:46:56 --> 01:47:00
the desk like it's not unless you stay
01:46:58 --> 01:47:03
there for a long time just the entire
01:47:01 --> 01:47:06
assembly all that Airbnb is so
01:47:04 --> 01:47:09
unreliable it's the the the range and
01:47:06 --> 01:47:12
quality that you get is is is
01:47:09 --> 01:47:13
huge hotels have a lot of problems pros
01:47:13 --> 01:47:16
and cons like hotels have the problem
01:47:14 --> 01:47:17
that the pictures somehow never have
01:47:17 --> 01:47:19
good representative pictures of what's
01:47:18 --> 01:47:21
actually going to be in the room and
01:47:19 --> 01:47:24
that's a problem like and you fake
01:47:22 --> 01:47:26
photos man if I could have the kind of
01:47:24 --> 01:47:27
data you have on NAD list for hotels
01:47:27 --> 01:47:30
yeah man I would and I feel like you can
01:47:28 --> 01:47:31
make a lot of money on that too yeah the
01:47:30 --> 01:47:33
booking fees affiliate right I thought
01:47:31 --> 01:47:35
about this idea because we have the same
01:47:33 --> 01:47:37
problem like I go to hotels and there's
01:47:35 --> 01:47:38
specific ones that are very good and I
01:47:37 --> 01:47:41
know now the chains and stuff and but
01:47:39 --> 01:47:43
even even if you go some chains are very
01:47:42 --> 01:47:45
bad in a specific City and very good in
01:47:43 --> 01:47:47
other cities and each individual hotel
01:47:46 --> 01:47:50
has a lot of kinds of rooms yeah like
01:47:48 --> 01:47:51
you you some are more expensive some are
01:47:50 --> 01:47:52
cheaper and so on but you can get the
01:47:52 --> 01:47:55
details
01:47:53 --> 01:47:57
of what's in the room like what's the
01:47:55 --> 01:47:59
actual layout of the room what is the
01:47:57 --> 01:48:01
view of the rooman I feel like as a
01:47:59 --> 01:48:04
hotel you can win a lot so first you
01:48:01 --> 01:48:06
create a service that allows you to have
01:48:05 --> 01:48:09
like high resolution data about a hotel
01:48:07 --> 01:48:11
then one hotel sign signs up for that I
01:48:09 --> 01:48:13
would 100% use that website to look for
01:48:12 --> 01:48:16
a hotel instead of the crappy
01:48:14 --> 01:48:17
Alternatives that don't give any
01:48:16 --> 01:48:19
information and I feel like there'll be
01:48:17 --> 01:48:21
this pressure for all the hotels to join
01:48:19 --> 01:48:23
that site and you can make a shit ton of
01:48:22 --> 01:48:25
money cuz hotels make a lot of money I
01:48:24 --> 01:48:26
think it's true but the problem is with
01:48:25 --> 01:48:28
these hotels like it's it's same with
01:48:26 --> 01:48:29
airline industry why does every Airline
01:48:28 --> 01:48:31
website suck when you try book book a
01:48:30 --> 01:48:32
flights yeah it's like very strange like
01:48:31 --> 01:48:33
why does it have to suck obviously
01:48:32 --> 01:48:35
there's competition here why doesn't the
01:48:34 --> 01:48:37
best website win what's the explanation
01:48:36 --> 01:48:39
of that man I thought about this for
01:48:37 --> 01:48:41
years so I think it's like I have to
01:48:39 --> 01:48:42
book the flight anyway like I know
01:48:41 --> 01:48:44
there's a route that they take and I
01:48:43 --> 01:48:46
need like I need to buy book for example
01:48:44 --> 01:48:47
Qatar airlines and I and I need to get
01:48:47 --> 01:48:50
through this process
01:48:48 --> 01:48:53
so the the the and with a hotel is
01:48:50 --> 01:48:54
similar you need a hotel anyway so so do
01:48:53 --> 01:48:56
you have time to like figure out the
01:48:55 --> 01:48:58
best one not really you kind of just
01:48:57 --> 01:49:00
need to get the place booked and you
01:48:58 --> 01:49:01
know you need to get the flight and
01:49:01 --> 01:49:04
you'll go through the pain of this
01:49:02 --> 01:49:04
process and that's why this process
01:49:04 --> 01:49:07
always sucks so much with hotels and
01:49:05 --> 01:49:09
Airline websites and stuff because they
01:49:07 --> 01:49:11
don't have an incentive to improve it
01:49:09 --> 01:49:13
because generally only for like a super
01:49:12 --> 01:49:16
upper segment of the market I think like
01:49:13 --> 01:49:18
super high luxury it affects the actual
01:49:16 --> 01:49:20
booking right I don't know I think that
01:49:18 --> 01:49:21
that's a good interesting Theory I think
01:49:20 --> 01:49:24
that must be a different Theory my my
01:49:22 --> 01:49:26
theory would would be that great
01:49:24 --> 01:49:27
Engineers like great software Engineers
01:49:26 --> 01:49:29
are not allowed to make changes yeah
01:49:28 --> 01:49:31
basically like there's some kind of
01:49:30 --> 01:49:33
bureaucracy there's way too many
01:49:31 --> 01:49:35
managers there's a lot of
01:49:33 --> 01:49:37
bureaucracy and uh great Engineers show
01:49:36 --> 01:49:39
up they try to work there and they
01:49:37 --> 01:49:40
they're not allowed to really make any
01:49:39 --> 01:49:42
contributions and then they leave and so
01:49:40 --> 01:49:43
you have a lot of mediocre software
01:49:42 --> 01:49:45
Engineers they're not really interested
01:49:44 --> 01:49:47
in improving any of the thing and like
01:49:45 --> 01:49:48
literally they would like to improve the
01:49:47 --> 01:49:51
stuff but the
01:49:49 --> 01:49:54
bureaucracy um of the place plus all the
01:49:52 --> 01:49:56
bosses is all the high up people are not
01:49:54 --> 01:49:57
technical people probably they don't
01:49:56 --> 01:50:00
know much about web web dev they don't
01:49:58 --> 01:50:03
know much about programming so they just
01:50:01 --> 01:50:06
don't give any respect like you have to
01:50:03 --> 01:50:07
give the freedom and the respect to
01:50:06 --> 01:50:10
Great Engineers as they try to do great
01:50:08 --> 01:50:12
things that feels like an explanation
01:50:11 --> 01:50:15
like if you were a great programmer
01:50:13 --> 01:50:19
would you want to work at America
01:50:15 --> 01:50:22
Airlines or no no I'm I'm torn on that
01:50:19 --> 01:50:24
cuz I I actually as somebody lost
01:50:23 --> 01:50:27
program would love to work at America
01:50:25 --> 01:50:28
Airlines so I can make the thing better
01:50:27 --> 01:50:30
yeah but for I would I would work there
01:50:29 --> 01:50:33
just to fix it for myself you know yeah
01:50:30 --> 01:50:35
for yourself and then you just know how
01:50:33 --> 01:50:38
much suffering you alleviated how
01:50:36 --> 01:50:40
much just oh you imagine all the
01:50:39 --> 01:50:43
thousands maybe millions of people that
01:50:41 --> 01:50:45
go to that website and have to click
01:50:43 --> 01:50:46
like a million times it often doesn't
01:50:45 --> 01:50:49
work it's clunky all that kind of stuff
01:50:47 --> 01:50:51
you you're making their life just so
01:50:49 --> 01:50:52
much better yeah but there there must be
01:50:52 --> 01:50:55
an explanation has to do with managers
01:50:53 --> 01:50:56
and bureaucracies like I don't I think
01:50:55 --> 01:50:58
it's money do you know
01:50:56 --> 01:50:59
booking.com sure so it's the boooking
01:50:59 --> 01:51:02
it's the biggest boooking website in the
01:51:00 --> 01:51:04
world it's dutch actually and um they
01:51:02 --> 01:51:05
have teams CU my friend worked there
01:51:04 --> 01:51:08
they have teams for a specific part of
01:51:06 --> 01:51:11
the website like a 10 by 10 pixels area
01:51:09 --> 01:51:12
where they they run tests on this so
01:51:11 --> 01:51:13
they run tests like and they're famous
01:51:12 --> 01:51:14
for this stuff like oh there's only one
01:51:14 --> 01:51:18
room left right with this red letter
01:51:15 --> 01:51:18
it's like one room left book now you
01:51:18 --> 01:51:20
know and they got a fine from the
01:51:19 --> 01:51:22
European Union about this kind of
01:51:20 --> 01:51:23
interesting so they have all these teams
01:51:22 --> 01:51:24
and they run the test for 24 hours they
01:51:23 --> 01:51:25
go to sleep they wake up next day they
01:51:25 --> 01:51:28
come to the office and they see okay
01:51:26 --> 01:51:30
this performed better this website has
01:51:28 --> 01:51:32
become a monster but it's the most
01:51:31 --> 01:51:35
Revenue generating hotel booking website
01:51:32 --> 01:51:36
in the world is number one so that shows
01:51:35 --> 01:51:39
that it's not about like user experience
01:51:37 --> 01:51:41
it's about like I don't know about
01:51:40 --> 01:51:44
making more money and you know not every
01:51:41 --> 01:51:44
company but you know if they if if
01:51:44 --> 01:51:46
they're optimizing it's a public company
01:51:45 --> 01:51:48
if they're optimizing for money but you
01:51:47 --> 01:51:50
can optimize for money by disrupting
01:51:49 --> 01:51:51
like making it way better yeah but it's
01:51:50 --> 01:51:52
always startups they start with
01:51:52 --> 01:51:56
disrupting like booking also started
01:51:53 --> 01:51:57
startup 1997 and then they become like
01:51:56 --> 01:52:00
the old shit again like you know Uber
01:51:58 --> 01:52:01
now starts to become like a taxi again
01:52:00 --> 01:52:03
right it was very good in the beginning
01:52:01 --> 01:52:04
now it's kind of like taxis now in many
01:52:03 --> 01:52:07
places are better they're nicer than
01:52:05 --> 01:52:10
Ubers right so it's like the circle I
01:52:08 --> 01:52:13
think some of it is also just it's hard
01:52:11 --> 01:52:17
to have Ultra competent Engineers yeah
01:52:14 --> 01:52:19
like stripe seems like a trivial thing
01:52:17 --> 01:52:21
but it it's hard to pull off like why
01:52:20 --> 01:52:24
was it so hard for Amazon to have buy
01:52:22 --> 01:52:27
with one click which I think is a genius
01:52:24 --> 01:52:30
idea make buying easier
01:52:27 --> 01:52:32
like make it as as frictional as as
01:52:30 --> 01:52:34
possible just click a button once and
01:52:32 --> 01:52:36
you bought the thing yeah as opposed to
01:52:35 --> 01:52:38
most of the web was a lot of clicking
01:52:37 --> 01:52:40
and it often doesn't work like with the
01:52:39 --> 01:52:43
airlines remember the forms would delete
01:52:41 --> 01:52:45
you could CLI next submit and would 404
01:52:43 --> 01:52:47
or something or your internet would go
01:52:45 --> 01:52:49
down your modem yeah man and I would
01:52:47 --> 01:52:50
have an existential crisis like the
01:52:49 --> 01:52:52
frustration would take over my whole
01:52:51 --> 01:52:55
body and I just wanted to quit life for
01:52:53 --> 01:52:57
a brief moment there yeah yeah I'm so
01:52:56 --> 01:53:00
happy to form stays in Google Chrome now
01:52:57 --> 01:53:01
when something goes wrong but that's so
01:53:00 --> 01:53:04
Google somebody did Google improv
01:53:02 --> 01:53:06
Society with that right yeah and one of
01:53:05 --> 01:53:08
the challenges of Google is to have the
01:53:07 --> 01:53:11
freedom to do that they don't anymore
01:53:09 --> 01:53:13
there's a bunch of bureaucracy yeah go
01:53:11 --> 01:53:16
there's so many brilliant brilliant
01:53:13 --> 01:53:18
people there but it just moves slowly
01:53:16 --> 01:53:21
yeah I wonder why that is maybe that's
01:53:18 --> 01:53:22
the natural way of a company but you
01:53:21 --> 01:53:24
have people like Elon who rolls in and
01:53:22 --> 01:53:26
just fir most most of the folks and
01:53:24 --> 01:53:27
always oper like push the company to
01:53:26 --> 01:53:29
operate as a startup even when it's
01:53:28 --> 01:53:31
already big yeah but I mean Apple does
01:53:30 --> 01:53:34
this I like I started in business school
01:53:31 --> 01:53:35
Apple does competing product teams that
01:53:34 --> 01:53:37
operate as startups so three to five
01:53:36 --> 01:53:39
people they make something they have
01:53:37 --> 01:53:40
multiple teams who make the same thing
01:53:39 --> 01:53:42
the best team wins so you need to I
01:53:41 --> 01:53:44
think you need to emulate like a a free
01:53:43 --> 01:53:46
market inside a company to make it
01:53:45 --> 01:53:48
entrepreneurial you know yeah and you
01:53:46 --> 01:53:50
need entrepreneurial mentality in a
01:53:49 --> 01:53:53
company to to come up with new ideas and
01:53:51 --> 01:53:56
do it better so one of the things you do
01:53:53 --> 01:53:58
really really well is learn a new thing
01:53:56 --> 01:54:00
like you're trying to you have an idea
01:53:58 --> 01:54:02
you try to build it and then you learn
01:54:01 --> 01:54:04
everything you need to in order to build
01:54:02 --> 01:54:05
it you have your current skills but you
01:54:04 --> 01:54:07
need learn just the minimal amount of
01:54:06 --> 01:54:10
stuff so you're a good person to ask
01:54:08 --> 01:54:13
like what how do you
01:54:11 --> 01:54:14
learn how do how do you learn quickly
01:54:13 --> 01:54:17
and effectively in just the stuff you
01:54:14 --> 01:54:20
need you did um just by way of example
01:54:17 --> 01:54:21
you did a 30 days learning session on 3D
01:54:20 --> 01:54:23
yeah where you documented yourself
01:54:22 --> 01:54:25
giving yourself only 30 days to learn
01:54:24 --> 01:54:27
everything you can about yeah I tried to
01:54:25 --> 01:54:28
learn virtual reality CU I was like this
01:54:27 --> 01:54:32
was like same as AI it came up Suddenly
01:54:29 --> 01:54:35
like 2016 2017 with I think HTC VI this
01:54:32 --> 01:54:35
big VR glasses before Apple Vision Pro
01:54:35 --> 01:54:38
and I was like oh this is going to be
01:54:36 --> 01:54:40
big so I need to learn this so I I know
01:54:38 --> 01:54:43
I know nothing about 3D I installed like
01:54:41 --> 01:54:44
um I think unity and like blender and
01:54:43 --> 01:54:45
stuff and I started learning all this
01:54:44 --> 01:54:48
stuff
01:54:46 --> 01:54:50
um because I thought this was like a new
01:54:49 --> 01:54:53
you know n technology that was going to
01:54:50 --> 01:54:55
be big and if I had to skill for it uh I
01:54:53 --> 01:54:57
could use this to build stuff and so I
01:54:56 --> 01:54:59
think with learning for me it's like it
01:54:58 --> 01:55:00
I think learning is so funny because
01:54:59 --> 01:55:02
people always ask me like how how do I
01:55:01 --> 01:55:04
how do you learn to code like should I
01:55:02 --> 01:55:05
learn to code and I'm like I don't know
01:55:04 --> 01:55:06
like I'm Every Day I'm learning it's
01:55:06 --> 01:55:08
kind of cliche but every day I'm
01:55:07 --> 01:55:10
learning new stuff so every day I'm
01:55:09 --> 01:55:12
searching on Google or asking out cat
01:55:10 --> 01:55:13
gbt how to do this thing how to do this
01:55:12 --> 01:55:16
thing every day I'm getting better at my
01:55:14 --> 01:55:18
skill so you never stop learning so the
01:55:17 --> 01:55:19
whole concept of like how do you learn
01:55:18 --> 01:55:21
well you never end so where do you want
01:55:20 --> 01:55:23
to be do you want to know a little bit
01:55:22 --> 01:55:25
do do you want to know a lot do you want
01:55:23 --> 01:55:26
to do it for your whole life or so I
01:55:25 --> 01:55:30
think taking action is the best step to
01:55:27 --> 01:55:32
learn so making things like you know
01:55:31 --> 01:55:34
nothing just start making things okay so
01:55:33 --> 01:55:36
like how to make a website search how to
01:55:35 --> 01:55:38
make a website or nowadays you ask jbt
01:55:37 --> 01:55:40
how do I make a website where do I start
01:55:38 --> 01:55:41
it generates codes for you right copy
01:55:40 --> 01:55:43
the code put it in a file save it open
01:55:41 --> 01:55:45
it in Google Chrome or whatever you have
01:55:43 --> 01:55:46
a website and then you start tweaking
01:55:45 --> 01:55:49
with it and you start okay how do I add
01:55:47 --> 01:55:52
a button how do I add AI features right
01:55:50 --> 01:55:54
like nowadays so it's like by taking
01:55:52 --> 01:55:57
action you can learn stuffff much faster
01:55:55 --> 01:56:00
than reading books or actually I'm
01:55:58 --> 01:56:01
curious let me ask perplexity how do I
01:56:00 --> 01:56:04
make a
01:56:01 --> 01:56:07
website I'm just curious what it would
01:56:05 --> 01:56:10
say I hope it goes with like really
01:56:07 --> 01:56:11
basic vanilla Solutions Define your
01:56:10 --> 01:56:14
website's purpose choose a domain name
01:56:12 --> 01:56:17
select a web hosting provider choose a
01:56:14 --> 01:56:18
website or Builder or CMS website build
01:56:17 --> 01:56:22
platform like wi for Squarespace is what
01:56:19 --> 01:56:24
I said yeah landing page
01:56:22 --> 01:56:27
what what do I how do I say if I want to
01:56:24 --> 01:56:29
programming it program it myself design
01:56:27 --> 01:56:30
your website create essential Pages yeah
01:56:29 --> 01:56:32
even tells you to launch it right like
01:56:31 --> 01:56:34
start your website cool well I mean you
01:56:33 --> 01:56:36
could do that yeah but this is literally
01:56:35 --> 01:56:37
it like it's this is if you want to make
01:56:36 --> 01:56:39
a this is the basic like Google
01:56:37 --> 01:56:42
analytics but you can't make Nomad list
01:56:39 --> 01:56:43
with this way so with Wix like with ah
01:56:43 --> 01:56:46
no you can you can get pretty far I
01:56:44 --> 01:56:47
think these website Builders are pretty
01:56:46 --> 01:56:49
Advanced like all you need is a grid of
01:56:48 --> 01:56:52
images right that are clickable that
01:56:50 --> 01:56:57
open like another page yeah you can can
01:56:52 --> 01:56:57
get quite far how do I learn to
01:56:59 --> 01:57:05
program choose a programming language to
01:57:02 --> 01:57:08
start with yeah free code Camp is
01:57:05 --> 01:57:10
good work through a resources
01:57:08 --> 01:57:13
systematically practice coing regularly
01:57:11 --> 01:57:15
for 30 60 minutes a day consistency key
01:57:14 --> 01:57:16
join programming communities like
01:57:15 --> 01:57:19
reddits
01:57:17 --> 01:57:21
yeah yeah it's pretty it's pretty good
01:57:20 --> 01:57:23
yeah it's pretty good so I think it's
01:57:21 --> 01:57:24
it's a very good starting ground because
01:57:23 --> 01:57:26
imagine you know nothing and you want to
01:57:25 --> 01:57:29
make a website you want to make a
01:57:26 --> 01:57:31
startup this is like that's why the man
01:57:30 --> 01:57:35
the power of AI for education is going
01:57:32 --> 01:57:36
to be insane like people anywhere can
01:57:35 --> 01:57:39
can ask this question and start building
01:57:37 --> 01:57:41
stuff yeah clarifies it for sure and
01:57:39 --> 01:57:43
just start building like keep build
01:57:41 --> 01:57:45
build like actually apply the thing
01:57:44 --> 01:57:48
whether it's AI or uh any of the
01:57:46 --> 01:57:50
programming for web development yeah
01:57:48 --> 01:57:52
just have a project in mind which I love
01:57:51 --> 01:57:55
the idea of like
01:57:53 --> 01:57:58
12 startups in 12 months or
01:57:55 --> 01:58:00
like build a project almost every day
01:57:58 --> 01:58:02
just build a thing yeah and get it to
01:58:01 --> 01:58:05
work and finish it every single day
01:58:03 --> 01:58:06
that's a cool experiment I think that
01:58:05 --> 01:58:08
was the inspiration there was a girl who
01:58:07 --> 01:58:10
did
01:58:08 --> 01:58:13
160 websites in 160 days or something
01:58:10 --> 01:58:15
like lit mini websites yeah and uh and
01:58:14 --> 01:58:17
she learned to go that way so I think
01:58:16 --> 01:58:20
it's good to set yourself challenges you
01:58:17 --> 01:58:21
know like don't you can go to some
01:58:20 --> 01:58:23
coding boot camp but I don't think they
01:58:21 --> 01:58:25
actually work I think it's better to do
01:58:23 --> 01:58:27
like for me outto deduct like
01:58:25 --> 01:58:29
selflearning and setting yourself like
01:58:27 --> 01:58:30
challenges and just getting in but you
01:58:30 --> 01:58:33
need discipline you know you need to
01:58:31 --> 01:58:35
discipline to keep to keep doing it and
01:58:33 --> 01:58:37
coding you know coding is very it's a
01:58:35 --> 01:58:39
steep learning curve to get in it's very
01:58:38 --> 01:58:42
annoying working with computers is very
01:58:39 --> 01:58:45
annoying uh so it can be hard for people
01:58:42 --> 01:58:47
to keep doing it you know yeah that
01:58:46 --> 01:58:50
thing of just keep doing it and don't
01:58:48 --> 01:58:52
quit that urgency that's required to
01:58:51 --> 01:58:54
finish a thing that's why it's really
01:58:53 --> 01:58:56
powerful when you documented this the
01:58:54 --> 01:58:59
creation of hood Maps or the like a
01:58:56 --> 01:59:02
working prototype that there's a just a
01:59:00 --> 01:59:05
constant frustration I guess it's like
01:59:03 --> 01:59:07
how do I do this and then you look it up
01:59:05 --> 01:59:08
and you're like okay you have to
01:59:07 --> 01:59:12
interpret the different options you have
01:59:09 --> 01:59:14
you're like and then just try it and
01:59:12 --> 01:59:17
then and then there's a dopamine Rush of
01:59:14 --> 01:59:19
like o it works cool man it's amazing
01:59:17 --> 01:59:20
and it's I I live streamed it it's on
01:59:19 --> 01:59:23
YouTube and stuff people can watch it
01:59:20 --> 01:59:25
and it's amazing when things work it's
01:59:24 --> 01:59:27
look it's just like amazing that you I
01:59:26 --> 01:59:28
look very not I don't look far ahead so
01:59:27 --> 01:59:31
I only look okay what's the next problem
01:59:29 --> 01:59:33
to solve and then the next problem and
01:59:31 --> 01:59:36
at the end you have a whole app or
01:59:33 --> 01:59:37
website or thing you know but I think
01:59:37 --> 01:59:40
most people look way too far ahead you
01:59:38 --> 01:59:41
know they look it's like this poster
01:59:40 --> 01:59:42
again like you shouldn't you don't know
01:59:42 --> 01:59:45
how hard it's going to be so you should
01:59:43 --> 01:59:46
only look like for the next thing the
01:59:45 --> 01:59:49
next little challenge the next step and
01:59:47 --> 01:59:50
then see where you end up and assume
01:59:49 --> 01:59:53
it's going to be
01:59:51 --> 01:59:55
easy yeah exactly yeah be naive about it
01:59:53 --> 01:59:55
because it's it's you're going to have
01:59:55 --> 01:59:58
very difficult
01:59:56 --> 01:59:59
problems a lot of the big problems won't
01:59:58 --> 02:00:00
be even Tech we'll be like public right
02:00:00 --> 02:00:03
like maybe people don't like your
02:00:01 --> 02:00:05
website like um you will get canceled
02:00:03 --> 02:00:06
for a website for example like a lot of
02:00:05 --> 02:00:09
things can happen what's it like
02:00:07 --> 02:00:11
building in public like you do like
02:00:09 --> 02:00:12
openly where you're just iterating
02:00:11 --> 02:00:13
quickly and you're getting people's
02:00:12 --> 02:00:15
feedback so there there's the power of
02:00:14 --> 02:00:17
the crowdsourcing but there's also the
02:00:16 --> 02:00:18
the negative aspects of people being
02:00:18 --> 02:00:21
able to
02:00:19 --> 02:00:23
criticize so man I think haters are
02:00:21 --> 02:00:24
actually cuz I think a lot of haters
02:00:23 --> 02:00:26
have good points and it takes like
02:00:25 --> 02:00:29
stepping away from the emotion of like
02:00:27 --> 02:00:30
uh ah your website sucks because blah
02:00:29 --> 02:00:31
blah blah and you're like okay just
02:00:31 --> 02:00:34
remove this your website sucks because
02:00:32 --> 02:00:35
it's personal you know what did he say
02:00:34 --> 02:00:36
why did he didn't not like it and you
02:00:35 --> 02:00:38
figure out okay he didn't like it
02:00:36 --> 02:00:39
because the sign up was difficult or
02:00:38 --> 02:00:40
something or it wasn't the data they say
02:00:40 --> 02:00:42
no this data is not accurate or
02:00:41 --> 02:00:43
something right okay I need to improve
02:00:43 --> 02:00:46
the quality of data this hater has a
02:00:44 --> 02:00:50
point think it's dumb to completely
02:00:46 --> 02:00:51
ignore your haters you know and also you
02:00:50 --> 02:00:52
man I think I've been there when I was
02:00:52 --> 02:00:55
like 10 years old or some you're on the
02:00:53 --> 02:00:56
internet you just shouting crazy stuff
02:00:55 --> 02:00:58
that's like most of Twitter you know or
02:00:57 --> 02:01:02
half Twitter so you you have to take it
02:00:59 --> 02:01:04
with grain of salt um yeah you man you
02:01:02 --> 02:01:07
need to grow a very thick skin like on
02:01:04 --> 02:01:09
Twitter on X like people say but I mute
02:01:08 --> 02:01:13
a lot of people like I found out I muted
02:01:09 --> 02:01:14
already 15,000 people recently I checked
02:01:13 --> 02:01:16
so in in 10 years I muted 15,000 people
02:01:15 --> 02:01:19
so that's like like that's one by one
02:01:17 --> 02:01:22
manual 15 yeah oh wow so, 1500 people
02:01:20 --> 02:01:23
per year and I don't like like to block
02:01:22 --> 02:01:25
cuz then they get angry they make a
02:01:23 --> 02:01:27
screenshot and they say ah you block me
02:01:25 --> 02:01:31
so I just mute and it disappear and it's
02:01:28 --> 02:01:33
amazing so you mentioned Reddit So Hood
02:01:31 --> 02:01:35
maps that make it to the front page of
02:01:33 --> 02:01:38
Reddit yeah yeah it did yeah yeah yeah
02:01:36 --> 02:01:40
it did it was amazing and my server
02:01:39 --> 02:01:41
almost went down and I was checking like
02:01:40 --> 02:01:43
Google analytics was like 5,000 people
02:01:41 --> 02:01:46
on the website or something or crazy and
02:01:43 --> 02:01:49
it was a night and was amazing um I man
02:01:47 --> 02:01:52
I think nowadays honestly Tik Tok uh
02:01:50 --> 02:01:55
YouTube Reals Instagram reals a lot of
02:01:52 --> 02:01:57
apps get very big from people T making
02:01:55 --> 02:01:59
Tik Tok videos about it so let's say you
02:01:57 --> 02:02:01
make your own app you can make a video
02:01:59 --> 02:02:03
for yourself like oh I made this app uh
02:02:01 --> 02:02:04
this is how it works blah blah blah um
02:02:04 --> 02:02:07
and this is why I made it for example
02:02:05 --> 02:02:08
and this is why you should use it and if
02:02:07 --> 02:02:11
it's a good video will take off and you
02:02:09 --> 02:02:14
will get man you I got like
02:02:12 --> 02:02:15
$20,000 extra per month or something
02:02:14 --> 02:02:19
from a Tik Tok from one Tik Tok video
02:02:15 --> 02:02:19
like it made a photoi by you or somebody
02:02:19 --> 02:02:22
else by some random guy so there's all
02:02:20 --> 02:02:24
these AI influencers that they write
02:02:22 --> 02:02:25
about they show AI apps and they then
02:02:24 --> 02:02:27
they ask money later like when a V video
02:02:26 --> 02:02:30
goes vir all I can do it do it again and
02:02:28 --> 02:02:33
send me $4,000 something I'm like okay I
02:02:30 --> 02:02:35
did that for example but it works like
02:02:33 --> 02:02:39
Tik Tok is a very big platform for user
02:02:36 --> 02:02:40
uh um acquisition yeah and organic like
02:02:39 --> 02:02:42
the best user acquisition I think is
02:02:41 --> 02:02:43
organic you don't need to buy ads you
02:02:42 --> 02:02:45
probably don't have money when you start
02:02:44 --> 02:02:49
to buy ads so use organic or write a
02:02:46 --> 02:02:50
banger tweet right that's can make an
02:02:49 --> 02:02:53
app take off as well well I mean yeah
02:02:50 --> 02:02:54
fundamentally create cool stuff and have
02:02:53 --> 02:02:58
just a little bit of a following enough
02:02:55 --> 02:02:59
to like for for the cool thing to be
02:02:58 --> 02:03:00
noticed and then it becomes viral if
02:03:00 --> 02:03:02
it's cool enough yeah and you don't need
02:03:01 --> 02:03:04
a lot of followers anymore because that
02:03:03 --> 02:03:07
on on X and a lot of platforms because
02:03:04 --> 02:03:07
Tik Tok X I think Instagram reals also
02:03:07 --> 02:03:10
they have the same algorithm now it's
02:03:08 --> 02:03:11
not about followers anymore it's about
02:03:10 --> 02:03:14
they test your content on a small subset
02:03:12 --> 02:03:16
like 300 people if they like it it will
02:03:15 --> 02:03:19
gets tested to thousand people and on
02:03:17 --> 02:03:21
and on so if the thing is good it will
02:03:19 --> 02:03:22
rise anyway it doesn't matter if you
02:03:21 --> 02:03:24
have million followers or a th000
02:03:23 --> 02:03:26
followers or 100 what's your philosophy
02:03:25 --> 02:03:29
of monetizing how to make money from the
02:03:26 --> 02:03:30
thing you build yeah so a lot of stter
02:03:29 --> 02:03:32
they do like free users so you could
02:03:30 --> 02:03:35
sign up and can use the app for free
02:03:32 --> 02:03:37
which is um it never worked for me well
02:03:35 --> 02:03:39
because I I think free users generally
02:03:38 --> 02:03:42
don't convert and I think if you have VC
02:03:40 --> 02:03:43
funding it makes sense to get free users
02:03:43 --> 02:03:45
because you can spend your funding on
02:03:44 --> 02:03:47
ads and you can get like millions of
02:03:45 --> 02:03:49
people com in predictably how much they
02:03:47 --> 02:03:51
convert and give them like a free trial
02:03:50 --> 02:03:53
whatever and then they sign up but you
02:03:52 --> 02:03:55
need to have that flow worked out so
02:03:53 --> 02:03:56
well for you to to make it work that you
02:03:55 --> 02:03:59
need like it's very difficult I think
02:03:57 --> 02:04:01
it's best to start and just um start
02:03:59 --> 02:04:02
asking people for money in the beginning
02:04:01 --> 02:04:04
so show your app like what are you doing
02:04:03 --> 02:04:05
on your landing page like make a demo
02:04:05 --> 02:04:10
Whatever video and then if you want to
02:04:06 --> 02:04:12
use it pay me money pay $10 $20 $30 I
02:04:10 --> 02:04:13
would ask more than $10 per month like
02:04:12 --> 02:04:15
Netflix is like $10 per month but
02:04:14 --> 02:04:18
Netflix is a giant company that can you
02:04:16 --> 02:04:19
know they can afford to make it so cheap
02:04:18 --> 02:04:21
relatively cheap if you're individual
02:04:20 --> 02:04:23
like an indie hacker like you are making
02:04:22 --> 02:04:24
your own app you need to make like at
02:04:24 --> 02:04:28
least
02:04:25 --> 02:04:30
$30 or more on a user to make it uh
02:04:28 --> 02:04:32
worthy for you you need to make money
02:04:30 --> 02:04:33
you know and it builds a community of
02:04:32 --> 02:04:35
people that actually really care about
02:04:34 --> 02:04:37
the product also yeah making a community
02:04:36 --> 02:04:39
like making a Discord is very normal now
02:04:37 --> 02:04:40
every AI has a Discord and you have the
02:04:39 --> 02:04:42
developers and the users together in
02:04:41 --> 02:04:44
like a Discord they talk about they ask
02:04:43 --> 02:04:47
for features they build together it's
02:04:44 --> 02:04:48
very normal now and um and you need to
02:04:47 --> 02:04:51
imagine like if you're if you're
02:04:48 --> 02:04:52
starting out getting a thousand users is
02:04:51 --> 02:04:54
quite difficult getting thousand pages
02:04:53 --> 02:04:57
is quite difficult and if you charge
02:04:55 --> 02:04:59
them like $30 you have 30k a month
02:04:57 --> 02:05:01
that's a lot of money that's enough to
02:04:59 --> 02:05:02
like live a good life yeah live a pretty
02:05:01 --> 02:05:04
good life I mean there could be a lot of
02:05:03 --> 02:05:06
cost associated with hosting so that's
02:05:05 --> 02:05:08
another thing I make sure my profit
02:05:07 --> 02:05:12
margets are very high so I try to keep
02:05:08 --> 02:05:14
the cost very low I don't hire people um
02:05:12 --> 02:05:16
I I try to negotiate with like AI
02:05:14 --> 02:05:17
vendors now like can you make it cheaper
02:05:16 --> 02:05:20
you know which is I discovered this you
02:05:18 --> 02:05:22
can just email companies and say can you
02:05:21 --> 02:05:25
can give me discount cuz too expensive
02:05:23 --> 02:05:28
and they say sure 50% I'm like wow very
02:05:26 --> 02:05:30
good and and I didn't know this you can
02:05:28 --> 02:05:32
just ask and especially in like like now
02:05:30 --> 02:05:34
it's kind of recession you can ask
02:05:32 --> 02:05:35
companies like I I need a discount or I
02:05:35 --> 02:05:38
kind of need to like you don't need to
02:05:36 --> 02:05:39
be asshole about it say you know I kind
02:05:38 --> 02:05:41
of need a discount or I need to go maybe
02:05:39 --> 02:05:42
to another company so maybe like a
02:05:41 --> 02:05:45
discount like here and there and it says
02:05:43 --> 02:05:48
sure a lot of them will say yes like 25%
02:05:46 --> 02:05:50
discount 50% discounts because you think
02:05:49 --> 02:05:53
the price on the website is the price of
02:05:50 --> 02:05:54
the API or something it's not like you
02:05:53 --> 02:05:57
know and also you're a public facing
02:05:55 --> 02:05:58
person oh that helps also and there's
02:05:57 --> 02:05:59
love and Good Vibes that you put out
02:05:59 --> 02:06:02
into the world like you're actually
02:06:00 --> 02:06:04
legitimately trying to build cool stuff
02:06:02 --> 02:06:05
so a lot of companies probably want to
02:06:04 --> 02:06:07
associate with you because you're trying
02:06:05 --> 02:06:09
to do yeah it's like secret heck but I
02:06:07 --> 02:06:10
think even without good person it
02:06:10 --> 02:06:13
depends how much discount they will give
02:06:11 --> 02:06:14
you know they'll maybe give more but you
02:06:13 --> 02:06:18
know that's why you should shit post on
02:06:15 --> 02:06:23
Twitter so you get you know discounts
02:06:18 --> 02:06:23
maybe yeah yeah um but and also the when
02:06:23 --> 02:06:27
it's
02:06:24 --> 02:06:30
crowdsourced I mean paying does prevent
02:06:27 --> 02:06:31
spam or help prevent spam also yeah yeah
02:06:30 --> 02:06:35
it gives you high quality users and free
02:06:32 --> 02:06:36
users are s but they're horrible like
02:06:35 --> 02:06:38
it's just like millions of people
02:06:36 --> 02:06:38
especially if AI startups you get a lot
02:06:38 --> 02:06:42
of abuse so you get millions of people
02:06:39 --> 02:06:43
from anywhere just abusing your app just
02:06:42 --> 02:06:45
just hacking it and whatever like
02:06:44 --> 02:06:48
there's something on the Internet you
02:06:46 --> 02:06:50
mentioned like forand discovered Hood
02:06:48 --> 02:06:51
Maps yeah but I love fortune they I
02:06:50 --> 02:06:52
don't love fortune but you know I mean
02:06:51 --> 02:06:55
like they're so crazy especially back
02:06:53 --> 02:06:59
then like that's it's kind of funny what
02:06:56 --> 02:07:01
they do you know I actually uh what is
02:06:59 --> 02:07:02
it this new documentary on Netflix
02:07:01 --> 02:07:04
antisocial Network or something like
02:07:03 --> 02:07:07
that that was really was fascinating
02:07:04 --> 02:07:09
just fortun just the you know the spirit
02:07:08 --> 02:07:12
of the thing Fortune Mis understand
02:07:10 --> 02:07:17
Fortune it's so much about freedom and
02:07:12 --> 02:07:17
also like the humor involved in fucking
02:07:17 --> 02:07:22
with the system and fucking with man
02:07:18 --> 02:07:24
it's just anti-stem for fun the the dark
02:07:22 --> 02:07:28
aspect of it is you're having fun you're
02:07:25 --> 02:07:30
doing anti-stem stuff but like the Nazis
02:07:29 --> 02:07:32
always show up and it's somehow bad shit
02:07:31 --> 02:07:34
started happening it starts drifting
02:07:33 --> 02:07:37
somehow yeah like school shootings and
02:07:34 --> 02:07:39
stuff so it's a very difficult topic but
02:07:37 --> 02:07:42
I I do know it's especially early on I
02:07:40 --> 02:07:44
think 2010 I would go to for for fun and
02:07:42 --> 02:07:45
they would post like crazy offensive
02:07:44 --> 02:07:47
stuff and this was just to scare off
02:07:46 --> 02:07:48
people so we' show to other people say
02:07:47 --> 02:07:50
hey do you know this internet website
02:07:48 --> 02:07:51
for just check it out yeah and it' be
02:07:50 --> 02:07:53
dude what the fuck I'm like no no you
02:07:52 --> 02:07:55
don't understand that's to scare you
02:07:53 --> 02:07:56
away but actually when you go through a
02:07:55 --> 02:07:58
scroll there's like deep conversations
02:07:57 --> 02:08:02
yes and there would already be this was
02:07:59 --> 02:08:04
like a Normy filter like to stop yeah so
02:08:02 --> 02:08:06
kind of cool but yeah goes dark it goes
02:08:04 --> 02:08:08
dark and if you have those people show
02:08:06 --> 02:08:09
up they'll for the fun of it do a bunch
02:08:09 --> 02:08:11
of racist things and all that kind of
02:08:10 --> 02:08:12
stuff you're saying but everything's I
02:08:11 --> 02:08:14
think it was never man I'm not a
02:08:13 --> 02:08:17
fortunate but like I it was always about
02:08:15 --> 02:08:19
provoking it's just provocateur you know
02:08:17 --> 02:08:20
but the the provoking in the case of
02:08:19 --> 02:08:22
hood Maps or something like this can can
02:08:21 --> 02:08:27
damage
02:08:23 --> 02:08:29
the uh good thing like you know a a
02:08:27 --> 02:08:30
little poison in a town is always good
02:08:29 --> 02:08:32
it's like the the Tom weights thing but
02:08:31 --> 02:08:34
you don't want too much otherwise it it
02:08:33 --> 02:08:35
destroys the town it destroys the thing
02:08:35 --> 02:08:37
they're kind of like pen testers you
02:08:36 --> 02:08:39
know like penetration testers hackers
02:08:38 --> 02:08:41
yeah they just test your app for you and
02:08:40 --> 02:08:45
then you add some stuff like I add like
02:08:41 --> 02:08:46
a I add like a NSFW W list they would
02:08:45 --> 02:08:49
say like bad words so when they would
02:08:47 --> 02:08:50
write like a bad word they would get
02:08:49 --> 02:08:51
forwarded to YouTube which was like a
02:08:51 --> 02:08:54
video
02:08:52 --> 02:08:56
was like a a very relaxing video that's
02:08:54 --> 02:08:58
like kind of ASMR with like glowing
02:08:57 --> 02:09:02
jelly streaming like this to relax them
02:08:59 --> 02:09:05
you know or cheese melting on the toes
02:09:02 --> 02:09:07
to chill them out I like it like but
02:09:05 --> 02:09:08
actually a lot of stuff I didn't realize
02:09:07 --> 02:09:12
how much originated in forchan in terms
02:09:09 --> 02:09:13
of memes Rick Roll I didn't understand I
02:09:12 --> 02:09:15
didn't know that Rick Roll originated in
02:09:13 --> 02:09:17
forchan like there's so many memes like
02:09:15 --> 02:09:18
most of the memes that you think the
02:09:17 --> 02:09:20
word role I think comes from forun like
02:09:19 --> 02:09:22
not the word role but like in this case
02:09:20 --> 02:09:25
in a mem used like you would get like
02:09:23 --> 02:09:28
roll doubles cuz every it was like post
02:09:25 --> 02:09:29
IDs on fortun so they were R they were
02:09:28 --> 02:09:31
kind of like random so if I get doubles
02:09:30 --> 02:09:33
like this happens or something so You'
02:09:32 --> 02:09:35
get like two two anyway it's like a
02:09:34 --> 02:09:37
betting Market kind of on these doubles
02:09:36 --> 02:09:40
on these post IDs this so much funny
02:09:38 --> 02:09:42
stuff yeah I mean that's internet that's
02:09:40 --> 02:09:44
purest but yeah again the dark stuff
02:09:42 --> 02:09:47
kind of seeps in yeah and you you it's
02:09:45 --> 02:09:49
nice to keep the dark stuff to like some
02:09:48 --> 02:09:52
low amount it's nice to have a bit of
02:09:50 --> 02:09:54
noise of the darkness but not too much
02:09:52 --> 02:09:56
yeah and but again like you have to pay
02:09:54 --> 02:09:58
attention to that with um I mean I guess
02:09:57 --> 02:10:01
spam in general you have to fight that
02:09:58 --> 02:10:04
with NAD list how do you fight spam man
02:10:01 --> 02:10:07
I use gp4 now it's amazing so so I have
02:10:05 --> 02:10:09
like um user input I have reviews people
02:10:08 --> 02:10:11
can review cities and they don't need to
02:10:10 --> 02:10:13
actually sign up it's Anonymous reviews
02:10:12 --> 02:10:16
and they write like whole books about
02:10:13 --> 02:10:18
like cities and what's good and bad so
02:10:16 --> 02:10:20
uh I run it through gp4 now and I ask
02:10:18 --> 02:10:22
like is this a you know is this a good
02:10:20 --> 02:10:24
review like is it offensive is it racist
02:10:23 --> 02:10:27
or some stuff and and it sends me a
02:10:25 --> 02:10:29
message on telegram when it rejects
02:10:27 --> 02:10:33
reviews and I check it and it's man it's
02:10:29 --> 02:10:35
so on point a yes and it's so accurate
02:10:33 --> 02:10:38
it understands double meanings um I have
02:10:36 --> 02:10:39
gb4 running on the on the on the chat
02:10:38 --> 02:10:41
Community it's a chat community of
02:10:39 --> 02:10:43
10,000 people and they're chatting and
02:10:41 --> 02:10:45
they start fighting with each other um
02:10:44 --> 02:10:47
and I used to have uh human moderators
02:10:46 --> 02:10:49
was very good but they would start
02:10:48 --> 02:10:52
fighting the human moderator like this
02:10:49 --> 02:10:54
guy's biased or something I have GPT 4
02:10:52 --> 02:10:56
and it's it's it's really really really
02:10:55 --> 02:10:58
really good it understands humor it
02:10:56 --> 02:10:59
understands like like you could say
02:10:58 --> 02:11:01
something bad but it's kind of like a
02:11:00 --> 02:11:04
joke and it's kind of not like offensive
02:11:02 --> 02:11:06
so much so it shouldn't be deleted right
02:11:05 --> 02:11:11
understands that you know it's I would
02:11:07 --> 02:11:15
love to have a gbt 4 based filter of
02:11:11 --> 02:11:16
like of different kinds of for like X
02:11:15 --> 02:11:18
yeah I fought this week like I tweeted
02:11:17 --> 02:11:21
like a fact check like you can click
02:11:18 --> 02:11:22
fact check and then gp4 look gp4 not
02:11:21 --> 02:11:25
always right about stuff right but it
02:11:23 --> 02:11:27
can give you a general fact check on a
02:11:25 --> 02:11:28
tweet like usually what I do now when I
02:11:28 --> 02:11:31
write something like Difficult about
02:11:29 --> 02:11:32
economics or something or AI I put in
02:11:31 --> 02:11:35
gp4 I say can you fact check it because
02:11:33 --> 02:11:36
I might have said something stupid and
02:11:35 --> 02:11:38
the stupid stuff always gets taken out
02:11:37 --> 02:11:40
by the reply is like oh you said this
02:11:38 --> 02:11:41
wrong and and then the whole tweet kind
02:11:40 --> 02:11:44
of doesn't make sense anymore so I asked
02:11:42 --> 02:11:46
gbt for to fact check a lot of stuff so
02:11:45 --> 02:11:49
fact check is a tough one yeah but it
02:11:46 --> 02:11:51
would be interesting to sort of
02:11:49 --> 02:11:54
um rate the thing based on how well
02:11:52 --> 02:11:57
thought out it is and how well argued it
02:11:55 --> 02:11:59
is yeah that that seems more doable that
02:11:58 --> 02:12:01
seems like more doable like it seems
02:11:59 --> 02:12:02
like a GPT thing because that that's
02:12:01 --> 02:12:04
less about the truth and it's more about
02:12:02 --> 02:12:05
the rigor of the thing exactly and you
02:12:04 --> 02:12:07
can ask that you can ask in the prompt
02:12:06 --> 02:12:10
like I don't know like for example do
02:12:08 --> 02:12:13
you think create like a ranking score of
02:12:11 --> 02:12:16
X Twitter replies where I should this
02:12:13 --> 02:12:18
post be if we rank on like I don't know
02:12:16 --> 02:12:21
Integrity reality like fundamental
02:12:19 --> 02:12:23
deepness or something inness um and it
02:12:22 --> 02:12:25
would give you that with a pretty good
02:12:23 --> 02:12:27
score probably I mean Elon can do this
02:12:25 --> 02:12:30
with groc right he can start doing using
02:12:28 --> 02:12:33
that to to check replies cuz the reply
02:12:31 --> 02:12:34
section is like chaos you know and
02:12:33 --> 02:12:35
actually the ranking of the replies is
02:12:34 --> 02:12:38
not doesn't make any sense doesn't make
02:12:36 --> 02:12:40
sense no and I I would like to sort in
02:12:38 --> 02:12:40
different kinds of ways yeah and you get
02:12:40 --> 02:12:42
too many replies now if you have a lot
02:12:41 --> 02:12:44
of followers I get too many replies I
02:12:42 --> 02:12:46
don't see everything and I I a lot of
02:12:45 --> 02:12:48
stuff I just miss and I don't I want to
02:12:47 --> 02:12:51
see the good stuff and also the
02:12:49 --> 02:12:53
notifications or whatever it's just
02:12:51 --> 02:12:54
complete chaos yeah it'd be nice to be
02:12:53 --> 02:12:56
able to filter that in interesting ways
02:12:55 --> 02:12:59
sort in interesting
02:12:57 --> 02:13:03
ways cuz like I feel like I miss a lot
02:13:00 --> 02:13:05
and I what's surfaced for me are just
02:13:03 --> 02:13:07
like a random comment by a person with
02:13:06 --> 02:13:10
no followers that's positive or negative
02:13:08 --> 02:13:10
it's like okay if it's a very good
02:13:10 --> 02:13:13
comment it should happen but it should
02:13:11 --> 02:13:14
probably look a little bit more like do
02:13:13 --> 02:13:15
these people have followers because
02:13:14 --> 02:13:17
they're probably more engaged in the
02:13:16 --> 02:13:19
platform right oh no if it's I don't
02:13:18 --> 02:13:21
even care about how many followers if
02:13:19 --> 02:13:23
you're ranking by the quality of the
02:13:21 --> 02:13:26
comment great yeah but not just like
02:13:24 --> 02:13:29
randomly like chronological just a sea
02:13:27 --> 02:13:32
of comments yeah yeah yeah it does makes
02:13:29 --> 02:13:34
sense yeah uh X could be very improved
02:13:32 --> 02:13:37
of that I think one thing you you spouse
02:13:35 --> 02:13:40
a lot which I love is the automation
02:13:37 --> 02:13:42
step so like once you have a Thing Once
02:13:40 --> 02:13:44
you have an idea and you build it and it
02:13:43 --> 02:13:46
actually starts making money and it's
02:13:45 --> 02:13:48
making people happy there's a community
02:13:47 --> 02:13:51
of people using
02:13:48 --> 02:13:53
it you want to take the autom step of
02:13:51 --> 02:13:54
automating the things you have to do as
02:13:53 --> 02:13:56
little work as possible for it to keep
02:13:55 --> 02:13:59
running indefinitely can you like
02:13:57 --> 02:14:01
explain your philosophy there what do
02:13:59 --> 02:14:03
you mean by automate yeah so the general
02:14:02 --> 02:14:05
theory of stter would be that when when
02:14:04 --> 02:14:06
it starts like you start making money
02:14:05 --> 02:14:08
you start hiring people to do stuff
02:14:06 --> 02:14:08
right do stuff that you like marketing
02:14:08 --> 02:14:12
for example do stuff that you would do
02:14:09 --> 02:14:14
in the beginning yourself um and
02:14:12 --> 02:14:15
whatever Community Management and
02:14:14 --> 02:14:18
organizing meetups for nist for example
02:14:16 --> 02:14:21
that would be a job for example and I
02:14:19 --> 02:14:23
thought like uh I don't the money for
02:14:21 --> 02:14:24
that and I I don't really want to run
02:14:23 --> 02:14:26
like a big company with a lot of people
02:14:25 --> 02:14:28
because there's a lot of work managing
02:14:26 --> 02:14:29
these people so I've always tried to
02:14:28 --> 02:14:33
like automate these things as much as
02:14:30 --> 02:14:35
possible and um and this can literally
02:14:34 --> 02:14:37
be like for this it's literally like a
02:14:36 --> 02:14:38
it's not a different other stars was
02:14:37 --> 02:14:40
like a web page where you can organize
02:14:38 --> 02:14:42
your own Meetup set a set a schedule a
02:14:41 --> 02:14:44
date whatever you can see how many
02:14:42 --> 02:14:45
Nomads will be there at that date so you
02:14:44 --> 02:14:48
know there will be actually enough
02:14:45 --> 02:14:50
Nomads to meet up right and then um when
02:14:49 --> 02:14:52
it's done it sends a tweet out on the
02:14:51 --> 02:14:54
nist account there's a Meetup here it
02:14:53 --> 02:14:56
sends a direct message to everybody in
02:14:54 --> 02:14:57
the city who are there who are going to
02:14:56 --> 02:14:59
be there and then people show up on a
02:14:58 --> 02:15:02
bar and there's a Meetup and that's
02:14:59 --> 02:15:03
fully automated and for me it's like
02:15:02 --> 02:15:05
it's not it's so obvious to make this
02:15:04 --> 02:15:08
automatic why would you why would you
02:15:06 --> 02:15:10
have somebody organize this like um it
02:15:09 --> 02:15:12
makes more sense to automate it and this
02:15:10 --> 02:15:14
with most of my things like I figure out
02:15:12 --> 02:15:16
like how to do it with code and I think
02:15:15 --> 02:15:18
especially now with AI like you can
02:15:16 --> 02:15:20
automate so much more stuff than before
02:15:18 --> 02:15:21
because AI understands things so well
02:15:21 --> 02:15:24
like before I would use if statements
02:15:22 --> 02:15:26
right now you ask GPT you put something
02:15:24 --> 02:15:29
in GPT for and in the API and it sends
02:15:26 --> 02:15:31
back like this is good this is bad yeah
02:15:29 --> 02:15:34
so you basically can now even uh
02:15:32 --> 02:15:36
automate sort of subjective type of
02:15:34 --> 02:15:38
things this is the difference now and
02:15:36 --> 02:15:39
that's very recent right but it's still
02:15:39 --> 02:15:42
difficult to I mean that step of
02:15:40 --> 02:15:45
automation is difficult
02:15:42 --> 02:15:47
to figure out how to is you're basically
02:15:46 --> 02:15:50
delegating everything to code and it's
02:15:48 --> 02:15:51
not trivial to take that step for a lot
02:15:50 --> 02:15:53
of people
02:15:51 --> 02:15:56
So when you say automate are you are you
02:15:53 --> 02:15:58
talking about like Crown jobs Yes Man a
02:15:56 --> 02:16:01
lot of crown jobs a lot of crown jobs
02:15:58 --> 02:16:03
it's like uh I literally I log into the
02:16:01 --> 02:16:05
server and I do like pseudo Chron tab d
02:16:04 --> 02:16:08
e and then I go into the editor and I
02:16:06 --> 02:16:12
write like hourly and then I write
02:16:09 --> 02:16:14
PHP uh you know do this thing. PHP and
02:16:13 --> 02:16:17
that's a script and that script does a
02:16:14 --> 02:16:18
thing and it does it then hourly that's
02:16:17 --> 02:16:20
it and that's how all my websites work
02:16:19 --> 02:16:22
do you have a thing where it like emails
02:16:20 --> 02:16:22
emils you or something like this or
02:16:22 --> 02:16:25
email somebody managing the thing if
02:16:23 --> 02:16:26
something goes wrong I have these web
02:16:25 --> 02:16:29
pages I make they're called like health
02:16:27 --> 02:16:32
checks so like Health check. PHP and
02:16:30 --> 02:16:34
then it has like emojis like a has like
02:16:32 --> 02:16:35
a green check mark if it's good and a
02:16:34 --> 02:16:37
red one if it's bad and then it does
02:16:36 --> 02:16:39
like database curious for example like
02:16:37 --> 02:16:41
what's the internet speed in for example
02:16:39 --> 02:16:43
um Amsterdam MH okay it's a number it's
02:16:42 --> 02:16:46
like 27 point megabit so it's accurate
02:16:44 --> 02:16:47
number okay check good and it goes to
02:16:46 --> 02:16:50
the next and it goes on all the data
02:16:48 --> 02:16:51
points did people sign up in the last 24
02:16:50 --> 02:16:53
hours it's important because maybe the
02:16:52 --> 02:16:56
sign up broke okay check somebody sign
02:16:54 --> 02:16:58
up then I have um uptime robot.com which
02:16:56 --> 02:17:00
is like for uptime but it can also check
02:16:58 --> 02:17:03
keywords it checks for an emoji which is
02:17:01 --> 02:17:05
like the Red X which is if something is
02:17:03 --> 02:17:07
bad and so it opens that health check
02:17:06 --> 02:17:09
page every minute to check if something
02:17:08 --> 02:17:12
is bad then if it's bad it sends a
02:17:10 --> 02:17:13
message to me on telegram saying hey
02:17:12 --> 02:17:16
what's up uh it doesn't say hey what's
02:17:13 --> 02:17:17
up it sends me like alert like this
02:17:16 --> 02:17:20
thing is down and then I check so within
02:17:18 --> 02:17:22
a minute of something breaking I know it
02:17:21 --> 02:17:24
and then I can open my laptop and fix it
02:17:23 --> 02:17:27
yeah but the good thing is like the last
02:17:24 --> 02:17:28
few years things don't break anymore and
02:17:27 --> 02:17:29
like definitely 10 years ago when I
02:17:29 --> 02:17:33
started everything was breaking all the
02:17:30 --> 02:17:37
time and now it's like almost it's last
02:17:33 --> 02:17:38
week was like 100. z% up time and these
02:17:37 --> 02:17:40
health checks are part of the uptime
02:17:39 --> 02:17:43
percentage so it's like everything works
02:17:41 --> 02:17:45
yeah actually making me realize I should
02:17:43 --> 02:17:49
uh I should have a page for myself like
02:17:46 --> 02:17:50
one page that has all the health checks
02:17:49 --> 02:17:52
just so I can go to didn't see all the
02:17:51 --> 02:17:54
green check marks just it feels good to
02:17:53 --> 02:17:57
look as you know it just be like okay
02:17:54 --> 02:17:58
yeah all right we're okay everything's
02:17:57 --> 02:18:01
okay yeah and like you can see like when
02:17:59 --> 02:18:04
was the last time something wasn't okay
02:18:01 --> 02:18:06
and it'll say like never or like meaning
02:18:05 --> 02:18:10
like you've you've you've you've checked
02:18:07 --> 02:18:11
since you've last cared to check it was
02:18:10 --> 02:18:13
all been okay for sure it used to send
02:18:12 --> 02:18:15
me the the good health checks like yeah
02:18:14 --> 02:18:18
you know this all works it all works but
02:18:16 --> 02:18:20
it's been so often and I'm like this
02:18:18 --> 02:18:21
feels so good but then I'm like okay OB
02:18:20 --> 02:18:22
is not going to we need to hide the good
02:18:22 --> 02:18:25
ones and show only the bad ones and now
02:18:23 --> 02:18:26
that's the case I need to integrate
02:18:25 --> 02:18:29
everything into one place I automate
02:18:27 --> 02:18:32
like everything yeah have also just a
02:18:30 --> 02:18:35
large uh set of cron jobs a lot of the
02:18:33 --> 02:18:37
publication this podcast is has done all
02:18:36 --> 02:18:39
everything is just on automatically it's
02:18:37 --> 02:18:41
all clipped up all the all all this kind
02:18:39 --> 02:18:44
of stuff yeah but it would be nice to
02:18:41 --> 02:18:45
automate even more like a translation
02:18:44 --> 02:18:47
all this kind of stuff would be nice to
02:18:46 --> 02:18:50
automate yeah every JavaScript every PHP
02:18:48 --> 02:18:52
error gets sent to my telegram as well
02:18:50 --> 02:18:54
so every user whatever user it is
02:18:52 --> 02:18:57
doesn't have to be page user if they run
02:18:54 --> 02:18:59
into an error um the JavaScript sends
02:18:57 --> 02:19:02
the JavaScript error to the server and
02:18:59 --> 02:19:05
then it sends to my telegram from all my
02:19:03 --> 02:19:08
websites so you get like a message so I
02:19:06 --> 02:19:09
get like a uncut variable error whatever
02:19:08 --> 02:19:11
blah blah blah and then I'm like okay
02:19:09 --> 02:19:12
interesting and then I go check it out
02:19:12 --> 02:19:14
and that's like a way to get to zero
02:19:13 --> 02:19:16
errors because you get flooded with
02:19:14 --> 02:19:17
errors in the beginning and now it's
02:19:16 --> 02:19:20
like nothing
02:19:18 --> 02:19:22
almost so that's really cool but mat
02:19:20 --> 02:19:25
that's really cool but this is the same
02:19:22 --> 02:19:27
stuff people they they pay like very big
02:19:26 --> 02:19:30
size companies like New Relic for right
02:19:28 --> 02:19:32
like to manage the stuff um so you can
02:19:31 --> 02:19:34
do that too you can use off the-shelf I
02:19:32 --> 02:19:35
like to build myself it's easier yeah
02:19:34 --> 02:19:37
it's nice it's nice to do that kind of
02:19:36 --> 02:19:39
automation I'm starting to think about
02:19:38 --> 02:19:41
like what are the things in my life I'm
02:19:39 --> 02:19:43
doing myself that could be
02:19:41 --> 02:19:45
automated uh in the ask your gbt you
02:19:43 --> 02:19:47
know like give your daily your day and
02:19:45 --> 02:19:48
then ask it what part you to automate
02:19:48 --> 02:19:51
well one of the things I I would love to
02:19:49 --> 02:19:53
automate more is my consumption and
02:19:51 --> 02:19:56
social media yeah both the the output
02:19:54 --> 02:19:57
and the input man that's very I think
02:19:56 --> 02:20:00
there's some startups that do that like
02:19:58 --> 02:20:01
they they summarize the cool shit
02:20:00 --> 02:20:04
happening on Twitter you know like with
02:20:02 --> 02:20:07
AI I think the guy called s wyx or
02:20:05 --> 02:20:09
something he does like a newsletter it's
02:20:07 --> 02:20:12
completely AI generated we have the cool
02:20:09 --> 02:20:12
the cool new stuff in AI yeah I mean I
02:20:12 --> 02:20:16
would love to do that but also like
02:20:13 --> 02:20:18
across Instagram Facebook LinkedIn all
02:20:17 --> 02:20:21
this kind of stuff just like okay can I
02:20:19 --> 02:20:23
can you summarize the internet for me
02:20:21 --> 02:20:26
for today summarize internet.com yeah
02:20:24 --> 02:20:30
cuz I I feel like it pulls in way too
02:20:27 --> 02:20:33
much uh time but also like I don't like
02:20:30 --> 02:20:35
the effect it has some days on my psyche
02:20:33 --> 02:20:38
because like haters or or just general
02:20:36 --> 02:20:40
content like no no just general like for
02:20:38 --> 02:20:42
example like Tik Tok is a good example
02:20:40 --> 02:20:44
of that for me I sometimes just feel
02:20:43 --> 02:20:46
Dumber after I use Tik Tok I just feel
02:20:45 --> 02:20:49
like I don't use it anymore empty
02:20:47 --> 02:20:52
somehow and I'm like
02:20:49 --> 02:20:53
uninspired yeah it's funny in the moment
02:20:52 --> 02:20:56
I'm like ah look at that cat doing a
02:20:53 --> 02:20:57
funny thing and then you're like oh look
02:20:56 --> 02:21:01
at that person dancing in a funny way to
02:20:58 --> 02:21:03
that music is and then you're like 10
02:21:01 --> 02:21:04
minutes later you're like I feel way
02:21:03 --> 02:21:06
dumber and I don't really want to do
02:21:05 --> 02:21:08
much for the rest of the day my
02:21:06 --> 02:21:10
girlfriend sat she saw me like watching
02:21:08 --> 02:21:12
some dumb video and she's like dude your
02:21:10 --> 02:21:14
face looks so dumb as well your whole
02:21:12 --> 02:21:15
face starts going like oh interesting
02:21:15 --> 02:21:18
you know
02:21:16 --> 02:21:21
so I mean with social media uh with uh
02:21:19 --> 02:21:23
with X sometimes for me too is I think
02:21:21 --> 02:21:26
I'm probably naturally gravitating
02:21:23 --> 02:21:28
towards the drama yeah aren't we all
02:21:27 --> 02:21:30
yeah so there following AI people
02:21:29 --> 02:21:31
especially AI people that only post
02:21:31 --> 02:21:34
technical content has been really good
02:21:32 --> 02:21:36
cuz then I just look at them and I and
02:21:34 --> 02:21:37
then I go down rabbit holes of like
02:21:36 --> 02:21:40
learning new papers that have been
02:21:37 --> 02:21:43
published or uh good repos or or um just
02:21:41 --> 02:21:45
any kind of cool demonstration of stuff
02:21:44 --> 02:21:47
and the the kind of things that they
02:21:45 --> 02:21:48
retweet and that's the rabbit hole I go
02:21:47 --> 02:21:51
and I'm learning and I'm inspired all
02:21:49 --> 02:21:52
that kind of stuff
02:21:51 --> 02:21:53
it's been tough it's been tough to
02:21:52 --> 02:21:55
control it's difficult you need to like
02:21:53 --> 02:21:56
manage your your your platforms you know
02:21:56 --> 02:21:59
I have a mute word list as well so I
02:21:57 --> 02:22:02
mute like politics stuff because I don't
02:21:59 --> 02:22:04
really want it on my feet and I think
02:22:03 --> 02:22:06
I've muted so much that now my feet is
02:22:04 --> 02:22:08
good you know I see like interesting
02:22:06 --> 02:22:11
stuff and but the fact that you need to
02:22:09 --> 02:22:12
modify you need to like mod your app
02:22:11 --> 02:22:14
your social media platform just to
02:22:12 --> 02:22:15
function and not be toxic for you for
02:22:15 --> 02:22:18
your mental health right that's like a
02:22:16 --> 02:22:20
problem like it should be doing that for
02:22:18 --> 02:22:22
you it's some level of automation
02:22:21 --> 02:22:26
I that that would be interesting I wish
02:22:23 --> 02:22:29
I could access X and Instagram through
02:22:26 --> 02:22:31
API easier you need to spend $42,000 a
02:22:29 --> 02:22:33
month which my friends do yeah you can
02:22:31 --> 02:22:34
do no but still even if you do that that
02:22:33 --> 02:22:36
you're not getting I mean there's
02:22:35 --> 02:22:39
limitations that don't make it easy to
02:22:37 --> 02:22:41
do like yeah automate because they the
02:22:40 --> 02:22:43
thing that they're trying to limit like
02:22:41 --> 02:22:45
abuse or for you to steal all the data
02:22:44 --> 02:22:47
from the app to then train an llm or
02:22:46 --> 02:22:50
something like this but if I just want
02:22:47 --> 02:22:52
to like figure out ways to automate my
02:22:50 --> 02:22:55
inter action with the X system or with
02:22:53 --> 02:22:56
with Instagram they they don't make that
02:22:55 --> 02:22:57
easy but I would love to sort of
02:22:56 --> 02:23:00
automate that and explore different ways
02:22:58 --> 02:23:04
to how to leverage llms to control the
02:23:01 --> 02:23:06
content I consume and and maybe publish
02:23:04 --> 02:23:07
that maybe they themselves can see how
02:23:06 --> 02:23:09
that could be used to improve their
02:23:07 --> 02:23:12
system so but there's not
02:23:09 --> 02:23:14
enough uh access you can screen cap your
02:23:12 --> 02:23:16
phone right can be an app that watches
02:23:15 --> 02:23:18
your screen with you you could yeah but
02:23:17 --> 02:23:19
I don't really know like what it would
02:23:18 --> 02:23:22
do like maybe it can hide stuff before
02:23:20 --> 02:23:25
you see it you know like I I have Chrome
02:23:22 --> 02:23:26
extensions I I write a lot of Chrome
02:23:25 --> 02:23:29
extensions that hide parts of different
02:23:27 --> 02:23:31
pages and so on like for example for my
02:23:29 --> 02:23:35
own on my main computer I hide all views
02:23:32 --> 02:23:38
and likes and all that on on YouTube
02:23:35 --> 02:23:39
content that I create so that you it
02:23:38 --> 02:23:42
doesn't yeah so you don't pay attention
02:23:40 --> 02:23:45
to it um I also hide Parts there I have
02:23:42 --> 02:23:47
a mode for X where I hide most of
02:23:45 --> 02:23:48
everything so like there's no it's same
02:23:48 --> 02:23:51
with YouTube the same I have this
02:23:49 --> 02:23:52
extension like uh well I wrote my own
02:23:51 --> 02:23:54
because it's easier because it keeps
02:23:52 --> 02:23:57
changing it's like it's it's not easy to
02:23:54 --> 02:23:58
keep it dynamically changing but they're
02:23:57 --> 02:24:00
really good at like getting you to be
02:23:59 --> 02:24:02
distracted and like starting related
02:24:01 --> 02:24:05
accounts related post I'm like I don't
02:24:02 --> 02:24:06
want related and like 10 minutes later
02:24:05 --> 02:24:08
you're like or something that's trending
02:24:07 --> 02:24:09
I have a weird amount of friends
02:24:08 --> 02:24:11
addicted to YouTube and I'm not addicted
02:24:10 --> 02:24:14
I think because my attention span is too
02:24:12 --> 02:24:17
short for YouTube but uh but I I have
02:24:15 --> 02:24:18
this extension to like YouTube on hook
02:24:17 --> 02:24:20
which like it hides all the related
02:24:18 --> 02:24:23
stuff I can just see the video mhm and
02:24:21 --> 02:24:25
it's amazing and uh but sometimes I need
02:24:24 --> 02:24:27
to like like I I need to search a video
02:24:26 --> 02:24:29
how to how to do something and then I go
02:24:27 --> 02:24:31
to YouTube and I had these YouTube
02:24:29 --> 02:24:33
shorts these YouTube shorts are like
02:24:31 --> 02:24:35
they're like algorithmically designed to
02:24:33 --> 02:24:37
just make you tap them and like I tap
02:24:36 --> 02:24:40
and and then I'm like five minutes later
02:24:38 --> 02:24:41
with his face like and you're you're
02:24:40 --> 02:24:43
just stuck and he's like what happened I
02:24:41 --> 02:24:45
was gonna open I was going to play like
02:24:44 --> 02:24:47
the coffee mix you know like the music
02:24:46 --> 02:24:49
mix for drinking coffee together like in
02:24:47 --> 02:24:50
the morning like jazz I didn't want to
02:24:49 --> 02:24:52
go to shorts
02:24:50 --> 02:24:54
so it's it's very uh it's very
02:24:53 --> 02:24:56
difficult I love how we're actually
02:24:55 --> 02:24:58
highlighting all kinds of interesting
02:24:56 --> 02:25:00
problems that all could be solved with a
02:24:58 --> 02:25:03
start up okay so what what about the
02:25:00 --> 02:25:04
exit when and how to exit man you
02:25:04 --> 02:25:07
shouldn't ask me because I never sold my
02:25:05 --> 02:25:08
company and you've never all the
02:25:07 --> 02:25:10
successful stuff you've done you've
02:25:09 --> 02:25:13
never sold it yeah it's kind of sad
02:25:11 --> 02:25:14
right like I I've been in so I've been
02:25:13 --> 02:25:16
in in a lot of acquisition like deals
02:25:14 --> 02:25:17
and stuff and I learn a lot about
02:25:16 --> 02:25:20
Finance people as as well there like
02:25:18 --> 02:25:22
manipulation and do diligence and then
02:25:21 --> 02:25:25
changing the valuation like people
02:25:23 --> 02:25:28
change the valuation after uh so they
02:25:25 --> 02:25:29
they a lot of people string you on to
02:25:28 --> 02:25:31
acquire you and then it takes like six
02:25:30 --> 02:25:33
months it's like classic it takes six to
02:25:31 --> 02:25:34
12 months they want to see everything
02:25:33 --> 02:25:38
they want to see the the your stripe and
02:25:35 --> 02:25:40
your code and whatever and then um in
02:25:38 --> 02:25:41
the end they'll they'll change the price
02:25:40 --> 02:25:43
to lower because you're already so
02:25:42 --> 02:25:46
invested so it's like a negotiation
02:25:44 --> 02:25:47
tactic right I'm like no then I don't
02:25:46 --> 02:25:50
want to sell right and the problem with
02:25:48 --> 02:25:54
my companies is like they make you know
02:25:50 --> 02:25:55
90% profit margin so the multiple they
02:25:54 --> 02:25:58
companies get sold with multiples kind
02:25:55 --> 02:25:59
of multiples of profit or revenue and
02:25:58 --> 02:26:01
often the multiples like three times
02:25:59 --> 02:26:04
three times or four times or five times
02:26:01 --> 02:26:06
revenue or profit so in my case they're
02:26:05 --> 02:26:09
all automated so I might as as well wait
02:26:07 --> 02:26:11
three years and I get the same money as
02:26:09 --> 02:26:12
when I sell and then I can still sell
02:26:11 --> 02:26:15
the same company you know what I mean I
02:26:12 --> 02:26:16
can still sell for three five times so
02:26:15 --> 02:26:19
financially it doesn't really make sense
02:26:16 --> 02:26:20
to sell yeah unless the price high
02:26:19 --> 02:26:22
enough like if the gets to like six or
02:26:21 --> 02:26:24
seven or eight I don't want to wait six
02:26:23 --> 02:26:26
years for the money you know but if you
02:26:24 --> 02:26:29
give me three like three years nothing
02:26:26 --> 02:26:31
like I can wait so I mean the really
02:26:29 --> 02:26:33
valuable stuff about the companies you
02:26:31 --> 02:26:35
created is not just the interface and
02:26:34 --> 02:26:39
the and the crowdsource content but the
02:26:36 --> 02:26:40
people themselves like the user base
02:26:39 --> 02:26:42
yeah but nor list it's a community yeah
02:26:41 --> 02:26:44
so I could see that being extremely
02:26:43 --> 02:26:46
valuable I'm surprised but normally this
02:26:44 --> 02:26:47
is like it's like my baby it's like my
02:26:46 --> 02:26:49
first product I took off and I don't
02:26:48 --> 02:26:50
really know if I want to sell it it's
02:26:49 --> 02:26:51
like something you would nice when you
02:26:50 --> 02:26:53
you know when you're old that you're
02:26:51 --> 02:26:55
still working in this you know it's like
02:26:53 --> 02:26:57
a it has like a mission which is like um
02:26:56 --> 02:26:59
people should travel anywhere and they
02:26:58 --> 02:27:01
can work from anywhere and they can meet
02:27:00 --> 02:27:03
different cultures and that's a good way
02:27:02 --> 02:27:04
to make the world get better if you
02:27:03 --> 02:27:06
learn if you go to China and live in
02:27:04 --> 02:27:07
China you'll learn that they're nice
02:27:06 --> 02:27:08
people and a lot of stuff you hear about
02:27:08 --> 02:27:11
China's propaganda a lot of stuff is
02:27:09 --> 02:27:13
true as well but it's more you know you
02:27:12 --> 02:27:15
learn a lot from traveling and I think
02:27:13 --> 02:27:17
that's why it's like a cool project to
02:27:15 --> 02:27:19
like not sell uh AI projects I have less
02:27:18 --> 02:27:23
emotional feeling with AI projects like
02:27:20 --> 02:27:25
guy mhm which I could sell yeah yeah the
02:27:23 --> 02:27:27
thing you also mentioned is you have to
02:27:26 --> 02:27:30
price in the fact that you're going to
02:27:28 --> 02:27:32
miss yeah the company you cre and
02:27:31 --> 02:27:34
meaning it gives you right there's a
02:27:32 --> 02:27:35
very famous like depression after
02:27:34 --> 02:27:38
started fin a Solar Company like they're
02:27:36 --> 02:27:39
like this was my this was me like who am
02:27:38 --> 02:27:42
I and they immediately start building
02:27:40 --> 02:27:44
another one you know they never can stop
02:27:42 --> 02:27:46
so I think it's it's good to keep
02:27:44 --> 02:27:48
working you know until you die just keep
02:27:46 --> 02:27:50
working on cool stuff and you shouldn't
02:27:49 --> 02:27:52
retire you know I think retirement is
02:27:51 --> 02:27:55
bad probably so you usually build the
02:27:53 --> 02:27:58
stuff solo and mostly work
02:27:55 --> 02:27:59
solo what's the thinking behind that I
02:27:58 --> 02:28:01
think I'm not so good working with other
02:28:00 --> 02:28:04
people not like I'm crazy but like I I
02:28:02 --> 02:28:06
don't trust other people to clarify you
02:28:04 --> 02:28:09
don't trust other people to do a great
02:28:06 --> 02:28:11
job yeah and I don't want to have like
02:28:09 --> 02:28:12
this consensus meeting where we all like
02:28:12 --> 02:28:14
you know you have like a meeting with
02:28:13 --> 02:28:17
three people and then you kind of get
02:28:14 --> 02:28:18
this Compromise result which is very
02:28:17 --> 02:28:21
European like it's very in Holland we
02:28:19 --> 02:28:22
call po where you put people in the room
02:28:21 --> 02:28:23
and you only let them out when they
02:28:23 --> 02:28:26
agree on the compromise right in
02:28:24 --> 02:28:28
politics and I don't think it I think it
02:28:26 --> 02:28:29
it breeds like averageness you know you
02:28:29 --> 02:28:31
get an average idea average company
02:28:30 --> 02:28:34
average
02:28:31 --> 02:28:36
culture um you need to have like a
02:28:35 --> 02:28:39
leader or you need to be solo and just
02:28:37 --> 02:28:41
do it you know do it yourself I think
02:28:39 --> 02:28:42
and I trust some people like now I like
02:28:41 --> 02:28:45
with my best friend Andre I'm making a
02:28:43 --> 02:28:47
new AI startup um but it's because we we
02:28:45 --> 02:28:48
know each other very long and he's one
02:28:47 --> 02:28:50
of the few people I would build
02:28:48 --> 02:28:51
something with and uh but almost never
02:28:51 --> 02:28:55
yeah so what does it take to be
02:28:52 --> 02:28:56
successful when you have more than one
02:28:56 --> 02:28:58
like how do you build together with
02:28:57 --> 02:29:00
Andre how you build together with other
02:28:59 --> 02:29:03
people so he codes uh I shit post on
02:29:01 --> 02:29:05
Twitter literally like I promoted on
02:29:03 --> 02:29:07
Twitter I I we said like product
02:29:05 --> 02:29:07
strategy like I said this should be
02:29:07 --> 02:29:10
better this should be better but I think
02:29:08 --> 02:29:12
you need to have one person coding it he
02:29:11 --> 02:29:15
codes in Ruby so I cannot do Ruby I'm in
02:29:13 --> 02:29:17
PHP so you literally so you have you
02:29:15 --> 02:29:19
ever coded with another person for
02:29:17 --> 02:29:21
prolonged periods of time never in my
02:29:19 --> 02:29:21
life
02:29:23 --> 02:29:27
so uh what what do you think is behind
02:29:25 --> 02:29:29
that I don't know it was always just me
02:29:27 --> 02:29:31
sitting on my laptop like like goting no
02:29:30 --> 02:29:33
like you've never had another developer
02:29:32 --> 02:29:35
who like rolls in and like I've had once
02:29:34 --> 02:29:37
where F I like there's AI developer
02:29:35 --> 02:29:39
Philip I hired him to do the because I I
02:29:38 --> 02:29:42
can't write Python and AI stuff is
02:29:39 --> 02:29:42
Python and I needed to get models to
02:29:42 --> 02:29:46
work on replicate and stuff and I needed
02:29:43 --> 02:29:48
to improve photo ey and he helped me a
02:29:46 --> 02:29:50
lot for like 10 months he worked and uh
02:29:48 --> 02:29:51
man I was trying Pyon working with numpy
02:29:50 --> 02:29:52
and package manager and it was too
02:29:52 --> 02:29:55
difficult for me to figure this shit out
02:29:53 --> 02:29:57
and I didn't have time like I think 10
02:29:55 --> 02:29:59
years ago I would have time to like sit
02:29:58 --> 02:30:02
you know go do all nighters to figure
02:30:00 --> 02:30:04
this stuff out with python I don't have
02:30:02 --> 02:30:05
the and I don't have the it's not my
02:30:04 --> 02:30:07
thing it's not your thing it's another
02:30:06 --> 02:30:10
programming language I get it AI new
02:30:08 --> 02:30:12
thing got it but like you've never had a
02:30:10 --> 02:30:15
developer roll in look at your PHP J
02:30:13 --> 02:30:17
query code and be and yes like you know
02:30:15 --> 02:30:19
like in conversation or in impr they
02:30:17 --> 02:30:21
talk about yes and like basically all
02:30:19 --> 02:30:23
right I had for one week understand and
02:30:22 --> 02:30:26
then it ended because he wanted to
02:30:24 --> 02:30:28
rewrite everything in the no that's the
02:30:26 --> 02:30:29
wrong guy I know he wanted to rewrite in
02:30:28 --> 02:30:32
what he wanted to rewrite to he said to
02:30:30 --> 02:30:33
JY we cannot do this I'm like okay he's
02:30:32 --> 02:30:35
like we need to rewrite everything think
02:30:33 --> 02:30:37
in view VJs I'm like are you sure come
02:30:36 --> 02:30:40
just like kind you know like keep jaker
02:30:38 --> 02:30:42
he's like no man like and uh we need to
02:30:40 --> 02:30:43
change a lot of stuff and I'm like okay
02:30:43 --> 02:30:45
and I was kind of like feeling it like
02:30:44 --> 02:30:47
this you know we're going to clean up
02:30:45 --> 02:30:49
shit but then after weeks this it's not
02:30:48 --> 02:30:51
gonna it's gonna take way too much time
02:30:49 --> 02:30:53
I think I like working with people where
02:30:51 --> 02:30:56
like when I approach
02:30:54 --> 02:30:58
them I pretend in my head that they're
02:30:57 --> 02:31:01
the smartest person who has ever existed
02:30:59 --> 02:31:03
wow so I look at their code or I look at
02:31:02 --> 02:31:06
the stuff they've created and try to see
02:31:03 --> 02:31:08
The Genius of their way like you really
02:31:06 --> 02:31:11
have to understand people like really
02:31:09 --> 02:31:13
notice them like really and then from
02:31:11 --> 02:31:14
that place have a conversation about
02:31:13 --> 02:31:16
what is the better approach yeah but
02:31:15 --> 02:31:19
those are the top tier developers yeah
02:31:17 --> 02:31:21
and they those are the ones that are
02:31:19 --> 02:31:23
Tech ambiguous so they can work with
02:31:22 --> 02:31:25
they can learn any teex Tech and they
02:31:23 --> 02:31:27
can and that's like really few like it's
02:31:25 --> 02:31:29
like top 5% cuz if you try hire deps
02:31:28 --> 02:31:31
like no offense to devs but most devs
02:31:29 --> 02:31:33
are not man most people in general jobs
02:31:32 --> 02:31:36
are not so good at their job like even
02:31:34 --> 02:31:38
doctors and stuff when you realize this
02:31:36 --> 02:31:39
people are very average at the job
02:31:38 --> 02:31:41
especially with death with coding I
02:31:40 --> 02:31:43
think so sorry I think that's a really
02:31:42 --> 02:31:46
important skill for for developer to
02:31:44 --> 02:31:49
roll in and like understand the
02:31:46 --> 02:31:50
musicality the the style of and like
02:31:49 --> 02:31:52
empathy it's like code empathy right
02:31:51 --> 02:31:55
code empathy yeah it's a new word but
02:31:53 --> 02:31:56
that's it you need to understand like go
02:31:55 --> 02:31:59
over all the code get a holistic view of
02:31:56 --> 02:32:02
it and man you can suggest we we change
02:31:59 --> 02:32:04
stuff for sure but um and look jur is
02:32:03 --> 02:32:07
crazy it's crazy I'm using J Cur we can
02:32:05 --> 02:32:09
change that it's not crazy at all jQuery
02:32:07 --> 02:32:10
is also like beautiful and powerful and
02:32:09 --> 02:32:13
PHP is beautiful and Powerful especially
02:32:11 --> 02:32:17
as you said recently in the in the in
02:32:13 --> 02:32:18
the as the versions evolved it's much
02:32:17 --> 02:32:19
more serious programming language now
02:32:19 --> 02:32:23
it's super
02:32:20 --> 02:32:26
like PHP is really fast now it's cat
02:32:23 --> 02:32:27
JavaScript much Ruby really fast now so
02:32:27 --> 02:32:30
if speed is something you care about
02:32:28 --> 02:32:32
it's super fast um and like there's
02:32:30 --> 02:32:33
gigantic communities of people using
02:32:32 --> 02:32:35
those programming languages and there's
02:32:34 --> 02:32:37
Frameworks if you like the framework so
02:32:35 --> 02:32:40
there whatever it doesn't really matter
02:32:37 --> 02:32:42
what you use but like also you if I was
02:32:40 --> 02:32:44
like a developer working with you like
02:32:43 --> 02:32:49
you are extremely successful you've
02:32:44 --> 02:32:51
shipped a lot so like if I roll in I'm
02:32:49 --> 02:32:53
going to be be like I don't assume you
02:32:52 --> 02:32:55
know nothing assume Peter's a genius
02:32:54 --> 02:32:58
like the smartest developer ever and
02:32:55 --> 02:33:00
like learn learn from it and yes and
02:32:58 --> 02:33:03
like notice Parts in the code where like
02:33:01 --> 02:33:06
okay okay okay I got it like here's how
02:33:04 --> 02:33:10
he's thinking and now if I want to add
02:33:07 --> 02:33:11
another uh like a little feature
02:33:10 --> 02:33:14
definitely needs to have
02:33:11 --> 02:33:16
Emoji yeah in front of it and then like
02:33:15 --> 02:33:19
just follow the same style and add it
02:33:17 --> 02:33:22
and my goal is to make you happy to make
02:33:19 --> 02:33:23
make you smile like to make you like ha
02:33:22 --> 02:33:27
fuck I I get it and now you're going to
02:33:24 --> 02:33:28
start respecting me and like trusting me
02:33:27 --> 02:33:31
and like you start working together in
02:33:29 --> 02:33:33
this way I I don't know I I don't know
02:33:31 --> 02:33:33
how hard is to find developers no I
02:33:33 --> 02:33:35
think that exist I think you need to I
02:33:34 --> 02:33:37
need to hire more people need to try
02:33:35 --> 02:33:39
more people but that cost a lot of my
02:33:37 --> 02:33:41
energy and time but it's 100% possible
02:33:40 --> 02:33:44
but do I want it I don't know things
02:33:42 --> 02:33:46
kind of run fine for now and I mean like
02:33:44 --> 02:33:47
okay you can say like okay nor looks
02:33:46 --> 02:33:48
kind of clunky like people say the
02:33:48 --> 02:33:51
design is kind of clunk okay I'll
02:33:48 --> 02:33:51
improve the design it's like next to my
02:33:51 --> 02:33:54
to-do list for example you know like I
02:33:52 --> 02:33:55
can I'll get there eventually but it's
02:33:54 --> 02:33:57
true I mean you're also extremely good
02:33:55 --> 02:33:59
at at what you do like I'm just looking
02:33:57 --> 02:34:02
at the interfaces of like Photo AI like
02:34:00 --> 02:34:04
you would Jake by the way jQuery right
02:34:03 --> 02:34:08
like how amazing is jQuery but like you
02:34:04 --> 02:34:09
can these Cowboys are getting these are
02:34:08 --> 02:34:12
there's these
02:34:09 --> 02:34:14
Cowboys this is a lot it's a lot but I'm
02:34:13 --> 02:34:17
glad they're all wearing shirts anyway
02:34:15 --> 02:34:19
the interface here is just really really
02:34:17 --> 02:34:22
nice like I could tell you know what
02:34:20 --> 02:34:25
you're doing and with Nomad list
02:34:23 --> 02:34:27
extremely nice the interface thank you
02:34:25 --> 02:34:29
man and that's all you yeah that's
02:34:27 --> 02:34:31
everything is me so all of this in every
02:34:30 --> 02:34:35
little feature all say it looks kind of
02:34:32 --> 02:34:38
ADHD or add you know like it's so much
02:34:35 --> 02:34:40
because it has so many things and design
02:34:39 --> 02:34:42
these days is minimalist right right
02:34:40 --> 02:34:45
right I hear you but this is uh a lot of
02:34:43 --> 02:34:48
information and it's useful information
02:34:45 --> 02:34:49
is delivered in a clean way while still
02:34:48 --> 02:34:51
stylish and fun to look at so like
02:34:50 --> 02:34:54
minimalist design is about like when you
02:34:52 --> 02:34:56
want to convey no information whatsoever
02:34:55 --> 02:34:58
and look cool it's very cool it's
02:34:57 --> 02:35:00
pretentious right pretentious or not
02:34:58 --> 02:35:01
that the function is like is useless
02:35:00 --> 02:35:04
this is about a lot of information
02:35:02 --> 02:35:06
delivered to you in a clean and when
02:35:05 --> 02:35:09
it's clean you can't be too sexy so it's
02:35:07 --> 02:35:10
sexy enough yeah this is I think how my
02:35:09 --> 02:35:12
brain looks you know like there's a lot
02:35:11 --> 02:35:14
of shit going on it's like drawing based
02:35:13 --> 02:35:17
music it's like
02:35:14 --> 02:35:19
very yeah but it's still pretty the
02:35:17 --> 02:35:22
spacing of everything is nice the font a
02:35:19 --> 02:35:24
really nice like very readable very
02:35:23 --> 02:35:26
small I like it you know but I made it
02:35:25 --> 02:35:29
so I don't trust my own judgments no
02:35:27 --> 02:35:32
this is really nice thank you the Emojis
02:35:29 --> 02:35:33
are somehow like it's a style it's a
02:35:32 --> 02:35:35
thing I need to pick the Emoji it takes
02:35:34 --> 02:35:38
a while to pick them you know there's
02:35:36 --> 02:35:41
some something about Emoji is a really
02:35:38 --> 02:35:43
nice memorable like placeholder for the
02:35:41 --> 02:35:44
idea yeah like if it was just text it
02:35:43 --> 02:35:46
would actually be overwhelming if you
02:35:45 --> 02:35:49
was just text the Emoji really helps
02:35:47 --> 02:35:50
it's a brilliant addition like some some
02:35:49 --> 02:35:51
people might look at it why do you have
02:35:50 --> 02:35:53
emojis everywhere it's actually really
02:35:52 --> 02:35:55
for me it's really tell me to to remove
02:35:54 --> 02:35:57
the Emojis people don't know what
02:35:55 --> 02:35:59
they're talking about and then
02:35:57 --> 02:36:01
the I'm sure people will tell you a lot
02:35:59 --> 02:36:04
of things this is really nice and then
02:36:01 --> 02:36:06
using color is nice small font but not
02:36:05 --> 02:36:10
too small and obviously you have to show
02:36:07 --> 02:36:12
maps which is really tricky
02:36:10 --> 02:36:15
yeah yeah this is this is no this is
02:36:13 --> 02:36:17
really really really nice and all of I
02:36:15 --> 02:36:21
mean like okay like how this looks when
02:36:17 --> 02:36:23
you uh hover over it yeah as transitions
02:36:21 --> 02:36:24
no I understand that but like I'm sure
02:36:24 --> 02:36:26
there's like how long does it take you
02:36:25 --> 02:36:27
to figure out how you want it to look do
02:36:27 --> 02:36:30
you ever go out down Rabbit Hole where
02:36:28 --> 02:36:32
you spend like two weeks no it's all
02:36:30 --> 02:36:34
iterative it's like 10 years of you know
02:36:32 --> 02:36:36
add a SE transition here or or do this
02:36:34 --> 02:36:38
or well was say like see these are all
02:36:37 --> 02:36:40
these are rounded now yeah if you wanted
02:36:39 --> 02:36:42
to like H round is probably the better
02:36:40 --> 02:36:43
way but if you wanted to be rectangular
02:36:42 --> 02:36:47
like sharp Corners what would you do you
02:36:44 --> 02:36:50
just so I go to the index. CSS and I do
02:36:47 --> 02:36:52
command F and I search border radius
02:36:50 --> 02:36:55
12px and then I replace with border
02:36:52 --> 02:36:57
radius zero and then I do command enter
02:36:56 --> 02:37:00
and it's G deploys it it pushes to the
02:36:58 --> 02:37:03
GI Hub and then sends a webbook and then
02:37:00 --> 02:37:05
deploys to my server and it's live in 5
02:37:04 --> 02:37:07
seconds oh you often deploy to
02:37:05 --> 02:37:09
production you you don't have like a
02:37:07 --> 02:37:13
testing ground no so
02:37:10 --> 02:37:15
I so I I'm like famous for this Cu uh
02:37:14 --> 02:37:17
I'm too lazy to set up like a staging
02:37:16 --> 02:37:19
server on my laptop every time so I
02:37:17 --> 02:37:21
nowadays I just deploy to production
02:37:19 --> 02:37:23
yeah and um it's man I'm going to canel
02:37:22 --> 02:37:25
for this you know but it it works very
02:37:24 --> 02:37:27
well for me CU I have a lot of I have
02:37:25 --> 02:37:29
like PHP lint and J lint so it tells me
02:37:27 --> 02:37:32
when has error so I don't deploy but my
02:37:30 --> 02:37:34
literally I I I have like 37,000 git
02:37:33 --> 02:37:36
commits in the last 12 months or
02:37:34 --> 02:37:38
something so I make like small fix and
02:37:36 --> 02:37:40
then command enter M uh and sends to
02:37:39 --> 02:37:43
GitHub GitHub sends a web to my server
02:37:41 --> 02:37:45
web server pulls it deploys the
02:37:43 --> 02:37:47
production and it's there what's the
02:37:45 --> 02:37:50
latency of that from you pressing one
02:37:47 --> 02:37:51
second can be one two seconds to make a
02:37:50 --> 02:37:52
change and then you're getting really
02:37:51 --> 02:37:53
good at like not making mistakes
02:37:53 --> 02:37:55
basically man 100% you're right like
02:37:54 --> 02:37:56
people are like how can you do this why
02:37:55 --> 02:37:57
you get good at not taking the server
02:37:56 --> 02:38:00
down you know like because you need to
02:37:58 --> 02:38:02
code more carefully but it's look it's
02:38:01 --> 02:38:04
idiotic in any big company but for me it
02:38:03 --> 02:38:08
works because it makes me so fast like
02:38:05 --> 02:38:10
somebody um will report a bug on Twitter
02:38:09 --> 02:38:12
and I kind of did do like a stopwatch
02:38:11 --> 02:38:14
like how fast can I fix this bug and
02:38:12 --> 02:38:16
then two minutes later for example it's
02:38:14 --> 02:38:18
fixed yeah and it's fun cuz it's cuz
02:38:17 --> 02:38:19
it's annoying for me to work with
02:38:18 --> 02:38:21
companies where report a bug and it
02:38:20 --> 02:38:23
takes like 6 months yeah it's like
02:38:22 --> 02:38:26
horrible and it makes people really
02:38:23 --> 02:38:28
happy when you can really quickly solve
02:38:27 --> 02:38:31
their problems so but it's it's crazy
02:38:29 --> 02:38:32
I'm I admit I don't think it's crazy I I
02:38:31 --> 02:38:34
mean there's I'm sure there's a middle
02:38:32 --> 02:38:36
ground but I think that whole thing
02:38:35 --> 02:38:39
where there's a a phase of like testing
02:38:37 --> 02:38:41
and there's the staging and there's a
02:38:39 --> 02:38:43
develop and then there's like multiple
02:38:42 --> 02:38:47
tables and databases that you use for
02:38:44 --> 02:38:48
the state like it's fing it's a mess and
02:38:47 --> 02:38:50
there's different teams involved it's
02:38:48 --> 02:38:51
it's not good I'm like a good funny
02:38:50 --> 02:38:53
extreme on the other size you know but
02:38:52 --> 02:38:57
just a little bit safer but not too much
02:38:54 --> 02:38:58
it would be great yeah yeah I'm sure
02:38:57 --> 02:39:01
that's actually like how X now how they
02:38:58 --> 02:39:02
doing rapid Improvement they do because
02:39:01 --> 02:39:04
there's more bugs and people complain
02:39:02 --> 02:39:05
about like oh look he bought this
02:39:04 --> 02:39:07
Twitter now it's full of bugs dude he's
02:39:06 --> 02:39:10
shipping stuff like things are happening
02:39:08 --> 02:39:12
now and it's a dynamic app now yeah the
02:39:11 --> 02:39:13
bugs is actually a sign of a good thing
02:39:12 --> 02:39:14
happening the bugs of the feature
02:39:14 --> 02:39:17
because it shows that the team is
02:39:15 --> 02:39:19
actually building shit 100% well one of
02:39:17 --> 02:39:20
the problems is like I see with YouTube
02:39:19 --> 02:39:24
there's so much potential to build
02:39:21 --> 02:39:27
features but I just see how long it
02:39:25 --> 02:39:30
takes so I've gotten a chance to uh
02:39:28 --> 02:39:33
interact with with many other teams but
02:39:30 --> 02:39:35
one of the teams is uh MLA multilanguage
02:39:34 --> 02:39:38
audio I don't know if you know this but
02:39:35 --> 02:39:39
in YouTube you can have audio tracks in
02:39:38 --> 02:39:41
different languages for overdubbing and
02:39:40 --> 02:39:44
that there's a team and not many people
02:39:42 --> 02:39:47
are using it but like every single
02:39:45 --> 02:39:49
feature they have to meet and agree and
02:39:47 --> 02:39:51
like there's allocate resources like
02:39:49 --> 02:39:51
Engineers have to work on it but I'm
02:39:51 --> 02:39:54
sure it's a pain in the ass for the
02:39:52 --> 02:39:55
engineers to get approval to like
02:39:54 --> 02:39:58
because that it has to not break the
02:39:56 --> 02:40:00
rest of the site whatever they do but
02:39:59 --> 02:40:03
like if you don't have enough
02:40:00 --> 02:40:05
dictatorial like top down like we need
02:40:04 --> 02:40:07
this now it's going to take forever to
02:40:05 --> 02:40:08
do anything multilanguage audio but
02:40:07 --> 02:40:12
multilanguage audio is a good example of
02:40:09 --> 02:40:14
a thing that seems Niche right now but
02:40:13 --> 02:40:17
it quite possibly could change the
02:40:15 --> 02:40:20
entire world when you have when I upload
02:40:17 --> 02:40:23
this this conversation right here if
02:40:20 --> 02:40:26
instantaneously it dubs it into 40
02:40:24 --> 02:40:29
languages yeah man and everybody consume
02:40:27 --> 02:40:31
every single video can be watched and
02:40:29 --> 02:40:33
listened to in those different it
02:40:31 --> 02:40:34
changes everything and YouTube is
02:40:33 --> 02:40:36
extremely well positioned to be the
02:40:35 --> 02:40:40
leader in this they got the they got the
02:40:37 --> 02:40:42
compute they got the uh the user base
02:40:40 --> 02:40:44
they got like they have the experience
02:40:42 --> 02:40:46
of how to do this so like multilanguage
02:40:44 --> 02:40:49
audio should be high priority feature
02:40:47 --> 02:40:51
right yeah that's high priority like and
02:40:49 --> 02:40:52
it's a way you know Google is obsessed
02:40:51 --> 02:40:54
with AI right now they want to show off
02:40:53 --> 02:40:57
that they could be dominant in AI That's
02:40:55 --> 02:41:00
a way for Google to say like we used AI
02:40:57 --> 02:41:01
like this is a way to to to Break Down
02:41:00 --> 02:41:03
The Walls that language creates the
02:41:01 --> 02:41:03
preferred outcome for them for them is
02:41:03 --> 02:41:06
probably their career and not the the
02:41:04 --> 02:41:08
overall result of the the cool product
02:41:07 --> 02:41:10
you know I think they they're not like
02:41:08 --> 02:41:11
selfish or whatever they they want to do
02:41:10 --> 02:41:13
good there's something about the machine
02:41:12 --> 02:41:16
organization organizational stuff that I
02:41:14 --> 02:41:18
have this when I report bogs and like
02:41:16 --> 02:41:19
big companies I work with I get I talk
02:41:18 --> 02:41:21
to a lot of different people DM and
02:41:20 --> 02:41:23
they're all really trying hard to do
02:41:21 --> 02:41:24
something they're all really nice and
02:41:23 --> 02:41:26
I'm the one being kind of asshole cuz
02:41:25 --> 02:41:28
I'm like guys I'm talking to 20 people
02:41:27 --> 02:41:30
about this for six months and nothing's
02:41:29 --> 02:41:34
happening and say man I know but I'm
02:41:31 --> 02:41:36
trying my best and yeah so it's systemic
02:41:34 --> 02:41:38
yeah so what it requires again I don't
02:41:37 --> 02:41:40
know if there must be a nicer word but
02:41:38 --> 02:41:43
like a dictatorial type of top down the
02:41:40 --> 02:41:46
co rolls in uh and just says like for
02:41:43 --> 02:41:48
YouTube it's like MLA get this done now
02:41:46 --> 02:41:49
this is the highest priority I think big
02:41:49 --> 02:41:51
companies especially in America a lot of
02:41:50 --> 02:41:53
it is legal right you need to pass
02:41:52 --> 02:41:55
everything through legal yeah and you
02:41:54 --> 02:41:57
can't like man the things I do I could
02:41:55 --> 02:41:58
never do that in a big Corporation
02:41:57 --> 02:42:01
because it's everything has to be
02:41:58 --> 02:42:03
probably get deployed has to go to Legal
02:42:01 --> 02:42:06
well again dict tutorial you basically
02:42:03 --> 02:42:08
say Steve Jobs did this quite a lot I've
02:42:06 --> 02:42:11
seen a lot of leaders do this ignore the
02:42:09 --> 02:42:14
lawyers ignore coms ignore PR ignore
02:42:12 --> 02:42:16
everybody give power to the engineers
02:42:14 --> 02:42:17
like listen to the people on the ground
02:42:16 --> 02:42:20
get this shit done and get it done by
02:42:18 --> 02:42:21
Friday yeah that's it and the law can
02:42:20 --> 02:42:22
change like for example let's say you
02:42:21 --> 02:42:23
you launch this AI dubbing and it
02:42:23 --> 02:42:26
there's some law legal problems with
02:42:24 --> 02:42:27
lawsuits okay so the Law changes there
02:42:26 --> 02:42:29
will be appeals there will be some
02:42:28 --> 02:42:31
Supreme Court thing whatever and the Law
02:42:30 --> 02:42:33
changes so just by shipping it you
02:42:31 --> 02:42:34
change society you change the legal
02:42:33 --> 02:42:36
framework and by not shipping being
02:42:35 --> 02:42:38
scared of the legal framework all the
02:42:36 --> 02:42:40
time like you're not changing things
02:42:38 --> 02:42:42
just out of curiosity what uh what IDE
02:42:41 --> 02:42:43
do you use let's talk about like your
02:42:43 --> 02:42:47
whole
02:42:44 --> 02:42:49
setup given how ultr productive you are
02:42:47 --> 02:42:51
and that you often programing your
02:42:49 --> 02:42:54
underwear slouching in the couch is
02:42:52 --> 02:42:57
there does it matter to you in general
02:42:55 --> 02:42:59
is there like a specific ID you use vs
02:42:57 --> 02:43:01
code yeah vs code before I use Sublime
02:42:59 --> 02:43:02
Text I don't think it matters a lot I
02:43:01 --> 02:43:05
think I'm I'm very skeptical of like
02:43:03 --> 02:43:07
tools when people think it they say it
02:43:06 --> 02:43:10
matters right I don't think it matters I
02:43:07 --> 02:43:11
think uh whatever tool you know very
02:43:10 --> 02:43:13
well you can go very very fast in like
02:43:12 --> 02:43:16
you know the shortcuts for example IDE
02:43:13 --> 02:43:16
you know you know like um I love Sublime
02:43:16 --> 02:43:19
Text because I could use like multic
02:43:17 --> 02:43:22
cursor you know you search something and
02:43:19 --> 02:43:25
I could like make Mass replaces in a
02:43:23 --> 02:43:26
file with the cursor thing and uh VOD
02:43:25 --> 02:43:27
doesn't really have that as well it's
02:43:27 --> 02:43:31
actually interesting Sublime is the
02:43:28 --> 02:43:32
first editor where I've learned that and
02:43:31 --> 02:43:34
I think they just make that super easy
02:43:33 --> 02:43:38
so like what would that be called
02:43:34 --> 02:43:40
multi-edit multi multi cursor edit thing
02:43:38 --> 02:43:42
whatever I'm sure like almost every
02:43:40 --> 02:43:45
editor can do that it's just probably
02:43:42 --> 02:43:48
hard to set up yeah's not so good at it
02:43:46 --> 02:43:51
I think or at least I try it but I would
02:43:48 --> 02:43:51
use say to like uh process data like um
02:43:51 --> 02:43:54
data sets for example from World Bank I
02:43:52 --> 02:43:58
would just multic cursor Mass change
02:43:55 --> 02:44:00
everything um but yeah vs code I man I
02:43:58 --> 02:44:01
was bullied into using vs code because
02:44:00 --> 02:44:03
Twitter would always see my screenshots
02:44:02 --> 02:44:06
of sublime text and say why are you
02:44:03 --> 02:44:07
still using Sublime Text like Boomer you
02:44:06 --> 02:44:09
need to use vs codes and I'm like okay
02:44:07 --> 02:44:11
I'll try it I I got a new Macbook and
02:44:09 --> 02:44:13
then I I never install like I never copi
02:44:12 --> 02:44:15
the old MacBook I just make it fresh you
02:44:13 --> 02:44:17
know like a clean like format C you know
02:44:15 --> 02:44:19
Windows like clean start and I'm like
02:44:18 --> 02:44:21
okay I'll try vs code and it's stuck you
02:44:20 --> 02:44:23
know but I don't really care like it's
02:44:21 --> 02:44:25
not so important for me wow you know the
02:44:23 --> 02:44:27
format see reference huh dude it was so
02:44:25 --> 02:44:28
good you would install Windows and then
02:44:27 --> 02:44:30
after three or six months it would start
02:44:29 --> 02:44:34
breaking and everything was like get
02:44:31 --> 02:44:36
slow then you would restart go to Doss
02:44:34 --> 02:44:39
format C you would delete your hard
02:44:37 --> 02:44:42
drive and then install the Windows 95
02:44:40 --> 02:44:43
again was so good times and you would
02:44:42 --> 02:44:45
design everything like now I'm going to
02:44:43 --> 02:44:46
install it properly now I'm going to
02:44:45 --> 02:44:48
design my desktop properly you know like
02:44:47 --> 02:44:51
yeah I don't know if it's peer pressure
02:44:48 --> 02:44:52
but like I use zMAX for many many years
02:44:51 --> 02:44:53
and I know you know I love lisp so a lot
02:44:53 --> 02:44:56
of the
02:44:54 --> 02:44:57
customization is done in lisp it's a
02:44:56 --> 02:44:59
programming language it partially was
02:44:57 --> 02:45:01
peer pressure but part of was realizing
02:45:00 --> 02:45:05
like you need to keep learning stuff
02:45:02 --> 02:45:06
like the same issue with jQuery like I
02:45:05 --> 02:45:09
still think I need to learn node.js for
02:45:07 --> 02:45:10
example yeah even though that's not my
02:45:09 --> 02:45:12
main thing or even close to the main
02:45:11 --> 02:45:14
thing but I feel like you need to keep
02:45:13 --> 02:45:17
learning this
02:45:14 --> 02:45:19
stuff and even if you don't choose to
02:45:17 --> 02:45:22
use it long term you need to give it a
02:45:20 --> 02:45:24
chance so you your understanding of the
02:45:22 --> 02:45:24
world expands yeah you want to
02:45:24 --> 02:45:27
understand the new technological
02:45:25 --> 02:45:28
Concepts and see if they can benefit you
02:45:28 --> 02:45:31
you know it would be stupid not to even
02:45:29 --> 02:45:34
try it's more about the concepts I would
02:45:31 --> 02:45:35
say than the actual tools like expanding
02:45:34 --> 02:45:36
and that can be a challenging thing so
02:45:36 --> 02:45:39
going to VSS code and like really
02:45:37 --> 02:45:40
learning it like all the shortcuts all
02:45:39 --> 02:45:42
the extensions and actually installing
02:45:40 --> 02:45:44
different stuff and playing with it that
02:45:42 --> 02:45:45
was a interesting challenge it was
02:45:44 --> 02:45:47
uncomfortable at first yeah for me too
02:45:46 --> 02:45:49
yeah yeah but you just dive in it's like
02:45:48 --> 02:45:51
neur Flex like you keep your brain fresh
02:45:50 --> 02:45:53
you know like this kind of stuff I got
02:45:52 --> 02:45:56
to do that more like have you given
02:45:54 --> 02:45:58
react a chance no but I I want to I want
02:45:57 --> 02:46:00
to learn I want to I I understand the
02:45:58 --> 02:46:02
basics right
02:46:00 --> 02:46:04
um I don't really know where to start
02:46:03 --> 02:46:07
but would you like I guess you got to
02:46:05 --> 02:46:10
use your own model which is like build
02:46:07 --> 02:46:11
the thing using it no man you're so I
02:46:10 --> 02:46:14
kind of did that like I kind like the
02:46:12 --> 02:46:17
the the stuff I do in Jer is essentially
02:46:14 --> 02:46:19
a lot of it is like I start rebuilding
02:46:18 --> 02:46:21
whatever Tech is already out there not
02:46:20 --> 02:46:23
based on that but just an accident like
02:46:21 --> 02:46:23
I keep goinging long enough that I built
02:46:23 --> 02:46:25
the same I start getting the same
02:46:24 --> 02:46:26
problems everybody else had and you
02:46:26 --> 02:46:28
start building the same Frameworks kind
02:46:27 --> 02:46:30
of so I essentially I use my own kind of
02:46:29 --> 02:46:32
framework of so you basically build a
02:46:30 --> 02:46:33
framework from scratch that's your own
02:46:32 --> 02:46:35
that you understand it kind of yeah with
02:46:33 --> 02:46:36
ax calls but essentially it's same same
02:46:35 --> 02:46:38
thing look I don't have the time I don't
02:46:37 --> 02:46:40
and this is I think saying you don't
02:46:39 --> 02:46:42
have the time is like always a lie
02:46:40 --> 02:46:44
because you just don't prioritize it
02:46:42 --> 02:46:45
enough my priority is still like the the
02:46:45 --> 02:46:48
running the businesses and improving
02:46:46 --> 02:46:50
that and and AI I think learning AI is
02:46:48 --> 02:46:52
much more Val out and learning uh a
02:46:50 --> 02:46:54
front end framework yeah like it's just
02:46:52 --> 02:46:57
more impact I guess you should be just
02:46:55 --> 02:46:59
learning every single day a thing yeah
02:46:58 --> 02:47:01
you can learn a little bit every day
02:46:59 --> 02:47:02
like a little bit of react or I think
02:47:01 --> 02:47:05
now like next is very big so learn a
02:47:03 --> 02:47:06
little bit of next you know but I I call
02:47:06 --> 02:47:09
them the military industrial complex so
02:47:07 --> 02:47:11
if I but you need to know you need to
02:47:10 --> 02:47:14
know it anyway so you got to learn how
02:47:12 --> 02:47:16
to use the weapons of war and then and
02:47:14 --> 02:47:19
then you can be a peace neck yeah yeah I
02:47:16 --> 02:47:20
mean but you got to learn in in in the
02:47:19 --> 02:47:22
same exact ways we were talking about
02:47:21 --> 02:47:24
which is learning by trying to build
02:47:23 --> 02:47:26
something with it and actually deploy it
02:47:25 --> 02:47:29
the Frameworks are so complicated and it
02:47:27 --> 02:47:31
changes so fast so it's like where do I
02:47:29 --> 02:47:31
start you know and I guess it's the same
02:47:31 --> 02:47:34
thing when you're starting out making
02:47:32 --> 02:47:38
websites like how where do you start as
02:47:34 --> 02:47:39
gp4 I guess but it yeah it's just so
02:47:38 --> 02:47:41
Dynamic it changes so fast that I don't
02:47:40 --> 02:47:43
know if it would be a good idea for me
02:47:41 --> 02:47:46
to learn it you know um maybe some
02:47:44 --> 02:47:49
combination of like few next with PHP
02:47:47 --> 02:47:52
laravel laravel is like a framework for
02:47:49 --> 02:47:54
PHP I think that would be uh it could
02:47:52 --> 02:47:56
benefit me you know maybe Tailwind for
02:47:54 --> 02:47:58
CS like a styling engine that that stuff
02:47:57 --> 02:48:00
could probably save me time yeah but
02:47:59 --> 02:48:02
like you you won't know until you really
02:48:00 --> 02:48:04
give it a try and it feels like you have
02:48:02 --> 02:48:06
to build like if maybe I'm talking to
02:48:05 --> 02:48:10
myself but like I I should
02:48:07 --> 02:48:14
probably recode like my personal one
02:48:10 --> 02:48:15
page in laral or yeah and even though it
02:48:14 --> 02:48:17
might not have almost any Dynamic
02:48:16 --> 02:48:20
elements maybe have one Dynamic element
02:48:18 --> 02:48:22
but it has to go end to end in that
02:48:21 --> 02:48:26
framework or like end to end build it in
02:48:23 --> 02:48:28
node.js some of it is I don't figuring
02:48:26 --> 02:48:29
out how to you even deploy the thing
02:48:28 --> 02:48:31
have no idea all I know is right now I
02:48:30 --> 02:48:33
would send it to GitHub and it sends it
02:48:31 --> 02:48:35
to my server I don't know how to get
02:48:33 --> 02:48:39
JavaScript running I have no clue yeah
02:48:36 --> 02:48:42
so I guess I need like a a pass like a
02:48:39 --> 02:48:43
like versal right or uh you know Heroku
02:48:42 --> 02:48:45
kind of those kind of platforms I
02:48:44 --> 02:48:48
actually kind of just my gave myself the
02:48:46 --> 02:48:51
idea of like I kind of just want to
02:48:49 --> 02:48:55
build a single web page like one web
02:48:52 --> 02:48:57
page that has like one Dynamic element
02:48:55 --> 02:48:59
and just do it in every single like in a
02:48:57 --> 02:49:02
lot of Frameworks like just ah on the
02:49:00 --> 02:49:05
same page same same page kind page
02:49:03 --> 02:49:06
that's a cool prodct like learn all
02:49:05 --> 02:49:08
these Frameworks and you can see the
02:49:06 --> 02:49:10
differences yeah that's interesting how
02:49:08 --> 02:49:12
long it takes to do it yeah stopwatch I
02:49:10 --> 02:49:14
have to figure out actually something
02:49:12 --> 02:49:16
sufficiently complicated because it
02:49:15 --> 02:49:19
should probably do it should probably do
02:49:17 --> 02:49:21
some kind of
02:49:19 --> 02:49:23
thing where it accesses the database and
02:49:21 --> 02:49:25
dynamically is changing stuff some AI
02:49:23 --> 02:49:26
stuff some llm stuff yeah maybe some it
02:49:26 --> 02:49:30
doesn't have to be
02:49:27 --> 02:49:31
aii call Api call to something to to
02:49:30 --> 02:49:33
replicate for example and then you have
02:49:32 --> 02:49:36
yeah that would be a very cool project
02:49:33 --> 02:49:39
yeah yeah and like time it and also
02:49:37 --> 02:49:42
report on my happiness yeah I'm going to
02:49:40 --> 02:49:43
totally do this cuz nobody benchmarks
02:49:42 --> 02:49:45
this nobody's Benchmark happy developer
02:49:43 --> 02:49:47
happiness with Frameworks yeah nobody's
02:49:45 --> 02:49:49
benchmarked the shipping time just take
02:49:48 --> 02:49:52
like a month do this how many Frameworks
02:49:50 --> 02:49:54
are there there's how many how many
02:49:52 --> 02:49:56
there there's like five main ways of
02:49:54 --> 02:49:58
doing it so there's like this is no
02:49:57 --> 02:50:00
there's back end front end and this
02:49:58 --> 02:50:01
stuff confused me too like react now
02:50:00 --> 02:50:03
apparently has become back end yeah or
02:50:02 --> 02:50:05
something used to be only front end and
02:50:04 --> 02:50:07
you're forced to do now backend also I
02:50:06 --> 02:50:08
don't know and then but there's not
02:50:07 --> 02:50:11
really you're not really forced to do
02:50:08 --> 02:50:13
anything so like B according to the
02:50:12 --> 02:50:16
Internet so like there's no um it's
02:50:14 --> 02:50:18
actually not trivial to find the canical
02:50:16 --> 02:50:20
way of doing things so like the standard
02:50:18 --> 02:50:22
vanilla like you you go to the ice cream
02:50:20 --> 02:50:24
shop there's like a million flavors I
02:50:23 --> 02:50:28
want vanilla if if I've never had ice
02:50:25 --> 02:50:31
cream in my life can we just like learn
02:50:28 --> 02:50:33
about ice cream yeah I want vanilla
02:50:32 --> 02:50:36
nobody actually sometimes they'll
02:50:34 --> 02:50:38
literally name it vanilla but like I
02:50:36 --> 02:50:41
want to know what's the basic way but
02:50:38 --> 02:50:43
not like dumb but like the standard
02:50:41 --> 02:50:46
canonical want to know the dominant way
02:50:43 --> 02:50:47
like 60% of developers do it like this
02:50:46 --> 02:50:50
it's hard to figure that out you know
02:50:48 --> 02:50:53
that's the problem yeah maybe LMS can
02:50:51 --> 02:50:55
help maybe you should explicitly ask
02:50:53 --> 02:50:56
what is the dominant they usually know
02:50:55 --> 02:50:58
like the dominant you know they they
02:50:56 --> 02:50:59
they give answers that are like the most
02:50:58 --> 02:51:02
probable kind of yeah so that makes
02:51:00 --> 02:51:05
sense to ask them and not I think
02:51:03 --> 02:51:06
honestly maybe it would help is if if
02:51:05 --> 02:51:08
you want to learn or I would want to
02:51:06 --> 02:51:09
learn like a framework hire somebody
02:51:09 --> 02:51:12
that already does it and just sit with
02:51:10 --> 02:51:13
them and make something together like
02:51:13 --> 02:51:16
I've never done that but I thought about
02:51:14 --> 02:51:19
it that would be a very fast way to you
02:51:16 --> 02:51:21
know take their knowledge
02:51:19 --> 02:51:22
Tred these kinds of things what happens
02:51:21 --> 02:51:26
is depends what kind of if they're like
02:51:23 --> 02:51:28
a worldclass developer yes often times
02:51:26 --> 02:51:30
they themselves are used to that thing
02:51:29 --> 02:51:33
and they have not themselves explored in
02:51:31 --> 02:51:36
other options so they have this dogmatic
02:51:33 --> 02:51:38
like talking down to you like this is
02:51:36 --> 02:51:39
the right way to do it it's like no no
02:51:39 --> 02:51:43
no we're just like exploring together
02:51:40 --> 02:51:45
okay show me the cool thing you've
02:51:43 --> 02:51:49
tried which is like it has to have U
02:51:46 --> 02:51:52
open-mindedness to like you know node.js
02:51:49 --> 02:51:54
is not the right way to do web
02:51:52 --> 02:51:57
development it's like one way and
02:51:55 --> 02:52:02
there's nothing wrong with the the old
02:51:58 --> 02:52:04
lamp PHP jQuery vanilla JavaScript way
02:52:03 --> 02:52:06
it just has its pros and cons and like
02:52:05 --> 02:52:08
you need to know what those people exist
02:52:06 --> 02:52:09
you could find those people probably
02:52:08 --> 02:52:11
yeah like if you want to learn AI
02:52:10 --> 02:52:13
imagine you have karpati sitting next to
02:52:12 --> 02:52:15
you teach you L like he does his YouTube
02:52:14 --> 02:52:18
videos is amazing he can teach it to
02:52:15 --> 02:52:20
like a 5-year-old about how how to make
02:52:18 --> 02:52:21
llm it's amazing like imagine this guy
02:52:21 --> 02:52:24
sitting next to you and just teaching
02:52:22 --> 02:52:26
you like let's make LM together like
02:52:24 --> 02:52:27
holy shit it would be amazing yeah I
02:52:26 --> 02:52:30
mean well
02:52:27 --> 02:52:32
Kath has its own style and his like I'm
02:52:31 --> 02:52:34
not sure he he's for everybody but for
02:52:33 --> 02:52:37
example 5-year-old it depends on the
02:52:34 --> 02:52:37
5-year-old yeah but he's like super
02:52:37 --> 02:52:39
technical but he's amazing because he's
02:52:38 --> 02:52:41
super technical and he's the only one
02:52:39 --> 02:52:44
who can explain stuff in a simple way
02:52:42 --> 02:52:46
which shows his complete genius yes
02:52:44 --> 02:52:48
because if you can explain without
02:52:46 --> 02:52:51
jargon you're like wow and build it from
02:52:49 --> 02:52:54
scratch yeah it's like top tier you know
02:52:52 --> 02:52:57
like what a guy but he might be anti
02:52:54 --> 02:52:59
framework cuz he buil from Scrat exactly
02:52:57 --> 02:53:01
yeah actually probably is yeah uh he's
02:53:00 --> 02:53:03
like you but for AI yeah so maybe
02:53:02 --> 02:53:04
learning framework is a is a very bad
02:53:03 --> 02:53:07
idea for us you know maybe we should
02:53:05 --> 02:53:09
stay in PHP and like script Kitty and
02:53:07 --> 02:53:12
the but you have to Maybe by learning
02:53:09 --> 02:53:14
the framework you learn what you want to
02:53:13 --> 02:53:15
yourself build from scratch yeah maybe
02:53:14 --> 02:53:16
you learn Concepts but you don't
02:53:15 --> 02:53:18
actually have to start using it for your
02:53:17 --> 02:53:21
life right yeah yeah
02:53:19 --> 02:53:24
and you're still a Mac guy was a Mac guy
02:53:21 --> 02:53:25
yeah yeah I switched to Mac in 2015
02:53:24 --> 02:53:26
because uh it was CU When I wanted to
02:53:25 --> 02:53:27
start traveling and my brother was like
02:53:27 --> 02:53:30
dude get a Macbook is like the standard
02:53:28 --> 02:53:31
now I'm like wow I need to switch from
02:53:30 --> 02:53:34
Windows and I had like three screens you
02:53:32 --> 02:53:36
know like Windows had this whole setup
02:53:34 --> 02:53:38
for music production I had to sell
02:53:36 --> 02:53:40
everything um and then I had a Macbook
02:53:39 --> 02:53:44
and I remember opening up this MacBook
02:53:41 --> 02:53:46
box like ah and it was so beautiful it
02:53:44 --> 02:53:47
was like this aluminum and then I opened
02:53:46 --> 02:53:49
it I removed the you know the screen
02:53:47 --> 02:53:51
protector thing mhm it's so beautiful
02:53:49 --> 02:53:52
and I didn't touch it for three days I
02:53:51 --> 02:53:53
was just like looking at it really and I
02:53:53 --> 02:53:56
was still on the Windows computer and
02:53:54 --> 02:53:57
then I went traveling with that so I and
02:53:56 --> 02:53:59
all my great things started when I
02:53:58 --> 02:54:01
switched to MEC which sounds very
02:54:00 --> 02:54:03
dogmatic right but what great things are
02:54:01 --> 02:54:03
you talking about all the business
02:54:03 --> 02:54:06
started working out like I started
02:54:04 --> 02:54:08
traveling I started building startups I
02:54:07 --> 02:54:12
started making money it all started when
02:54:08 --> 02:54:13
I switched to Mech listen I I kind
02:54:12 --> 02:54:16
of you're making me want to switch to
02:54:14 --> 02:54:20
Mac so I use either use Linux inside
02:54:17 --> 02:54:24
windows with w SL or just UB ontu Linux
02:54:21 --> 02:54:26
but windows for most stuff like editing
02:54:24 --> 02:54:28
or any like uh
02:54:26 --> 02:54:30
any yeah yeah well you could use I guess
02:54:29 --> 02:54:32
you could do Mac stuff there I wonder if
02:54:31 --> 02:54:34
I should switch what do you miss about
02:54:33 --> 02:54:37
Windows what was the pros and cons I
02:54:35 --> 02:54:38
think the finder is horrible MEC like
02:54:37 --> 02:54:40
it's like it's it's the what is horrible
02:54:38 --> 02:54:41
the finder oh you don't know the so this
02:54:40 --> 02:54:44
the Windows Explorer
02:54:42 --> 02:54:46
yeah is amazing finder is strange man
02:54:44 --> 02:54:47
there like strange things this's this
02:54:46 --> 02:54:50
bug where if you if you send like test
02:54:48 --> 02:54:52
your photo on WhatsApp or telegram it
02:54:50 --> 02:54:53
just selects the whole folder and you
02:54:52 --> 02:54:55
almost accidentally can click enter and
02:54:54 --> 02:54:57
you send all your photos all your files
02:54:56 --> 02:54:59
to this chat group have it to my
02:54:58 --> 02:55:02
girlfriend she starts sending me photo
02:54:59 --> 02:55:04
photo photo photo photo so F finder is
02:55:02 --> 02:55:05
very unusable but it has Linux like the
02:55:05 --> 02:55:08
whole thing is like it's Unix based
02:55:06 --> 02:55:09
right so you use the command line like
02:55:08 --> 02:55:12
yeah all the time like all the time and
02:55:10 --> 02:55:14
the cool thing is you can run I think
02:55:12 --> 02:55:17
it's like Unix like Debian or whatever
02:55:14 --> 02:55:18
you can run most Linux stuff on MEC OS
02:55:17 --> 02:55:20
which makes it very very good for
02:55:18 --> 02:55:22
development like I have my engine X
02:55:21 --> 02:55:24
server you know if I set if I'm not lazy
02:55:23 --> 02:55:27
and set up my staging on my laptop it's
02:55:25 --> 02:55:29
just the engine X server the same as I
02:55:27 --> 02:55:30
have on my Cloud Server right the same
02:55:29 --> 02:55:33
where the websites run and I can use
02:55:31 --> 02:55:35
almost everything the same config files
02:55:33 --> 02:55:37
configuration files and it just works
02:55:36 --> 02:55:39
and that makes Mac a very good platform
02:55:38 --> 02:55:43
for Linux stuff I
02:55:40 --> 02:55:46
think yeah yeah real Ubuntu is like
02:55:44 --> 02:55:49
better of course but yeah I'm in this
02:55:47 --> 02:55:52
weird situation where
02:55:50 --> 02:55:57
I'm somewhat of a power user in Windows
02:55:53 --> 02:56:01
and let's say Android and all the much
02:55:57 --> 02:56:03
smarter friends I have all using Mac and
02:56:01 --> 02:56:05
iPhone and it's like but you don't want
02:56:03 --> 02:56:07
to go through the peer pressure you know
02:56:05 --> 02:56:09
it's not peer pressure it's
02:56:08 --> 02:56:12
like like one of the reasons I want to
02:56:10 --> 02:56:14
have kids is that there's a lot of like
02:56:12 --> 02:56:16
I I would love to have kids as a base as
02:56:14 --> 02:56:17
a baseline but you know there's like a
02:56:16 --> 02:56:18
concern maybe there's going to be a
02:56:17 --> 02:56:20
tradeoff for all this kind of stuff but
02:56:19 --> 02:56:23
you see like these extremely successful
02:56:21 --> 02:56:24
smart people who are friends of mine who
02:56:23 --> 02:56:26
have kids and are really happy they have
02:56:25 --> 02:56:29
kids so that's that's not peer pressure
02:56:27 --> 02:56:31
that's just like a strong signal works
02:56:29 --> 02:56:32
for people it works for people and the
02:56:31 --> 02:56:36
same thing with Mac it's like
02:56:33 --> 02:56:37
yeah like the the fun like I don't see
02:56:36 --> 02:56:40
fundamentally I don't like closed
02:56:37 --> 02:56:41
systems so like fundamentally I like
02:56:40 --> 02:56:43
Windows more because there there's much
02:56:42 --> 02:56:45
more freedom same with Android there's
02:56:44 --> 02:56:50
much more freedom it's much more
02:56:46 --> 02:56:53
customizable but like all the the cool
02:56:50 --> 02:56:54
kids the smart kids are using Mac and
02:56:53 --> 02:56:57
iPhone it's like all right I need to
02:56:55 --> 02:56:59
really I need to give it a real chance
02:56:57 --> 02:57:00
especially for development since more
02:56:59 --> 02:57:02
and more stuff is done in the cloud
02:57:00 --> 02:57:04
anyway yeah well anyway uh but it's
02:57:03 --> 02:57:05
funny to hear you say all the good stuff
02:57:04 --> 02:57:07
started happening maybe I'll be like
02:57:06 --> 02:57:10
that guy too when I switch to Mac all
02:57:08 --> 02:57:10
the good stuff started happening I think
02:57:10 --> 02:57:12
it's just about the hardware it's not so
02:57:11 --> 02:57:14
much about the software the hardware so
02:57:13 --> 02:57:16
well builds right the keyboard and yeah
02:57:15 --> 02:57:18
but look at the keyboard I use so that
02:57:16 --> 02:57:20
is pretty cool
02:57:19 --> 02:57:24
that's one word for it uh what's your
02:57:21 --> 02:57:26
favorite place to work uh on the couch
02:57:24 --> 02:57:28
does the couch matter is the couch at
02:57:26 --> 02:57:30
home or is it any couch no any like
02:57:28 --> 02:57:31
Hotel couch also like in the room right
02:57:31 --> 02:57:34
in yeah but I used to work like very
02:57:32 --> 02:57:36
ergonomically with like a standing desk
02:57:34 --> 02:57:38
yeah and everything like perfect like
02:57:36 --> 02:57:40
eye height screen blah blah blah and I
02:57:38 --> 02:57:42
felt like man this has to do with
02:57:41 --> 02:57:44
lifting too I started getting RSI like
02:57:43 --> 02:57:45
uh repetitive strain injury like
02:57:44 --> 02:57:47
tingling stuff and it would go all the
02:57:45 --> 02:57:48
way on my back and I was sitting in a
02:57:47 --> 02:57:52
co-working space like 6:00 a.m. sun
02:57:49 --> 02:57:54
comes up and I'm working and I'm coding
02:57:53 --> 02:57:56
and I hear like a sound or something so
02:57:54 --> 02:58:00
I do like I look left and my neck get
02:57:56 --> 02:58:02
stuck like and I'm like wow fuck and
02:58:01 --> 02:58:05
um I'm like what's am I dying you know
02:58:03 --> 02:58:06
and I thought I'm probably dying so I
02:58:06 --> 02:58:08
don't want to die in a cing space I'm
02:58:07 --> 02:58:12
going to go home and die in like you
02:58:08 --> 02:58:13
know peace and honor yeah so I close my
02:58:12 --> 02:58:15
laptop and I put it in my backpack and I
02:58:14 --> 02:58:18
walked to the to the street and got on
02:58:16 --> 02:58:21
my motorbike went home um and I lie down
02:58:19 --> 02:58:24
on like a a pillow like with my legs up
02:58:21 --> 02:58:25
and stuff uh to get rid of this like
02:58:24 --> 02:58:27
because it was my whole back and it was
02:58:26 --> 02:58:29
because I was working like this all the
02:58:27 --> 02:58:32
time yeah so um I started getting like a
02:58:30 --> 02:58:35
a laptop stand everything ergonomically
02:58:32 --> 02:58:37
correct but then I started lifting and
02:58:36 --> 02:58:39
since then like it seems like uh
02:58:38 --> 02:58:41
everything gets straightened out your
02:58:39 --> 02:58:45
posture kind of you're more straight and
02:58:41 --> 02:58:47
I never have RS RSI anymore rep injury I
02:58:45 --> 02:58:49
never have tingling anymore uh no pain
02:58:48 --> 02:58:53
and stuff so then I started working on
02:58:50 --> 02:58:57
the sofa and it's great like it it feels
02:58:53 --> 02:58:58
um you're close to the I I sit like I
02:58:57 --> 02:59:01
sit like this yeah legs together and
02:58:59 --> 02:59:03
then a pillow and then a laptop and then
02:59:01 --> 02:59:04
I work are you like leaning back I'm
02:59:04 --> 02:59:07
kind of
02:59:05 --> 02:59:09
like together like legs and then where's
02:59:08 --> 02:59:13
the mouse using using the No No so every
02:59:10 --> 02:59:15
St bed on the Mac OS on the MacBook I
02:59:13 --> 02:59:17
used to have the Logitech MX Mouse the
02:59:15 --> 02:59:20
perfect economic Mouse doing like this
02:59:17 --> 02:59:21
little with thing one screen one screen
02:59:21 --> 02:59:23
and I used to have three screens so I
02:59:22 --> 02:59:25
come from the I know where people come
02:59:24 --> 02:59:28
from I I had I had all the stuff but
02:59:26 --> 02:59:29
then I realized that having it all
02:59:28 --> 02:59:31
condensed in one laptop it's a 16-inch
02:59:30 --> 02:59:34
Macbook so it's quite big but having it
02:59:32 --> 02:59:36
all there is amazing because you're so
02:59:34 --> 02:59:37
close to the tools you're so close to
02:59:36 --> 02:59:38
what's happening you know it's like
02:59:38 --> 02:59:43
working on the car or something it's
02:59:39 --> 02:59:44
like so um like man if you have Tre skin
02:59:43 --> 02:59:47
you look here look there you get also
02:59:44 --> 02:59:47
neck injury actually so it's well I
02:59:47 --> 02:59:49
don't know this this sounds like you're
02:59:48 --> 02:59:52
part of a cult and you're just trying to
02:59:50 --> 02:59:54
convince me but uh I mean but it's good
02:59:53 --> 02:59:56
to hear that you can be ultra productive
02:59:55 --> 02:59:59
on a single screen that's I me that's
02:59:57 --> 03:00:01
crazy command tap you alt up like when
02:59:59 --> 03:00:03
is alt up Mac command you switch very
03:00:01 --> 03:00:05
fast so you have like one the entire
03:00:04 --> 03:00:08
screen is taken out by vs code say you
03:00:05 --> 03:00:09
look at the code and then yeah and then
03:00:08 --> 03:00:12
like if you deploy like a website you
03:00:09 --> 03:00:12
what switch screens mon to Chrome I used
03:00:12 --> 03:00:16
to have this swipe screen you know you
03:00:13 --> 03:00:18
could do like um different screen spaces
03:00:16 --> 03:00:20
yeah I was like it's too difficult let's
03:00:19 --> 03:00:23
just put it on one screen on the MacBook
03:00:21 --> 03:00:25
and then and he can be productive that
03:00:23 --> 03:00:27
way yeah very productive yeah more
03:00:25 --> 03:00:28
productive than before interesting
03:00:28 --> 03:00:31
because I have I have three screens and
03:00:29 --> 03:00:33
two of them are vertical like the size
03:00:31 --> 03:00:35
code right yeah for code you can see a
03:00:33 --> 03:00:36
lot no man I love it like I'm I love
03:00:36 --> 03:00:38
seeing it with friends like they have
03:00:37 --> 03:00:40
amazing like Battle Stations right it's
03:00:38 --> 03:00:41
called It's amazing I want it but I
03:00:41 --> 03:00:44
don't want it right like do you like the
03:00:42 --> 03:00:46
constraints there's that's it there's
03:00:44 --> 03:00:48
some aspect of the constraints which
03:00:47 --> 03:00:50
like once get good at it you can focus
03:00:49 --> 03:00:52
your mind and you can man I'm suspicious
03:00:50 --> 03:00:53
of like more you know yeah you really
03:00:53 --> 03:00:56
need all the stuff like it might Slow Me
03:00:54 --> 03:00:58
Down actually it's a good way to put it
03:00:56 --> 03:01:01
I'm suspicious of more me too I'm
03:00:58 --> 03:01:02
suspicious of more in all in all ways in
03:01:01 --> 03:01:04
all because you can defend more right
03:01:03 --> 03:01:06
you can defend yeah I'm a developer I
03:01:05 --> 03:01:07
make money I need to I need to get more
03:01:06 --> 03:01:09
screens right I need to be more
03:01:07 --> 03:01:11
efficient and then you read stuff about
03:01:09 --> 03:01:13
like mythical man month where like
03:01:11 --> 03:01:15
hiring more people slows down a software
03:01:14 --> 03:01:17
project project that's famous I think
03:01:16 --> 03:01:19
you can use that metaphor maybe for you
03:01:17 --> 03:01:20
know tools as well then I see friends
03:01:19 --> 03:01:22
just with gear acquisition syndrome
03:01:21 --> 03:01:25
buying so much stuff but they're not
03:01:23 --> 03:01:27
that productive they have the best be
03:01:25 --> 03:01:29
most beautiful Battle Stations desktops
03:01:28 --> 03:01:31
everything they're not that productive
03:01:30 --> 03:01:33
and it's also like kind of fun like it's
03:01:31 --> 03:01:34
all from my laptop in a backpack right
03:01:33 --> 03:01:37
it's kind of noat minimalist take me
03:01:35 --> 03:01:38
through like the perfect ultr productive
03:01:37 --> 03:01:41
day in your
03:01:38 --> 03:01:45
life like say like where you get a lot
03:01:42 --> 03:01:48
of shit done yeah are you uh and it's
03:01:45 --> 03:01:49
all focused on getting shit done what
03:01:48 --> 03:01:52
what when are you waking up is it a
03:01:49 --> 03:01:53
regular time super early super late so I
03:01:53 --> 03:01:56
go to sleep like 2: am. usually
03:01:54 --> 03:01:59
something like that and uh before 4:
03:01:56 --> 03:02:00
a.m. uh but my girlfriend would go sleep
03:01:59 --> 03:02:02
midnight so we did a compromise like 2:
03:02:01 --> 03:02:07
a.m. you know MH so I wake up around 10
03:02:03 --> 03:02:09
11 then more like 10: um shower make
03:02:07 --> 03:02:11
coffee I make coffee like drip coffee
03:02:10 --> 03:02:15
like the V60 you know the filter and I
03:02:12 --> 03:02:17
boil water and I put the coffee in um
03:02:16 --> 03:02:19
and then chill a little with my
03:02:17 --> 03:02:21
girlfriend and then open laptop start
03:02:19 --> 03:02:23
coding check what's going on like bugs
03:02:21 --> 03:02:25
or whatever how long how long are you
03:02:24 --> 03:02:28
like how stretches of time are you able
03:02:26 --> 03:02:29
to just sit behind the computer coding
03:02:28 --> 03:02:30
so I used to need like really long
03:02:29 --> 03:02:32
stretches where I would do like all
03:02:31 --> 03:02:35
nighters and stuff to get shit done but
03:02:33 --> 03:02:37
I've gotten trained to like have more
03:02:35 --> 03:02:39
interruptions where I can like cuz you
03:02:37 --> 03:02:40
have to this life like there's a lot of
03:02:39 --> 03:02:43
distractions like like your girlfriend
03:02:41 --> 03:02:45
asked off people come over whatever yeah
03:02:44 --> 03:02:47
um so I'm very fast now I can lock in
03:02:46 --> 03:02:49
and lock out quite fast and I heard
03:02:48 --> 03:02:51
people developers or entrepreneurs with
03:02:49 --> 03:02:51
kids have the same thing like before
03:02:51 --> 03:02:54
they're like ah I cannot work but they
03:02:52 --> 03:02:55
get used to it and they get really
03:02:54 --> 03:02:57
productive in like short time because
03:02:56 --> 03:03:00
they only have like 20 minutes and then
03:02:58 --> 03:03:03
shit goes crazy again so another
03:03:01 --> 03:03:06
constraint right yeah it's funny so
03:03:03 --> 03:03:08
think that works for me um yeah and then
03:03:06 --> 03:03:11
you know cook food and stuff like have
03:03:08 --> 03:03:13
lunch steak and chicken and eat a bunch
03:03:11 --> 03:03:15
of times a day so you say coffee what
03:03:14 --> 03:03:18
are you doing yeah so a few hours later
03:03:15 --> 03:03:19
cook foods we get like locally soures
03:03:18 --> 03:03:23
like meat and stuff and vegetables and
03:03:20 --> 03:03:25
cook that uh and then second coffee and
03:03:23 --> 03:03:26
then coat some more maybe go outside for
03:03:25 --> 03:03:28
lunch like you can you can mix fun stuff
03:03:26 --> 03:03:29
you know how many hours are you say in a
03:03:28 --> 03:03:31
perfectly productive day are you doing
03:03:30 --> 03:03:33
programming like if you were like to
03:03:32 --> 03:03:35
kill it are you doing like all day
03:03:34 --> 03:03:37
basically you mean like the special days
03:03:36 --> 03:03:40
where like girlfriend leaves to like
03:03:38 --> 03:03:42
Paris or something and you're alone for
03:03:40 --> 03:03:43
a week at home which is amazing you can
03:03:42 --> 03:03:46
just coat it's like and you stay up all
03:03:44 --> 03:03:48
night and eat chocolate and yeah
03:03:46 --> 03:03:49
chocolate yeah you know okay okay let's
03:03:48 --> 03:03:53
remove girlfriend from picture social
03:03:50 --> 03:03:55
life from picture it's just you man that
03:03:53 --> 03:03:59
shit goes crazy like cuz when shit goes
03:03:56 --> 03:04:00
now she goes crazy okay okay so sh you
03:03:59 --> 03:04:02
let's let's rewind are you still waking
03:04:01 --> 03:04:05
up there's coffee there's no girlfriend
03:04:02 --> 03:04:09
to talk to there's now we wake
03:04:05 --> 03:04:13
up like 1: p.m. at 2
03:04:10 --> 03:04:14
p.m. cuz you went to bed at 6 a.m. yeah
03:04:13 --> 03:04:17
cuz I was coding I was finding some new
03:04:15 --> 03:04:19
AI shit and I was studying it and it was
03:04:18 --> 03:04:20
amazing and I cannot sleep because it's
03:04:19 --> 03:04:22
too important we need to stay awake we
03:04:21 --> 03:04:25
need to see all of this we need to make
03:04:22 --> 03:04:28
something now and but that's the times I
03:04:25 --> 03:04:31
do make like new stuff more so I think I
03:04:29 --> 03:04:32
have a friend he actually books a hotel
03:04:31 --> 03:04:34
for like a week to like leave his and he
03:04:32 --> 03:04:35
has a kid too and his girlfriend and his
03:04:34 --> 03:04:37
kid stay in the house and he goes to
03:04:36 --> 03:04:39
another hotel sounds a little suspicious
03:04:38 --> 03:04:42
right going to the hotel but all he does
03:04:39 --> 03:04:43
is like writing or coding he's a writer
03:04:42 --> 03:04:46
and he needs like this alone time this
03:04:44 --> 03:04:48
silence and I think for this Flow State
03:04:47 --> 03:04:51
it's true you know I'm better
03:04:48 --> 03:04:52
maintaining stuff um when there's a lot
03:04:51 --> 03:04:54
of disruptions than like creating new
03:04:52 --> 03:04:57
stuff I need this it's common it's flow
03:04:55 --> 03:05:01
it's this uninterrupted period of time
03:04:58 --> 03:05:03
um so yeah I wake up like 1 2 p.m. um
03:05:01 --> 03:05:06
you know still coffee shower we still
03:05:03 --> 03:05:08
shower you know uh and then this code
03:05:07 --> 03:05:11
like nonstop maybe my friend comes over
03:05:08 --> 03:05:12
uh comes over some distraction yeah he
03:05:11 --> 03:05:15
also Andre codes too so he comes over we
03:05:13 --> 03:05:16
code together we listen you know it
03:05:15 --> 03:05:18
starts going back to like the Bali days
03:05:17 --> 03:05:20
you know like yeah coor days like you're
03:05:19 --> 03:05:22
not really working with him but you're
03:05:20 --> 03:05:24
just both working because it's nice to
03:05:22 --> 03:05:25
have like the vibe where you both sit
03:05:25 --> 03:05:28
together on the couch and coding on
03:05:26 --> 03:05:30
something and you actually it's mostly
03:05:28 --> 03:05:31
silent or there music you know and
03:05:30 --> 03:05:33
sometimes you ask something and but
03:05:31 --> 03:05:35
generally like you're really locked in
03:05:33 --> 03:05:39
and what uh what music are you listening
03:05:36 --> 03:05:42
to I think like like um techno like
03:05:39 --> 03:05:43
YouTube techno um there's a there's a
03:05:42 --> 03:05:47
channel called h o r with a o Loud Like
03:05:44 --> 03:05:48
H O like double dot it's it's Berlin
03:05:48 --> 03:05:52
techno whatever it looks like it's they
03:05:49 --> 03:05:54
film it in like a toilet with like white
03:05:52 --> 03:05:56
tiles and stuff and very cool and they
03:05:54 --> 03:05:57
always have like very good like kind of
03:05:56 --> 03:05:59
industrial like indust so fast kind of
03:05:58 --> 03:06:01
aggressive you know
03:06:00 --> 03:06:04
like that's not distracting to your
03:06:02 --> 03:06:06
brain that's amazing like I think
03:06:04 --> 03:06:07
distracting man Jazz like I listen
03:06:07 --> 03:06:09
coffee Jazz with my girlfriend when I
03:06:08 --> 03:06:11
wake up and it's kind of like this piano
03:06:09 --> 03:06:13
starts getting annoying it's
03:06:12 --> 03:06:16
like it's too many tones it's like too
03:06:14 --> 03:06:17
many things going on this industrial
03:06:16 --> 03:06:19
techno is like you know this African
03:06:17 --> 03:06:22
like rain dances
03:06:19 --> 03:06:24
like it's this transcendental trans
03:06:23 --> 03:06:28
that's interesting cuz I I I actually
03:06:25 --> 03:06:33
mostly now listen to uh Brown noise
03:06:29 --> 03:06:33
noise yeah wow like pretty loud wow and
03:06:33 --> 03:06:36
one of the things you learn is your
03:06:34 --> 03:06:37
brain gets used to whatever so I'm sure
03:06:36 --> 03:06:40
to techno if I actually give it a real
03:06:38 --> 03:06:43
chance yeah my brain would get used to
03:06:40 --> 03:06:44
it but like with with noise what happens
03:06:43 --> 03:06:45
is something happens to your brain I
03:06:44 --> 03:06:47
think there's a science to it but I
03:06:45 --> 03:06:49
don't really care you just have to be a
03:06:47 --> 03:06:52
a scientist of one like study yourself
03:06:49 --> 03:06:54
your own brain for me it like it does
03:06:53 --> 03:06:56
something I discovered it right away
03:06:55 --> 03:06:59
when I tried it for the first
03:06:57 --> 03:07:01
time after about like a couple minutes
03:06:59 --> 03:07:04
your
03:07:01 --> 03:07:07
everything every distraction just like
03:07:05 --> 03:07:09
disappears and it goes
03:07:07 --> 03:07:12
like you can like
03:07:10 --> 03:07:16
hold focus on things like really well
03:07:13 --> 03:07:17
it's weird like you can like really
03:07:16 --> 03:07:19
focus on a thing it doesn't really
03:07:17 --> 03:07:20
matter what that is I think that's what
03:07:19 --> 03:07:23
people achieve with like meditation you
03:07:21 --> 03:07:25
can like like focus on your breath for
03:07:23 --> 03:07:28
example it's normal Brown It's not like
03:07:25 --> 03:07:30
binar no it's just normal
03:07:28 --> 03:07:34
Brown yeah white noise I think it's the
03:07:31 --> 03:07:35
same it's like pink Noise White Noise uh
03:07:34 --> 03:07:37
Brown noise I think is when it's like
03:07:36 --> 03:07:40
basier like yeah it's more diffused more
03:07:38 --> 03:07:42
dampened yeah dampened yeah I can see
03:07:40 --> 03:07:44
that no sharp yeah sharp brightness yeah
03:07:43 --> 03:07:47
bright yeah I can see that and you use a
03:07:44 --> 03:07:49
headphone right yeah headphones yeah
03:07:47 --> 03:07:51
actually like walk around in life often
03:07:50 --> 03:07:54
with brown noise dude that's like
03:07:51 --> 03:07:56
psychopath shit but it's cool you know
03:07:54 --> 03:07:59
yeah yeah yeah when I murder people it
03:07:57 --> 03:08:03
helps it it drowns out their screams
03:08:00 --> 03:08:05
Jesus Christ sorry I said too much no
03:08:03 --> 03:08:06
I'm going to try Brown noise with the
03:08:05 --> 03:08:09
murder or for the coding yeah for the
03:08:07 --> 03:08:10
coding yeah okay good uh try it try it
03:08:09 --> 03:08:12
but you have to like with everything
03:08:10 --> 03:08:16
else you give it a real chance yeah I
03:08:13 --> 03:08:19
find I also like I said do uh techno
03:08:17 --> 03:08:20
type stuff electronic music on top of
03:08:19 --> 03:08:24
the brown
03:08:21 --> 03:08:27
noise uh but then control the speed cuz
03:08:25 --> 03:08:29
the faster goes and more anxiety so if I
03:08:27 --> 03:08:31
really need to get shit done especially
03:08:29 --> 03:08:33
with programming I'll have a beat yeah
03:08:31 --> 03:08:34
and it's great it's cool I say it's cool
03:08:33 --> 03:08:36
to play those little tricks with your
03:08:34 --> 03:08:37
mind to study yourself yeah I usually
03:08:37 --> 03:08:41
don't like to have people around because
03:08:38 --> 03:08:42
when people even if they're working I
03:08:42 --> 03:08:45
don't know I like people too much
03:08:43 --> 03:08:46
they're like interesting no that's my
03:08:45 --> 03:08:48
yeah in coworkers space I would just
03:08:47 --> 03:08:51
start too much yeah yeah so there's a
03:08:49 --> 03:08:52
source of distraction yeah we would do
03:08:51 --> 03:08:55
in the cob space we would do like a a
03:08:53 --> 03:08:57
money like pot like a mug so if you
03:08:56 --> 03:08:59
would we would work for 45 minutes and
03:08:58 --> 03:09:02
then if you would say one like per word
03:09:00 --> 03:09:04
you would get a fine which is like $1 so
03:09:02 --> 03:09:08
you'd put $1 to say hey what's up so
03:09:04 --> 03:09:09
three $3 you put in the mug um and then
03:09:08 --> 03:09:11
10 15 minutes free time like we can like
03:09:10 --> 03:09:13
party whatever and then 45 minutes again
03:09:11 --> 03:09:15
I'm working and that worked but you need
03:09:14 --> 03:09:18
to shut people up where they you know I
03:09:16 --> 03:09:19
think there's um
03:09:18 --> 03:09:22
there's an
03:09:19 --> 03:09:26
intimacy in being silent together that I
03:09:23 --> 03:09:29
might maybe I'm uncomfortable with like
03:09:27 --> 03:09:31
but you if you need to make yourself
03:09:29 --> 03:09:32
vulnerable and actually do it like with
03:09:31 --> 03:09:34
with close friends to just sit there and
03:09:33 --> 03:09:36
silence for long periods of time and
03:09:35 --> 03:09:39
like doing a thing dude I watched this
03:09:37 --> 03:09:40
um this video of this podcast it was
03:09:39 --> 03:09:42
like this Buddhism podcast with people
03:09:41 --> 03:09:44
meditating and they were interviewing
03:09:42 --> 03:09:45
each other or whatever and like a
03:09:44 --> 03:09:49
podcast and suddenly after a question
03:09:46 --> 03:09:48
it's like yeah
03:09:49 --> 03:09:53
yeah and they were just silent for like
03:09:51 --> 03:09:55
three minutes and then they said that
03:09:54 --> 03:09:58
was amazing yeah that was amazing I was
03:09:56 --> 03:09:59
like Wow pretty cool you know elon's
03:09:58 --> 03:10:01
like
03:09:59 --> 03:10:03
that and I I really like that when
03:10:02 --> 03:10:06
you'll ask a
03:10:03 --> 03:10:07
question like uh I don't know what's a
03:10:06 --> 03:10:09
perfectly productive day for you like I
03:10:08 --> 03:10:14
I just asked and you just sit there for
03:10:10 --> 03:10:14
like 30 seconds thinking yeah he
03:10:14 --> 03:10:17
thinks yeah I don't know that's so cool
03:10:16 --> 03:10:20
I wish I was
03:10:18 --> 03:10:23
was I wish I could think more about but
03:10:21 --> 03:10:24
I want to like I want to show you my
03:10:23 --> 03:10:26
heart you know I want to show you go
03:10:24 --> 03:10:27
straight from my heart to my mouth to
03:10:26 --> 03:10:30
like saying the real thing and the more
03:10:28 --> 03:10:32
I think the more I start like filtering
03:10:30 --> 03:10:34
myself right and I want to just throw it
03:10:32 --> 03:10:35
out there immediately I I do that more
03:10:34 --> 03:10:37
with Team I think he has a lot of
03:10:36 --> 03:10:39
practice in that I I do that as well in
03:10:38 --> 03:10:41
the team setting when you're thinking
03:10:39 --> 03:10:43
brainstorming and you allow yourself to
03:10:41 --> 03:10:45
just like think in silence yeah just
03:10:44 --> 03:10:47
like because even in meetings people
03:10:46 --> 03:10:50
want to talk
03:10:47 --> 03:10:51
yeah it's like no you think before you
03:10:50 --> 03:10:53
speak and just like it's okay to be
03:10:52 --> 03:10:55
silent together yeah and if you allow
03:10:54 --> 03:10:57
yourself the room to do that you can
03:10:55 --> 03:10:59
actually come up with really good ideas
03:10:57 --> 03:11:01
yeah so okay this perfect
03:11:00 --> 03:11:04
day how much caffeine are you consuming
03:11:02 --> 03:11:07
in this day man too much right cuz uh
03:11:04 --> 03:11:08
normally like two two cups of coffee but
03:11:07 --> 03:11:10
on this perfect day like we go to like
03:11:09 --> 03:11:14
four maybe so we're starting to hit like
03:11:10 --> 03:11:14
the anxiety levels so four cups is a lot
03:11:14 --> 03:11:17
for you well I think my coffees are
03:11:15 --> 03:11:20
quite strong when I make them it's like
03:11:17 --> 03:11:23
20 gram of uh coffee powder in the V60
03:11:21 --> 03:11:25
so like my friends call him like nuclear
03:11:23 --> 03:11:27
coffee cuz it's quite heavy it's quite
03:11:25 --> 03:11:29
strong um but it's nice to hit that
03:11:28 --> 03:11:33
anxiety level where you're like almost
03:11:30 --> 03:11:35
panic attack but you're not there yet so
03:11:33 --> 03:11:37
but that's like man it's like super
03:11:36 --> 03:11:41
locked in just
03:11:38 --> 03:11:42
like it's amazing but I mean that's
03:11:41 --> 03:11:45
there's a space for that you know in my
03:11:42 --> 03:11:46
life but uh it's uh I think it's great
03:11:45 --> 03:11:48
for making new stuff it's amazing start
03:11:47 --> 03:11:50
starting from scratch creating a new
03:11:48 --> 03:11:52
thing yes I think girlfriends should let
03:11:50 --> 03:11:55
their guys go away for like two weeks
03:11:53 --> 03:11:58
mhm every few no every year at least you
03:11:56 --> 03:12:01
know maybe every quarter I don't know
03:11:58 --> 03:12:03
and just sit and make some shit without
03:12:02 --> 03:12:06
you know they're amazing but like no
03:12:03 --> 03:12:08
disturbances just be alone and then you
03:12:06 --> 03:12:10
know people can make something very very
03:12:09 --> 03:12:12
amazing just wearing cowboy hats in the
03:12:10 --> 03:12:12
mountains like we showed exactly we can
03:12:12 --> 03:12:14
do that there's a movie about that with
03:12:13 --> 03:12:15
the laptops they didn't do much
03:12:15 --> 03:12:18
programming though yeah you can do a
03:12:16 --> 03:12:20
little bit of that okay and then a
03:12:18 --> 03:12:22
little bit of shipping you know do
03:12:20 --> 03:12:23
both it's a different broke they need to
03:12:23 --> 03:12:27
allow us to go you know you need like a
03:12:24 --> 03:12:29
man cave right yeah to ship yeah to ship
03:12:27 --> 03:12:32
get shit done yeah it's a balance okay
03:12:30 --> 03:12:35
cool what about sleep naps and all that
03:12:33 --> 03:12:36
you're not sleeping much I don't do naps
03:12:35 --> 03:12:37
in a day I think it's power naps are
03:12:36 --> 03:12:40
good but I don't really I'm never tired
03:12:37 --> 03:12:42
anymore in the day uh man also because
03:12:41 --> 03:12:44
of gym I'm not tired I I'm tired when I
03:12:43 --> 03:12:47
want to when you know when it's night I
03:12:44 --> 03:12:49
need to sleep me I love apps I don't
03:12:48 --> 03:12:52
care I don't know I don't know why brain
03:12:50 --> 03:12:54
shuts off turns on I don't know if it's
03:12:52 --> 03:12:56
healthy or not it just works yeah I
03:12:55 --> 03:12:58
think with anything mental physical you
03:12:56 --> 03:12:59
have to be a student of your own body
03:12:58 --> 03:13:01
and like know know what the limits are
03:13:00 --> 03:13:03
like that you have to be skeptical
03:13:01 --> 03:13:05
taking advice from the internet in
03:13:04 --> 03:13:09
general cuz a lot of advice is just like
03:13:06 --> 03:13:10
a good Baseline for the general
03:13:09 --> 03:13:12
population but personalized yeah you
03:13:11 --> 03:13:15
have to become a student of your own
03:13:13 --> 03:13:18
like of your own body of your own self
03:13:15 --> 03:13:20
of how you work yeah that's I've I've
03:13:18 --> 03:13:22
done a lot of like for me fasting was an
03:13:20 --> 03:13:23
interesting one because I used to you
03:13:22 --> 03:13:24
know eat a bunch of meals a day
03:13:24 --> 03:13:28
especially when I was lifting heavy like
03:13:25 --> 03:13:30
as everybody says to you have to eat uh
03:13:28 --> 03:13:33
kind of a lot you know multiple meals a
03:13:31 --> 03:13:37
day but I realize I can get much
03:13:34 --> 03:13:38
stronger feel much better if I eat once
03:13:37 --> 03:13:40
or twice a day man me too yeah it's
03:13:39 --> 03:13:42
crazy I never underst do this small meal
03:13:40 --> 03:13:43
thing yeah didn't work for me let me
03:13:42 --> 03:13:45
just ask you it'd be interesting if you
03:13:44 --> 03:13:46
can comment on some of the other
03:13:46 --> 03:13:49
products you've created
03:13:47 --> 03:13:51
we talked about Nomad list interior AI
03:13:49 --> 03:13:55
photo AI therapist AI what's remote okay
03:13:52 --> 03:13:56
it's a job board for remote jobs um
03:13:55 --> 03:13:58
because back then like 10 years ago
03:13:57 --> 03:14:01
there was uh job boards but there was
03:13:59 --> 03:14:03
not really specifically promote job job
03:14:01 --> 03:14:04
boards so I made one B I made like first
03:14:03 --> 03:14:06
on Nomad Le I made like Nomad jobs like
03:14:05 --> 03:14:08
a page and a lot of companies started
03:14:06 --> 03:14:10
hiring and they pay for job post so I
03:14:08 --> 03:14:12
spin it off to remote and now it's like
03:14:11 --> 03:14:16
the number one or number two biggest
03:14:13 --> 03:14:17
remote job boards and uh and it's also
03:14:16 --> 03:14:19
fully automated it and people just post
03:14:18 --> 03:14:21
a job and people apply it has like
03:14:19 --> 03:14:23
profiles as well like it's kind of like
03:14:21 --> 03:14:26
LinkedIn for remotes work just focus on
03:14:24 --> 03:14:28
remote only yeah it's this it's
03:14:26 --> 03:14:28
essentially like a simple job board I
03:14:28 --> 03:14:32
discovered job boards are way more
03:14:29 --> 03:14:34
complicated than you think but um yeah
03:14:32 --> 03:14:36
it's a jobboard for remote
03:14:35 --> 03:14:38
jobs but the nice thing is you can
03:14:37 --> 03:14:40
charge a lot of money for job posst it's
03:14:38 --> 03:14:43
man it's good money B2B you can charge
03:14:40 --> 03:14:44
like you start of$ 299 but at the peak
03:14:44 --> 03:14:48
during when the FED started printing
03:14:45 --> 03:14:50
money like 2021 I was making like 140k a
03:14:48 --> 03:14:52
month with remot k with just jaob posts
03:14:51 --> 03:14:55
and I started like adding crazy upsells
03:14:53 --> 03:14:56
like rainbow colored uh jaw post you can
03:14:55 --> 03:14:58
add your background name it's just
03:14:57 --> 03:15:02
upsells man and you charge $5 for an
03:14:59 --> 03:15:03
upsell it was crazy and uh all these
03:15:02 --> 03:15:06
companies just UPS so up so yeah we want
03:15:04 --> 03:15:07
everything jobst would cost
03:15:06 --> 03:15:10
$3,400
03:15:08 --> 03:15:12
$4,000 and I was like this is good good
03:15:10 --> 03:15:14
business and then the fat stopped
03:15:12 --> 03:15:16
printing money and it all went down and
03:15:15 --> 03:15:19
it went down to like 10K a month from
03:15:17 --> 03:15:22
140 yeah now it's back it's I think it's
03:15:19 --> 03:15:23
like 40 was good times you know uh I got
03:15:22 --> 03:15:26
to ask you about back to the digital
03:15:24 --> 03:15:30
Nomad life yeah you uh you wrote a blog
03:15:27 --> 03:15:31
post on the reset and in general like
03:15:30 --> 03:15:34
just giving away everything living a
03:15:32 --> 03:15:37
minimalist life yeah what did it take to
03:15:34 --> 03:15:38
do that like to get rid of everything 10
03:15:37 --> 03:15:40
years ago was like this trend in the
03:15:39 --> 03:15:42
blog back then blogs were so popular was
03:15:41 --> 03:15:44
like a blogosphere and it was like the
03:15:42 --> 03:15:45
100 things challenge what is that the
03:15:44 --> 03:15:47
100 things I mean it's ridiculous but
03:15:45 --> 03:15:48
like you you write down every object you
03:15:47 --> 03:15:50
have in your house and you count it you
03:15:49 --> 03:15:52
make like a spreadsheet and you're like
03:15:50 --> 03:15:54
okay I have 500 things you need to get
03:15:52 --> 03:15:56
it down to 100 why you know this was
03:15:55 --> 03:15:58
just a trend so I did it I started like
03:15:57 --> 03:16:02
selling stuff started throwing away
03:15:58 --> 03:16:06
stuff and I did like MDMA and easy like
03:16:02 --> 03:16:08
2012 kind of and uh after that trip I
03:16:06 --> 03:16:10
felt so different and I felt like I had
03:16:09 --> 03:16:13
to started throwing shit away like I
03:16:11 --> 03:16:15
swear yeah and I started throwing shit
03:16:13 --> 03:16:17
away and I felt that was like it was
03:16:15 --> 03:16:18
almost like the drug sending me to a
03:16:17 --> 03:16:19
path of like you need to throw your shit
03:16:18 --> 03:16:23
away you need to start you know go on a
03:16:20 --> 03:16:25
journey you need to get out of here and
03:16:24 --> 03:16:28
um and that's what the MDMA did I think
03:16:26 --> 03:16:30
yeah how hard is it to get down to 100
03:16:28 --> 03:16:31
items well you need to like sell your PC
03:16:30 --> 03:16:33
and stuff you need s you need to go on
03:16:32 --> 03:16:35
eBay and then man going eBay selling or
03:16:34 --> 03:16:37
your stuff is verying because you
03:16:35 --> 03:16:39
discover Society you mat you meet the
03:16:37 --> 03:16:41
craziest people you meet every range
03:16:40 --> 03:16:44
from Rich the poor everybody comes to
03:16:42 --> 03:16:45
your house to buy stuff it's so funny so
03:16:44 --> 03:16:46
interesting I recommend everybody do
03:16:45 --> 03:16:48
this just to meet people people that
03:16:47 --> 03:16:51
want your shit yeah it was so like I I
03:16:49 --> 03:16:52
didn't know was I was living in
03:16:51 --> 03:16:54
Amsterdam and I didn't know I have my
03:16:53 --> 03:16:56
own you know subculture whatever and I
03:16:55 --> 03:16:58
discovered the Dutch people like as they
03:16:56 --> 03:16:59
are from eBay you know so I sold
03:16:58 --> 03:17:01
everything what's what's like the
03:16:59 --> 03:17:03
weirdest thing you had to sell and you
03:17:02 --> 03:17:06
had to find a buyer for not the weirds
03:17:03 --> 03:17:07
but like what what's memorable so back
03:17:06 --> 03:17:09
then I was I was making music and I we
03:17:07 --> 03:17:10
would make music videos with like a
03:17:09 --> 03:17:14
Canon 5D camera back then everybody's
03:17:11 --> 03:17:16
making films and music that and uh and
03:17:14 --> 03:17:18
we bought it with my friends and stuff
03:17:16 --> 03:17:19
and
03:17:18 --> 03:17:20
it was kind of like I had to sell this
03:17:19 --> 03:17:22
thing too because it was like it was
03:17:21 --> 03:17:25
very expensive like 6K or something yeah
03:17:23 --> 03:17:26
and but it meant that selling this meant
03:17:25 --> 03:17:27
that we wouldn't make music videos
03:17:27 --> 03:17:30
together anymore I would leave Holland
03:17:28 --> 03:17:31
this kind of like stuff we were working
03:17:30 --> 03:17:33
on would end and I was kind of saying
03:17:32 --> 03:17:34
this music video stuff we're not getting
03:17:33 --> 03:17:35
big we're not getting famous in this or
03:17:35 --> 03:17:38
successful we need to stop doing this
03:17:36 --> 03:17:39
this music production also it's not
03:17:38 --> 03:17:42
really working and it was kind of like
03:17:40 --> 03:17:44
felt very bad you know for my friends
03:17:42 --> 03:17:47
cuz we would work together on this and
03:17:44 --> 03:17:49
um to sell this like camera that we make
03:17:47 --> 03:17:51
stuff with and it was a hard goodbye was
03:17:50 --> 03:17:54
just a camera but it was like it felt
03:17:52 --> 03:17:56
like uh sorry guys it doesn't work and I
03:17:54 --> 03:17:58
need to go you know who uh who bought it
03:17:57 --> 03:18:01
do you remember was some guy who
03:17:59 --> 03:18:04
couldn't possibly
03:18:01 --> 03:18:05
understand the journey motion of it yeah
03:18:04 --> 03:18:07
yeah he just showed up here here's the
03:18:06 --> 03:18:09
money thanks yeah but it was like a it
03:18:08 --> 03:18:11
was like cutting your life like this
03:18:09 --> 03:18:13
shit ends now now we GNA do new stuff
03:18:12 --> 03:18:15
and I think it's beautiful I did that
03:18:14 --> 03:18:17
twice in my life give away everything
03:18:15 --> 03:18:20
everything everything like down to just
03:18:18 --> 03:18:23
pants underwear
03:18:21 --> 03:18:25
backpack I think uh I think it's
03:18:23 --> 03:18:27
important to do it shows you what's
03:18:25 --> 03:18:28
important yeah I think that's what I
03:18:27 --> 03:18:30
learned from it like you you learn that
03:18:29 --> 03:18:34
you can live with very little objects
03:18:31 --> 03:18:35
very little stuff and um but there's a
03:18:34 --> 03:18:36
there's a counter to it like you you
03:18:35 --> 03:18:38
lean more on this on the stuff on the
03:18:37 --> 03:18:40
services right like for example you
03:18:38 --> 03:18:42
don't need a car you use Uber right or
03:18:40 --> 03:18:43
you don't need kitchen stuff because you
03:18:42 --> 03:18:45
go to restaurants you know when you're
03:18:43 --> 03:18:46
traveling so you lean more on other
03:18:46 --> 03:18:49
people's services but you spend money on
03:18:47 --> 03:18:50
that as well so that's good yeah but
03:18:49 --> 03:18:53
just letting go of material possessions
03:18:51 --> 03:18:55
which it gives a kind of freedom to how
03:18:53 --> 03:18:56
you move about the world yeah it gives
03:18:55 --> 03:18:58
you complete freedom to go into another
03:18:56 --> 03:19:00
city to yeah with your backpack with a
03:18:59 --> 03:19:02
backpack there's a kind of freedom to it
03:19:01 --> 03:19:04
there's something about material
03:19:02 --> 03:19:05
possessions and having a place and all
03:19:04 --> 03:19:08
that that ties you down a little bit
03:19:06 --> 03:19:10
Yeah like spiritually it's good to take
03:19:09 --> 03:19:12
a leap out into the world especially
03:19:10 --> 03:19:12
when you're younger to like man I
03:19:12 --> 03:19:17
recommend if you're 18 you get out of
03:19:13 --> 03:19:17
high school do this go travel and uh uh
03:19:17 --> 03:19:20
you know build some internet stuff
03:19:18 --> 03:19:22
whatever if your bring your laptop and
03:19:20 --> 03:19:24
uh it's it's amazing experience I five
03:19:23 --> 03:19:25
years ago it's still going to University
03:19:24 --> 03:19:27
but now I'm thinking like no maybe don't
03:19:25 --> 03:19:28
maybe skip University just go first like
03:19:27 --> 03:19:30
travel around a little bit figure some
03:19:29 --> 03:19:33
stuff out you can go back to University
03:19:31 --> 03:19:35
when you're 25 you can like okay now I
03:19:33 --> 03:19:36
learned I being successful in business
03:19:36 --> 03:19:38
you have money at least now you can
03:19:37 --> 03:19:40
choose what you really want to study you
03:19:38 --> 03:19:42
know because people at 18 they go study
03:19:41 --> 03:19:44
what is probably good for the job market
03:19:42 --> 03:19:46
right so it probably makes more sense
03:19:45 --> 03:19:48
like if you want that go travel build
03:19:46 --> 03:19:49
some businesses and go back to
03:19:48 --> 03:19:51
University if you want so one of the
03:19:50 --> 03:19:54
biggest uses of a university is the
03:19:52 --> 03:19:56
networking you you uh you gain friends
03:19:54 --> 03:19:57
you gain like you meet people it's a
03:19:56 --> 03:19:59
forcing function to meet people but if
03:19:58 --> 03:20:01
you can meet people out into the World
03:20:00 --> 03:20:03
by traveling man and you meet so many
03:20:01 --> 03:20:05
different cultures I mean the problem
03:20:03 --> 03:20:07
for me is like if I traveled at that
03:20:06 --> 03:20:10
young age I'm attracted to people at the
03:20:08 --> 03:20:12
outskirts of the world like for me like
03:20:10 --> 03:20:14
where no mean not geographically oh like
03:20:13 --> 03:20:19
the the subcultures the sub yeah like
03:20:15 --> 03:20:19
the weirdos the darkness yeah me too but
03:20:19 --> 03:20:21
but that might not be the best
03:20:20 --> 03:20:24
networking at 18 years
03:20:21 --> 03:20:26
old no but it man if you if you're smart
03:20:24 --> 03:20:28
about it you can stay safe and I met so
03:20:27 --> 03:20:30
many weirdos from traveling you meet
03:20:28 --> 03:20:31
that's how travel works if you really
03:20:30 --> 03:20:33
let lose you meet the craziest people
03:20:32 --> 03:20:35
yeah and it's the most interesting
03:20:33 --> 03:20:38
people
03:20:35 --> 03:20:40
and it's just I cannot recommend it
03:20:38 --> 03:20:43
enough well see the thing is when you're
03:20:40 --> 03:20:45
18 I feel like depending on your
03:20:43 --> 03:20:49
personality you have to learn both how
03:20:46 --> 03:20:51
to be a weirdo and how to be a normie
03:20:49 --> 03:20:53
like you still have to learn how to fit
03:20:51 --> 03:20:55
into society like for a person like me
03:20:54 --> 03:20:58
for example who's always an outcast like
03:20:55 --> 03:21:00
there's always a danger for going full
03:20:58 --> 03:21:03
Outcast yeah and that's a harder life if
03:21:01 --> 03:21:06
you like if you go to like go full
03:21:04 --> 03:21:07
artist and full like Darkness it's just
03:21:06 --> 03:21:09
a heart of life you can come back you
03:21:08 --> 03:21:11
can come back to normally that's a skill
03:21:10 --> 03:21:13
that's like I think you have to learn
03:21:11 --> 03:21:16
how to how to fit
03:21:13 --> 03:21:18
into uh like polite Society but I was
03:21:17 --> 03:21:21
very strange Outcast as well and I'm I'm
03:21:19 --> 03:21:23
more adaptable to normally now you know
03:21:21 --> 03:21:25
learned it after 30s you know you're
03:21:24 --> 03:21:28
like yeah but you mean it's a skill you
03:21:26 --> 03:21:31
have to learn yeah I feel man I feel
03:21:28 --> 03:21:33
also the you start as Outcast but the
03:21:31 --> 03:21:35
more you work on yourself the less like
03:21:34 --> 03:21:37
shit you have you kind of start becoming
03:21:36 --> 03:21:40
more normally because you become more
03:21:38 --> 03:21:42
chill with yourself and more happy and
03:21:40 --> 03:21:44
it kind of makes you uninteresting right
03:21:42 --> 03:21:46
a little bit yes yes like the most the
03:21:45 --> 03:21:47
crazy people are always the most
03:21:46 --> 03:21:49
interesting if you've solved your
03:21:48 --> 03:21:52
internal struggles and your your therapy
03:21:50 --> 03:21:55
and stuff and you kind of become kind of
03:21:53 --> 03:21:57
you know it's not so interesting anymore
03:21:55 --> 03:21:58
maybe you don't have to be broken to be
03:21:57 --> 03:22:01
interesting I guess is what I'm saying
03:21:59 --> 03:22:05
yeah what kind of things were left when
03:22:02 --> 03:22:08
you minimalized so the backpack yeah uh
03:22:05 --> 03:22:11
MacBook uh toothbrush uh some clothes
03:22:08 --> 03:22:12
underwear socks um you don't need a lot
03:22:11 --> 03:22:15
of clothes in Asia cuz it's hot so you
03:22:13 --> 03:22:18
just wear swimpants swim shorts he w
03:22:16 --> 03:22:22
walk around flipflops uh so very basic
03:22:19 --> 03:22:24
t-shirt and uh I would go to the lroom
03:22:22 --> 03:22:27
mat and wash my stuff and I think it was
03:22:25 --> 03:22:29
like 50 F or something yeah yeah it's
03:22:28 --> 03:22:32
nice there's uh as I mentioned to you
03:22:29 --> 03:22:34
there's the the show alone yeah they
03:22:32 --> 03:22:35
really test you cuz they you only get 10
03:22:35 --> 03:22:39
items and you have to survive out in the
03:22:36 --> 03:22:39
wilderness and an axe like everybody
03:22:39 --> 03:22:42
brings an
03:22:40 --> 03:22:44
axe some
03:22:42 --> 03:22:47
people uh also have a
03:22:44 --> 03:22:48
saw wow but usually a does the job you
03:22:48 --> 03:22:50
basically have to in order to build a
03:22:49 --> 03:22:53
shelter you have to cut down cut the
03:22:51 --> 03:22:56
trees and make and like learning
03:22:53 --> 03:22:57
Minecraft you know everything I learn
03:22:56 --> 03:23:01
about life I learn Minecraft
03:22:58 --> 03:23:03
bro yeah yeah you can it's a it's it's
03:23:01 --> 03:23:04
nice to create those constraints for
03:23:03 --> 03:23:07
yourself to understand what matters to
03:23:05 --> 03:23:10
you and also how to be in this world and
03:23:08 --> 03:23:12
one one of the ways to do that just to
03:23:10 --> 03:23:14
live a minimalist life but like some
03:23:13 --> 03:23:16
people like I've met people that really
03:23:14 --> 03:23:17
enjoy material possessions and it brings
03:23:16 --> 03:23:19
him happiness and that's that's a
03:23:18 --> 03:23:23
beautiful thing yeah like for me it
03:23:20 --> 03:23:24
doesn't but people are different it
03:23:23 --> 03:23:27
gives me happiness for like two weeks
03:23:25 --> 03:23:30
yeah I'm very quickly adapting to like a
03:23:27 --> 03:23:32
baseline hedonist hedonistic adaptation
03:23:30 --> 03:23:35
very fast yeah but man if you look at
03:23:32 --> 03:23:36
the studies most people like like
03:23:35 --> 03:23:37
getting a new car six months you know
03:23:37 --> 03:23:40
getting a new house six months you just
03:23:38 --> 03:23:42
feel the same you're like wow should I
03:23:40 --> 03:23:44
buy all the stuff that studying
03:23:43 --> 03:23:46
hedonistic adaptation made me think a
03:23:44 --> 03:23:47
lot about minimalism like and so you
03:23:46 --> 03:23:50
don't even need to go through the whole
03:23:47 --> 03:23:53
journey of getting it just just focus on
03:23:51 --> 03:23:56
the the thing that's more permanent yeah
03:23:54 --> 03:23:57
like building shit yeah like people
03:23:56 --> 03:24:00
around you like people you love nice
03:23:58 --> 03:24:03
food nice experiences meaningful work
03:24:01 --> 03:24:05
those things exercise you know those
03:24:04 --> 03:24:08
things make you happy I think make me
03:24:05 --> 03:24:10
happy for sure you wrote a blog post why
03:24:09 --> 03:24:12
I'm unreachable and maybe you should be
03:24:10 --> 03:24:14
too what's your strategy in
03:24:12 --> 03:24:16
communicating with people yeah so when I
03:24:15 --> 03:24:19
wrote that I was getting so many M as
03:24:17 --> 03:24:20
you probably have you have a million
03:24:19 --> 03:24:22
times more but um and people were
03:24:21 --> 03:24:24
getting angry that I wasn't responding
03:24:23 --> 03:24:26
and I was like okay I'll just close down
03:24:24 --> 03:24:27
these DMS completely M then people got
03:24:26 --> 03:24:29
angry that I Clos my DMs down that I'm
03:24:28 --> 03:24:32
not like man of the people you know it's
03:24:30 --> 03:24:34
like you changed man yeah you Chang you
03:24:32 --> 03:24:36
guys you know like this and I'm like
03:24:35 --> 03:24:40
I'll explain why I just don't have the
03:24:37 --> 03:24:43
time in a day to you know answer every
03:24:41 --> 03:24:45
question and also people send you like
03:24:43 --> 03:24:47
crazy shit man like stalkers and like
03:24:45 --> 03:24:48
people write like their whole life story
03:24:47 --> 03:24:50
for you and then ask you advice like man
03:24:49 --> 03:24:52
I have no idea I'm not a therapist I
03:24:50 --> 03:24:54
don't know I don't know this stuff but
03:24:52 --> 03:24:57
also beautiful stuff no absolutely sure
03:24:55 --> 03:24:59
like life story I've posted a coffee
03:24:57 --> 03:25:01
form like if you wanted to have a coffee
03:24:59 --> 03:25:03
with me and I've gotten an extremely
03:25:02 --> 03:25:06
large number of submissions and when I
03:25:04 --> 03:25:07
look at them there's just like beautiful
03:25:06 --> 03:25:10
people in there like beautiful human
03:25:08 --> 03:25:12
beings really powerful stories and like
03:25:10 --> 03:25:14
breaks my heart that I won't get to meet
03:25:12 --> 03:25:16
those people you know like and so this
03:25:15 --> 03:25:19
part of it is just like there's only so
03:25:17 --> 03:25:22
much bandwidth to truly see other humans
03:25:20 --> 03:25:25
and help them or like understand them or
03:25:22 --> 03:25:27
hear them or yeah see them yeah I have
03:25:25 --> 03:25:28
this problem that I try I want to try
03:25:27 --> 03:25:32
help people and like also like oh let's
03:25:29 --> 03:25:34
make startups and whatever and it's I've
03:25:32 --> 03:25:36
learned over the years that generally
03:25:35 --> 03:25:39
for me and it sounds maybe bad right but
03:25:37 --> 03:25:39
like I help my friend Andre for example
03:25:39 --> 03:25:41
he was he he came up to me in a cing
03:25:40 --> 03:25:41
space that's how I met him and he said I
03:25:41 --> 03:25:43
want to learn a code I want to do
03:25:42 --> 03:25:46
startups how do I do it I said okay
03:25:44 --> 03:25:50
let's go uh install engine X let start
03:25:46 --> 03:25:53
coding and he has this self energy that
03:25:50 --> 03:25:55
he actually um he he doesn't need to be
03:25:54 --> 03:25:56
pushed he just goes and he just goes and
03:25:55 --> 03:25:58
he asks questions and he he doesn't ask
03:25:57 --> 03:25:59
too many questions he just goes goes and
03:25:58 --> 03:26:01
learns it and now he has a company and
03:26:00 --> 03:26:04
makes a lot of money has his own
03:26:01 --> 03:26:05
startups so and the people that that I
03:26:04 --> 03:26:07
had to kind of like that asked me for
03:26:06 --> 03:26:09
help but then I I gave help and then
03:26:08 --> 03:26:11
they started they started debating it
03:26:10 --> 03:26:13
you know do you have that like people
03:26:11 --> 03:26:14
ask you advice and they go against you
03:26:13 --> 03:26:16
say no you're wrong because I'm like
03:26:15 --> 03:26:18
okay bro I don't want debate you ask me
03:26:17 --> 03:26:22
for advice right and the people who need
03:26:19 --> 03:26:24
this push generally it doesn't happen
03:26:23 --> 03:26:26
you need to have this energy for
03:26:24 --> 03:26:27
yourself well they're searching they're
03:26:26 --> 03:26:29
searching they're trying to figure it
03:26:27 --> 03:26:32
out but often times their
03:26:29 --> 03:26:33
search if they successfully find what
03:26:32 --> 03:26:35
they're looking for it'll be within
03:26:34 --> 03:26:37
sounds very like spiritual Sonny but
03:26:36 --> 03:26:39
it's it's really like figuring that shit
03:26:37 --> 03:26:41
out on your own but they're reaching
03:26:39 --> 03:26:44
they're trying to ask the world around
03:26:42 --> 03:26:46
them like how do I live this life how do
03:26:45 --> 03:26:48
I figure this out but ultimately the
03:26:46 --> 03:26:50
answer is going to be from them working
03:26:48 --> 03:26:52
on themselves and like literally it's
03:26:51 --> 03:26:54
the stupid thing but like Googling and
03:26:53 --> 03:26:56
doing like yeah I think it's
03:26:55 --> 03:26:58
procrastination I think sending messages
03:26:56 --> 03:26:59
to people is a lot of procrastination
03:26:58 --> 03:27:03
like Lex how do you become successful
03:27:00 --> 03:27:07
podcaster bro just you know start like
03:27:03 --> 03:27:08
just go yeah and uh just go I would
03:27:07 --> 03:27:10
never ask you how to be a successful
03:27:09 --> 03:27:12
podcaster like I would just start it and
03:27:11 --> 03:27:13
then I would copy your methods you know
03:27:13 --> 03:27:15
I would say ah this guy's a black
03:27:14 --> 03:27:18
background we probably need this as well
03:27:16 --> 03:27:19
yeah try it yeah try it and then you
03:27:18 --> 03:27:20
realize it's not about the black
03:27:19 --> 03:27:22
background it's about something else so
03:27:20 --> 03:27:23
you find your own voice like keep trying
03:27:22 --> 03:27:26
stuffa imitation is a difficult thing
03:27:24 --> 03:27:28
like a lot of people copy and they don't
03:27:26 --> 03:27:30
move past it yeah you should understand
03:27:29 --> 03:27:32
their methods and then move past it like
03:27:31 --> 03:27:34
find yourself find your own voice you
03:27:32 --> 03:27:35
imitate and then you put your own spin
03:27:34 --> 03:27:37
to it you know and that's like creative
03:27:36 --> 03:27:38
process that's like literally the whole
03:27:37 --> 03:27:40
cre everybody always Builds on the
03:27:38 --> 03:27:42
previous work yeah uh you shouldn't get
03:27:40 --> 03:27:44
stuck 24 hours in a day eight hours of
03:27:43 --> 03:27:47
sleep you like break it down into a math
03:27:45 --> 03:27:48
equation uh 90 minutes of showering
03:27:47 --> 03:27:50
clean up
03:27:49 --> 03:27:53
coffee it just keeps whittling down to
03:27:51 --> 03:27:54
zero man it's not this specific but I
03:27:53 --> 03:27:57
had to make like a you know an average
03:27:55 --> 03:28:00
or something firefighting I don't like
03:27:57 --> 03:28:01
that one hours of groceries and errands
03:28:00 --> 03:28:03
I've tried breaking down minute by
03:28:02 --> 03:28:06
minute what I do in a day yeah
03:28:04 --> 03:28:07
especially when my life was simpler it's
03:28:06 --> 03:28:11
really refreshing to understand where
03:28:07 --> 03:28:13
you waste a lot of time yeah and uh what
03:28:11 --> 03:28:16
you enjoy doing like how many minutes it
03:28:14 --> 03:28:18
takes to be happy doing the thing that
03:28:17 --> 03:28:20
makes you happy and how many minutes it
03:28:18 --> 03:28:21
takes to be productive and you realize
03:28:20 --> 03:28:24
there's a lot of hours in the day if you
03:28:21 --> 03:28:25
spend it right yeah a lot of is wasted
03:28:24 --> 03:28:28
yeah for me has been the the the biggest
03:28:26 --> 03:28:30
battle for uh for the longest time is
03:28:29 --> 03:28:32
finding stretches a time where I can
03:28:30 --> 03:28:35
deeply focus into really really deep
03:28:32 --> 03:28:37
work just like zoom in and completely
03:28:36 --> 03:28:39
focused cutting away all the
03:28:38 --> 03:28:42
distractions yeah me too that's the
03:28:40 --> 03:28:44
battle Yeah it's unpleasant it's
03:28:42 --> 03:28:46
extremely unpleasant we need to fly to
03:28:44 --> 03:28:47
an island you know make a a man cave
03:28:46 --> 03:28:49
Island where we can just everybody can
03:28:48 --> 03:28:52
just goat and for a week you know just
03:28:50 --> 03:28:54
get shit done make new
03:28:52 --> 03:28:55
projects yeah yeah but man they called
03:28:55 --> 03:28:58
me psychopath for this because it says
03:28:56 --> 03:29:00
like one hours of sex hugs love you know
03:28:59 --> 03:29:02
man I had to write something you know
03:29:00 --> 03:29:03
and they were like ah this guy
03:29:02 --> 03:29:06
psychopath he plans his sex know in
03:29:04 --> 03:29:09
specific hour like bro I don't but have
03:29:06 --> 03:29:11
a counter for hugs yeah exactly like
03:29:09 --> 03:29:13
yeah like click click click H it's it's
03:29:12 --> 03:29:15
just a numerical representation of what
03:29:14 --> 03:29:18
life is yeah
03:29:16 --> 03:29:20
it's like one of those like when you
03:29:18 --> 03:29:22
draw out how many weeks you have in a
03:29:20 --> 03:29:24
life oh dude this is like dark yeah man
03:29:23 --> 03:29:26
don't want to look that too much yeah
03:29:25 --> 03:29:29
man how many times you see your parents
03:29:27 --> 03:29:31
Jesus like man yeah it's scary man
03:29:29 --> 03:29:32
that's right it might be only you know a
03:29:31 --> 03:29:34
handful more times yeah man you just
03:29:33 --> 03:29:35
look at the math of it if you see him
03:29:35 --> 03:29:39
once a year or twice a year yeah
03:29:36 --> 03:29:42
FaceTime today yeah
03:29:39 --> 03:29:43
yeah I mean it that that's like dark
03:29:42 --> 03:29:46
when
03:29:43 --> 03:29:48
you see somebody you like like seeing
03:29:47 --> 03:29:51
like a friend that's on the outskirts of
03:29:49 --> 03:29:54
your friend group and you realize like
03:29:51 --> 03:29:57
well I haven't really seen him for like
03:29:54 --> 03:29:59
three years so like how many more times
03:29:57 --> 03:30:00
do we have that we see each other yeah
03:29:59 --> 03:30:02
do you believe that like friends just
03:30:01 --> 03:30:06
slowly disappear from your life like
03:30:03 --> 03:30:07
they kind of your friend group evolves
03:30:06 --> 03:30:08
right so like it does it does like you
03:30:08 --> 03:30:10
don't want to there's a problem with
03:30:09 --> 03:30:12
Facebook you get all these old friends
03:30:10 --> 03:30:14
from school like when you were 10 years
03:30:12 --> 03:30:16
old back when Facebook started like you
03:30:14 --> 03:30:17
don't really you would friend them and
03:30:16 --> 03:30:18
then you're like why are we in touch
03:30:18 --> 03:30:22
again just keep the memories there you
03:30:19 --> 03:30:23
know like it's different life now yeah I
03:30:22 --> 03:30:25
have you know I don't that might be a
03:30:24 --> 03:30:27
guy thing or I don't know there's
03:30:25 --> 03:30:29
certain friends I have that like we
03:30:27 --> 03:30:32
don't interact often but we're still
03:30:29 --> 03:30:34
friends yeah like I every time I see
03:30:33 --> 03:30:37
him I think it's because we have a
03:30:35 --> 03:30:39
foundation of many shared experiences
03:30:37 --> 03:30:41
and many memories like I it's like
03:30:40 --> 03:30:43
nothing has changed like we've been
03:30:42 --> 03:30:45
almost like we've been talking every day
03:30:43 --> 03:30:48
even if we haven't talked for a year
03:30:45 --> 03:30:49
yeah so that like yeah that's deep yeah
03:30:48 --> 03:30:50
so that so I don't have to be
03:30:49 --> 03:30:51
interacting with them for them to be in
03:30:51 --> 03:30:55
a friend group and then there's some
03:30:52 --> 03:30:57
people I interact with a lot so it's it
03:30:56 --> 03:31:01
it depends but there's just this network
03:30:58 --> 03:31:03
of good human beings that
03:31:01 --> 03:31:06
can I have like a real love for them and
03:31:04 --> 03:31:09
I I can always count on them if like if
03:31:07 --> 03:31:12
any of them called me in the middle of
03:31:09 --> 03:31:13
the night I'll get rid of a body you
03:31:12 --> 03:31:15
know I'm
03:31:13 --> 03:31:17
there I like how that's a different
03:31:15 --> 03:31:19
definition of friendship but it's true
03:31:18 --> 03:31:23
it's true true friend you've become more
03:31:20 --> 03:31:24
and more famous recently how's that uh
03:31:23 --> 03:31:27
affect you it's not recently it's this
03:31:25 --> 03:31:30
gradual thing right like it keeps keeps
03:31:28 --> 03:31:34
going and uh and I also don't know why
03:31:31 --> 03:31:36
it keeps going does that put pressure on
03:31:34 --> 03:31:38
you to cuz you're pretty open on Twitter
03:31:36 --> 03:31:42
and you're just like basically building
03:31:38 --> 03:31:43
shit in the open yeah and just not
03:31:42 --> 03:31:46
really caring if it's too technical if
03:31:44 --> 03:31:47
it's any of this just being out there
03:31:46 --> 03:31:49
does it put pressure on you as you
03:31:47 --> 03:31:53
become more popular to be a little bit
03:31:49 --> 03:31:56
more like collected and man I think the
03:31:54 --> 03:31:59
opposite right like because the people I
03:31:57 --> 03:32:00
follow are interesting because they say
03:31:59 --> 03:32:02
whatever they think and they and they
03:32:01 --> 03:32:05
ship or whatever it's so boring that
03:32:03 --> 03:32:06
people start tweeting only about one
03:32:05 --> 03:32:07
topic yeah I don't know anything about
03:32:07 --> 03:32:09
their personal life I want to know about
03:32:08 --> 03:32:10
their personal life like you do podcast
03:32:09 --> 03:32:11
you ask about LIF stuff about
03:32:10 --> 03:32:13
personality that's the most interesting
03:32:12 --> 03:32:16
part of like business or sports like
03:32:14 --> 03:32:17
what's the behind this for the athlete
03:32:16 --> 03:32:19
right behind the entrepreneur that's
03:32:17 --> 03:32:21
interesting stuff to be human yeah like
03:32:20 --> 03:32:24
you you share that you know like I Shar
03:32:22 --> 03:32:25
the Tweet went too far but like we were
03:32:24 --> 03:32:27
cleaning the toilet because the toilet
03:32:25 --> 03:32:28
was clogged you know but like it's just
03:32:27 --> 03:32:30
real stuff because Jansen hang the
03:32:29 --> 03:32:32
Nvidia guy he says he started cleaning
03:32:31 --> 03:32:35
toilets you know that was cool you you
03:32:33 --> 03:32:38
tweeted something about the the Denny's
03:32:35 --> 03:32:41
thing I forget yeah it was recent Nvidia
03:32:38 --> 03:32:42
was started in a Denny Diner uh table
03:32:41 --> 03:32:45
and you made it somehow profound you're
03:32:43 --> 03:32:47
almost yeah this one this one uh Nvidia
03:32:45 --> 03:32:50
three $3 trillion company was started in
03:32:48 --> 03:32:52
a Denny's an American Diner people need
03:32:50 --> 03:32:53
a third space to work on their laptops
03:32:52 --> 03:32:55
to build the next billion or trillion
03:32:54 --> 03:32:58
dollar company what's the first and
03:32:55 --> 03:32:59
second space the home office and the in
03:32:58 --> 03:33:02
between the island I guess yeah the
03:33:00 --> 03:33:04
island yeah you need a space to like
03:33:02 --> 03:33:06
congregate man and I found history on
03:33:04 --> 03:33:09
this so 400 years ago in the coffee hous
03:33:07 --> 03:33:12
of Europe the like the Scientific
03:33:09 --> 03:33:13
Revolution the enlightenment happened
03:33:12 --> 03:33:14
because they would go to coffee houses
03:33:14 --> 03:33:17
they would sit there they would drink
03:33:15 --> 03:33:18
coffee and they would work they would
03:33:17 --> 03:33:20
work they would write or they would and
03:33:19 --> 03:33:23
they would do debates and they would
03:33:20 --> 03:33:24
organize Marine routes right they would
03:33:23 --> 03:33:27
do all the stuff in coffee houses in
03:33:25 --> 03:33:30
Europe in France in Austria in UK in
03:33:28 --> 03:33:32
Holland so we would always be going to
03:33:30 --> 03:33:34
we were always going to cafes to to work
03:33:32 --> 03:33:36
and to have serendipitous conversations
03:33:35 --> 03:33:40
with other people and start businesses
03:33:37 --> 03:33:42
and stuff and when I like you asked me
03:33:40 --> 03:33:43
to come on here and we flew to America
03:33:42 --> 03:33:46
and the first thing I realized was that
03:33:44 --> 03:33:48
I've been to America before but but we
03:33:46 --> 03:33:49
were in this Cafe and like there's a lot
03:33:48 --> 03:33:51
of laptops everybody's working on
03:33:50 --> 03:33:54
something and I made I took this photo
03:33:52 --> 03:33:56
um and then when you're in Europe like
03:33:54 --> 03:33:58
large parts of Europe now you can't you
03:33:56 --> 03:34:01
cannot use a laptop anymore it's like no
03:33:59 --> 03:34:05
laptop which I understand but that is to
03:34:02 --> 03:34:08
you a fundamental place to create shit
03:34:05 --> 03:34:10
is in that natural organic uh co-working
03:34:08 --> 03:34:11
space of a coffee for a lot of people a
03:34:10 --> 03:34:14
lot of people have very small homes and
03:34:12 --> 03:34:15
co-working spaces are kind of boring
03:34:14 --> 03:34:17
they're kind they're not very they're
03:34:16 --> 03:34:20
private they're not
03:34:18 --> 03:34:22
serendipitous kind of boring um cafes
03:34:21 --> 03:34:24
are amazing because they random people
03:34:23 --> 03:34:26
can come in and ask you what are you
03:34:24 --> 03:34:27
working on or you know and not just left
03:34:26 --> 03:34:28
those people are also having
03:34:28 --> 03:34:30
conversations like they did 400 years
03:34:29 --> 03:34:33
ago debates or whatever things are
03:34:30 --> 03:34:34
happening and man I understand the the
03:34:33 --> 03:34:37
Aesthetics of it like it's like oh
03:34:35 --> 03:34:38
startup bro shipping his uh bullshit
03:34:37 --> 03:34:40
startup you know
03:34:39 --> 03:34:42
like but there's something more there
03:34:41 --> 03:34:45
like there's people actually making
03:34:42 --> 03:34:46
stuff making new companies that the
03:34:45 --> 03:34:49
society benefits from like we're we're
03:34:47 --> 03:34:51
benefiting from Nvidia I think as the US
03:34:49 --> 03:34:53
GDP for sure is benefiting from Nvidia
03:34:51 --> 03:34:55
European GDP could benefit if we build
03:34:53 --> 03:34:58
more companies and I feel in Europe
03:34:56 --> 03:35:00
there's this Vibe and this you have to
03:34:58 --> 03:35:01
connect things but not not allowing
03:35:00 --> 03:35:03
laptops and cafes is kind of like part
03:35:02 --> 03:35:05
of the vibe which is like yeah we're not
03:35:04 --> 03:35:07
really here to work we're here to like
03:35:05 --> 03:35:08
enjoy life I agree with this Anthony
03:35:07 --> 03:35:10
bdan like this tweet was quote tweeted
03:35:09 --> 03:35:13
Anthony Bain photo with him with
03:35:11 --> 03:35:15
cigarettes and a coffee in France and he
03:35:13 --> 03:35:17
said that's this is what cafes are for I
03:35:15 --> 03:35:20
agree but there is some element of like
03:35:18 --> 03:35:22
entrepreneurship like you have to allow
03:35:21 --> 03:35:24
people to dream big and work their ass
03:35:22 --> 03:35:25
off to to towards that dream and then
03:35:24 --> 03:35:27
feel each other's energy as they
03:35:26 --> 03:35:29
interact with that's one of the things I
03:35:27 --> 03:35:31
liked in Silicon Valley when I was uh
03:35:29 --> 03:35:33
working there is like the cafes like
03:35:32 --> 03:35:35
there's a bunch of dreamers that there
03:35:34 --> 03:35:36
you can make fun of them for like
03:35:35 --> 03:35:37
everybody thinks they're going to build
03:35:36 --> 03:35:39
a trillion dollar company but like yeah
03:35:38 --> 03:35:41
and it's a not everybody wins 99% of
03:35:40 --> 03:35:43
people will be bullshit but they working
03:35:42 --> 03:35:45
their ass off yeah they're doing
03:35:43 --> 03:35:47
something and and you need to past this
03:35:46 --> 03:35:50
startup bro like oh it's startup Lev no
03:35:48 --> 03:35:51
it's not it's people making cool shit
03:35:50 --> 03:35:53
yeah and this will benefit you because
03:35:51 --> 03:35:54
this will create jobs for your com your
03:35:53 --> 03:35:58
your country in your region and I think
03:35:55 --> 03:35:59
in Europe um that's a big problem like
03:35:58 --> 03:36:02
we have a very
03:36:00 --> 03:36:05
anti- um entrepreneurial mind dream big
03:36:03 --> 03:36:08
and build shit this is really inspiring
03:36:05 --> 03:36:10
this is pin tweet of yours all the
03:36:08 --> 03:36:11
projects that you've tried and the ones
03:36:10 --> 03:36:14
that
03:36:12 --> 03:36:18
succeeded has very few mute life it was
03:36:15 --> 03:36:21
for Twitter to mute uh to share the mute
03:36:18 --> 03:36:25
list your uh mute words fire calculator
03:36:22 --> 03:36:28
no more Google maker rank how much is my
03:36:25 --> 03:36:30
site project worth climate finder ideas
03:36:29 --> 03:36:32
AI Airline list still runs but it's
03:36:31 --> 03:36:34
doesn't make money Airline list like
03:36:33 --> 03:36:37
compares the safety of Airlines CU I was
03:36:35 --> 03:36:39
nervous to fly so I was like let's
03:36:37 --> 03:36:43
collect all the data on crashes for all
03:36:39 --> 03:36:48
the airplanes BC cable nice that's
03:36:44 --> 03:36:51
awesome uh Village NORAD gear 3D and
03:36:48 --> 03:36:53
virtual reality Dev play play my inbox
03:36:51 --> 03:36:54
like you mentioned there's a lot of
03:36:53 --> 03:36:56
stuff yeah man I'm trying to find some
03:36:55 --> 03:36:58
embarrassing tweets of yours you can go
03:36:57 --> 03:37:01
to the highlights tab it has all the
03:36:58 --> 03:37:04
like the good shit kind of there you go
03:37:01 --> 03:37:08
this was Dubai POV building an AI
03:37:05 --> 03:37:10
startup wow you're a real
03:37:08 --> 03:37:11
influencer and people copy this photo
03:37:10 --> 03:37:14
now and they they change the screenshots
03:37:12 --> 03:37:15
it becomes like a meme of course you
03:37:14 --> 03:37:18
know
03:37:16 --> 03:37:20
this is good this how Dubai looks it's
03:37:19 --> 03:37:23
insane that's beautiful architecture
03:37:21 --> 03:37:25
wise it's crazy the story is behind this
03:37:23 --> 03:37:26
story behind for sure so this is about
03:37:25 --> 03:37:28
the European economy where like European
03:37:27 --> 03:37:31
economy landscape is ran by dinosaurs
03:37:29 --> 03:37:35
and today I studied it so I can produce
03:37:31 --> 03:37:37
you with my evidence 80% of top EU
03:37:35 --> 03:37:40
companies were founded before 1950 only
03:37:38 --> 03:37:43
36% of top us companies were founded
03:37:41 --> 03:37:45
before 1950 yeah so the median founding
03:37:43 --> 03:37:48
of companies in US is something like
03:37:46 --> 03:37:51
1960 and IM Med median the top companies
03:37:48 --> 03:37:53
right and IM median in Europe is like
03:37:51 --> 03:37:56
1900 or something yeah so it's um here
03:37:54 --> 03:38:00
1914 and 1963 so there a 50-year
03:37:57 --> 03:38:01
difference it's a good um representation
03:38:00 --> 03:38:03
of the very thing you were talking about
03:38:02 --> 03:38:05
the diff difference in the cultures
03:38:03 --> 03:38:06
entrepreneurial Spirit of the peoples
03:38:06 --> 03:38:09
but Europe used to be entrepreneurial
03:38:07 --> 03:38:12
like there was companies found in 1800
03:38:09 --> 03:38:15
1850 1900 it flipped like around 1950
03:38:13 --> 03:38:17
where America took the lead and uh and I
03:38:16 --> 03:38:18
guess my point is like I hope that
03:38:17 --> 03:38:20
Europe gets back to because I'm European
03:38:18 --> 03:38:22
I hope that Europe gets back to being an
03:38:20 --> 03:38:24
entrepreneurial culture where they build
03:38:22 --> 03:38:26
big companies again because right now
03:38:24 --> 03:38:28
the all the old dinosaur companies
03:38:27 --> 03:38:30
control the economies they're lobbying
03:38:28 --> 03:38:31
with the government they're Europe is
03:38:30 --> 03:38:33
also that's like they're infiltrated
03:38:32 --> 03:38:35
with the government where they create so
03:38:34 --> 03:38:38
much regulation like I think it's called
03:38:36 --> 03:38:40
regulatory capture right where it's very
03:38:38 --> 03:38:41
hard for a newcomer to join to enter an
03:38:41 --> 03:38:43
industry because there's too much
03:38:42 --> 03:38:45
regulation so actually regulation is
03:38:43 --> 03:38:46
very good for big companies because they
03:38:45 --> 03:38:48
can follow it I can't follow it right if
03:38:47 --> 03:38:50
I want to start a AI startup in Europe
03:38:49 --> 03:38:52
now I cannot because there's an AI
03:38:51 --> 03:38:54
regulation that makes it very
03:38:52 --> 03:38:55
complicated for me I probably need to
03:38:54 --> 03:38:56
get like notaries involved I need to get
03:38:56 --> 03:38:59
certificates
03:38:57 --> 03:39:01
licenses um whereas in America I can
03:39:00 --> 03:39:06
just open my laptop I can started AI
03:39:02 --> 03:39:07
started right now um mostly you know
03:39:06 --> 03:39:09
what do you think about eak effective
03:39:07 --> 03:39:12
accelerationist movement man you had
03:39:09 --> 03:39:14
Beth jzos on I I love Beth jzos and um
03:39:13 --> 03:39:18
he's amazing and I think iok is is very
03:39:15 --> 03:39:20
needed to similarly create a more
03:39:18 --> 03:39:22
positive uh outlook on the future like
03:39:20 --> 03:39:25
because people people have been very
03:39:23 --> 03:39:28
pessimistic um about Society about the
03:39:26 --> 03:39:33
future of society um you know climate
03:39:29 --> 03:39:34
change all this stuff uh eok is like is
03:39:33 --> 03:39:36
a positive outlook in the future it's
03:39:34 --> 03:39:38
like technology can make us you know we
03:39:36 --> 03:39:39
need to spend more energy we should find
03:39:38 --> 03:39:42
ways to of course get like clean energy
03:39:40 --> 03:39:44
but we need to spend more energy to make
03:39:42 --> 03:39:46
cooler stuff and you know go into space
03:39:44 --> 03:39:48
and build more technology that can
03:39:47 --> 03:39:51
improve society and we shouldn't shy
03:39:49 --> 03:39:53
away from technology technology can be
03:39:51 --> 03:39:56
the answer for many things yeah build
03:39:53 --> 03:39:58
more don't spend so much time on uh
03:39:57 --> 03:40:01
fear-mongering and cautiousness and all
03:39:59 --> 03:40:03
this kind of stuff some is okay some was
03:40:01 --> 03:40:05
good but most of the time should be
03:40:04 --> 03:40:09
spent on building and creating on like
03:40:05 --> 03:40:10
and doing so unapologetically it's a
03:40:09 --> 03:40:13
it's a refreshing reminder what made
03:40:11 --> 03:40:14
United States great is all the builders
03:40:13 --> 03:40:16
like you said the entrepreneurs like we
03:40:15 --> 03:40:18
can't forget that in in all the sort of
03:40:17 --> 03:40:19
discussions of how things could go wrong
03:40:18 --> 03:40:20
with technology and all this kind of
03:40:19 --> 03:40:21
stuff yeah it goes SC look at China
03:40:21 --> 03:40:24
China is now at the stage of like
03:40:22 --> 03:40:27
America what like 1900 or something
03:40:24 --> 03:40:29
they're building rapidly like insane and
03:40:28 --> 03:40:31
obviously China has massive problems but
03:40:30 --> 03:40:33
that comes with the whole thing that
03:40:31 --> 03:40:34
comes America and this beginning also
03:40:33 --> 03:40:36
massive problems right
03:40:35 --> 03:40:39
um
03:40:36 --> 03:40:41
but I think it's very very dangerous for
03:40:39 --> 03:40:43
a country or region like Europe to you
03:40:41 --> 03:40:44
you you get to this point where you're
03:40:44 --> 03:40:46
kind of complacent you're kind of
03:40:44 --> 03:40:47
comfort
03:40:46 --> 03:40:50
and then you know you can either go this
03:40:48 --> 03:40:51
or you can go this way right you're from
03:40:50 --> 03:40:53
here you go like this and then you can
03:40:51 --> 03:40:57
go this or this I think you should go
03:40:53 --> 03:41:00
this way and uh OB yeah go up and and
03:40:58 --> 03:41:03
uh I think it's the problem is the the
03:41:01 --> 03:41:06
the Mind culture so eok I made eok which
03:41:04 --> 03:41:07
is like the European kind of version um
03:41:06 --> 03:41:09
I made like hoodies and stuff so a lot
03:41:07 --> 03:41:12
of people wear like this this make your
03:41:09 --> 03:41:13
grade again head um I made it red first
03:41:12 --> 03:41:15
but it became too like Trump so now it's
03:41:14 --> 03:41:18
more like you're being blue you know
03:41:16 --> 03:41:20
make Europe great
03:41:18 --> 03:41:24
again all right
03:41:21 --> 03:41:27
um okay so you had a incredible
03:41:25 --> 03:41:28
life very successful built a lot of cool
03:41:28 --> 03:41:32
stuff so what advice would you give to
03:41:29 --> 03:41:33
young people about how to do the same
03:41:32 --> 03:41:35
man I would listen to like nobody just
03:41:33 --> 03:41:38
do what you think is good and follow
03:41:35 --> 03:41:39
your heart right like uh everybody peer
03:41:38 --> 03:41:42
presses you into doing stuff you don't
03:41:40 --> 03:41:44
want to do and like they tell you like
03:41:42 --> 03:41:46
parents or family and society and tell
03:41:45 --> 03:41:49
you but like try your own thing you know
03:41:47 --> 03:41:50
because it probably it might work out
03:41:49 --> 03:41:52
you can you can steer the ship you know
03:41:51 --> 03:41:54
it probably doesn't work out immediately
03:41:53 --> 03:41:57
you probably go into very bad times like
03:41:55 --> 03:41:58
I did as well relatively right but in
03:41:57 --> 03:42:00
the end if you're smart about it you can
03:41:59 --> 03:42:02
make things work and you you can create
03:42:00 --> 03:42:04
your own little life of things as you
03:42:02 --> 03:42:06
did you know as I did and I think that
03:42:05 --> 03:42:08
should be more promoted like Do Your Own
03:42:07 --> 03:42:11
Thing there's space in economy and in
03:42:08 --> 03:42:12
society for do your own thing you know
03:42:11 --> 03:42:14
yeah it's like um you know like little
03:42:13 --> 03:42:16
Villages everybody would sell I would
03:42:14 --> 03:42:17
sell bread you would sell meat every can
03:42:16 --> 03:42:20
do their own little thing you don't need
03:42:18 --> 03:42:23
to you know be a Normy as you say you
03:42:21 --> 03:42:26
you you um you can you can be what you
03:42:23 --> 03:42:28
really want to be you know and like go
03:42:26 --> 03:42:30
all out doing that thing yeah you got to
03:42:28 --> 03:42:32
go all out cuz if you do if you have
03:42:30 --> 03:42:35
assets you cannot succeed you got you
03:42:33 --> 03:42:38
need to go lean into the to the outcast
03:42:36 --> 03:42:41
stuff lean into the um being different
03:42:39 --> 03:42:43
and and just doing whatever it is that
03:42:41 --> 03:42:45
you want to do right you got a whole
03:42:43 --> 03:42:47
asset yeah
03:42:45 --> 03:42:49
yet this was an incredible conversation
03:42:47 --> 03:42:51
it was an honor to finally meet you it
03:42:49 --> 03:42:54
was honor to be to talk to you and uh
03:42:52 --> 03:42:57
keep doing your thing keep inspiring me
03:42:54 --> 03:42:58
and uh the world with all the cool stuff
03:42:57 --> 03:43:00
you're building thank you Matt thanks
03:42:59 --> 03:43:02
for listening to this conversation with
03:43:00 --> 03:43:04
Peter levels to support this podcast
03:43:03 --> 03:43:07
please check out our sponsors in the
03:43:05 --> 03:43:10
description and now let me leave you
03:43:07 --> 03:43:13
with some words from Drew hon Dropbox
03:43:10 --> 03:43:16
co-founder by the way I love
03:43:13 --> 03:43:20
Dropbox anyway Drew said don't worry
03:43:17 --> 03:43:23
about failure you only have to be right
03:43:21 --> 03:43:27
once thank you for listening and hope to
03:43:23 --> 03:43:26
see you next time
comments
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See below for timestamps, transcript, and to give feedback, submit questions, contact Lex, etc.
0:00 - Introduction
2:03 - Startup philosophy
9:34 - Low points
13:03 - 12 startups in 12 months
19:55 - Traveling and depression
32:34 - Indie hacking
36:37 - Photo AI
1:12:53 - How to learn AI
1:21:30 - Robots
1:29:47 - Hoodmaps
1:53:52 - Learning new programming languages
2:03:24 - Monetize your website
2:09:59 - Fighting SPAM
2:13:33 - Automation
2:24:58 - When to sell startup
2:27:52 - Coding solo
2:33:54 - Ship fast
2:42:38 - Best IDE for programming
2:52:09 - Andrej Karpathy
3:01:34 - Productivity
3:15:21 - Minimalism
3:24:07 - Emails
3:31:20 - Coffee
3:39:05 - E/acc
3:41:21 - Advice for young people
Transcript:
https://lexfridman.com/pieter-levels-transcript
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@TheRockinBK: Wowwww this is the most unexpected guest in the best way possible!
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@SageAwakens: This man ships so fast that he speaks at 1.5x speed by default.
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@parsabushehri5488: didn't expect levelsio to be on the pod
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@remsee1608: Not a guy you need to listen at 1.25x speed
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@ExistentialSadness: As someone who works at a small startup right now as a self-taught developer, this podcast is gold. Thanks!
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@nisargjoshi8236: OMG! levelsio made it big! This is insane! Congrats man!
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@starterstory: Here before 1B views
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@nickgray: I love this guy! He is SUPER smart and actually a MAKER and a DOER online with the build in public crowd. Outspoken, smart, and kind
(like by 5 other users)
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@sucim: Pieter Levels is the real deal! He is just unapologetically himself!
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@sumitrana8114: Okay now this is exactly what i was looking for. Pieter Levels with Lex omg 😂 maybe one day Lex i will sit down with you as well. You are one of the people I would love to meet along with Pieter.
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@shinchima: No way! Pieter Levels! Cool - Lex you've some pull
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@Stopwars0809: thiel on jre and pieter here in a week. we are so back!
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@dustinoverbeck: Recent Lex guests:
Huberman, Ivanka Trump, Elon Musk…and our favorite Twitter nerd: Peter Levels.
E’erybody chant: “one of us! One of us!”🎉😂🎉
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@dmurawsky: I'm just finishing up a demo video for a AI startup product so this was perfect timing to motivate me! Thanks Lex and Pieter!
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@t3dotgg: Omg Levels!!! Cool to see our application developer world getting more love 🙏
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@oxmodius: Been following this guy for awhile on X, love his content. Shows that it really is possible to make serious money with a one man show
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@granadamusic: this is the like button of respect for levelsio
👇🏻
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@MACKYdubzz: I bought his book yesterday haha. This is gonna be good.
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@romandorofejev9962: When Pavel Durov?? Can't wait ❤
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@DomskiPlays: GIGA unexpected collab, hell yeah!
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@providenceifeosame6126: i had to reduce the playback speed to 0.75 🤣... Levels is the first person to ever make me do that on youtube
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@vincentd2418: HELL YEAH!! Pieter Levels, let's goooooooooo! I'm building an AI startup solo, currently at $5K MRR. Much respect for that man, been following since 2016 when I was working at a soul-sucking 9-to-5!!
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@kikeatun5: When you think Lex can't get any better he hit you with exactly with the content that you didn't know you need it, but you did ❤
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@brunodangelo1146: Lex Fridman podcast about AI, LETS GOOO!
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@jakebarrera5070: The best ever! An inspiration for many, Pieter! No BS, just actions.
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@matten_zero: Wow! The entrepreneur extraordinare!
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@Pete_YT: Levels is a legend
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@mouadse: Levelsio the arifryer and deadlift king ❤lot of energy and inspiration in this ep.
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@DailyDoseofBarks: most unexpected guest in a while
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@robro8: the GOAT levels changed my life maybe 5-6 years ago through his tweets/inspo/learnings about business and i will forever be grateful. THANK YOU Pieter!
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@otabek_kholmirzaev: Startup legend is up here!
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@s.deepaksrinivas9292: Haven't seen Lex this comfortable and open with any other guest!
@levelsio FTW
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@goldmundchen: i like this dude. he's real
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@diego0014: The colab i didnt know I wanted 🎉
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@kalpitveerwalyt: Good stuff, have interacted with Pieter -he is a legit cool guy
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@ciprianchirilov1039: There are Levels to this AI game!
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@GillGrossPredictionTracker: I bet my entire life savings guy will be a billionaire by the end of the decade.
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@another-story-podcast: Levels the 🐐
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@christopher6267: this is nuts 😂 congrats levels
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@mbvlabs: Guess I’ll have to not sleep tonight and see this one! First time I’ve been excited for a podcast in a long time🔥
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@Vrilogs: Taking inspiration from Levelsio, to be a Indie Hacker soon!
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@bruce0750: There only thing I care about this guy: money and freedom to travel. He was one of the reasons why I became an engineer.
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@HarryDry: This guy is awesome. First podcast Ima listen to in a few months!
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@Asmonix: Levelsio is the man that made me believe that you can create new cool stuff like Leonardo Da Vinci in his prime
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@ZevUhuru: LFGGGGGGG. Levels is like my idol, literally pushed me to level up my Indie Hacking game.
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@isaac10231: This guy is a total gigachad
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@Manoeuver: ho..ly shit! the collab we didn't know we needed. No fucking way, I literally twitched when I saw the thumbnail
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@johanvander6193: I approve this interview, even without seeing it yet.
One of my favorite X - posters at Lex Fridman, let's go!!!
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@DAJakaRedAries: After this video, Bali's coffee shops are gonna be overrun with digital nomads lol
